31% of Taiwanese earn less than NT$30,000


#161

Did he start his own business , just curious.
I know plenty of business owners too.

There are plenty of rich families in the center and south but but most of their businesses were founded many decades ago.

In the UK and in the US the managers of the companies I have worked for often drove very nice cars. In Singapore they drive audis, bmws etc.

Almost never happens here because wealth tends to be hyper concentrated in owners/chairman’s hands.


#162

I never said starting a business is easy, I’ve tried for 3 years and failed put a lot of blood sweat and tears into it so I know how hard and risky it is. And yes a lot of money was lost.

I also worked very hard to add to my talents though working for a someone, through my own merit without help from family or connections or favors. I earn close to 200k NTD a month with a western company managing a local office here and I have put into effect higher wages for our employees here about 2x the wages they’d normally get from local companies. The returns they’ve created are well worth it. TW has a good work force they’re just getting shafted by their huge corporate employers who drain the life out of them for peanuts.

Paying more definitely goes the extra mile for me as good employees are eager, loyal and driven to try harder when they feel more financially secure. The investment works great for the company, as we get it back in spades, esp considering how low the wages are to begin with vs cost of living.

Taiwans big Tech Corps can easily invest in their employees, but they dont care about Taiwan-race to the bottom while their CEO buys another Rolls Royce and more KTV hookers with the piles of cash they’re sitting on while justifying paying 22k due to “the market” and they can just as well set up in China if the government here complains.

Of course talented people should get paid more, but at what point does one stop and say WTF? 22k? 18k? 14k?

I’m also NOT one to think Min. wage needs to be raised to 15/hr across the US either
Also not a big fan of hand outs for the poor in most circumstances.
but whats happening here is close to slave labor wages even against cost of living


#163

I was a wage slave in a Taiwanese company for two years but I never carped about conditions or wages because I was there to learn. It’s also not in my DNA to believe that anyone owes me anything other than what’s agreed to. I watched and learned how the system worked and then made my own opportunities.

One thing I learned is that the fundamental reason Taiwanese bosses are bad bosses is not because they’re cheap, which they are, but because they have no vision. That lack of vision makes them bottom feeders and working for them makes you a bottom feeder too. So it’s no use carping about how bad working for a Hon Hai is because with its 2-3% bottom feeding profit margin if it ever did start paying its employees a living wage it would soon be out of business.

Only a boss with vision like you’ll find in North America or Europe will see the true value of his or her employees and pay them accordingly and moaning and whining about fairness has nothing to do with that calculation.


#164

It can be more than that. They also don’t hire, listen to or place faith in others to take responsibility in the success of the company. They don’t want equals or experts, they want order takers.

I know nothing about Hon Hai but many companies I have seen here are very much like this.


#165

Did you start your own business eventually?


#166

Yes.


#167

I think just the opposite, the Taiwanese slave worker should moan more instead of accept their fate like the complaint education system has made them. The big corporate entities moan loudly and grease the wheels of governments through lobbying, lawyers and buddying with govt officials to have favorable laws, grants, and projects with govt money run through their ledgers.

Some who are fit to do so should start their own businesses, and many do. We need a return to the days of more small businesses instead of laws and governments that favor huge conglomerate corporations. Though as the current economy stands its difficult to succeed that way as 90% will fail and currently the majority of workers starting a business wont work in our present day economy unless it changes


#168

they should moan, but also do something about it if the situation isn’t going to improve such as get a new job. report to labour standards, ect ect.


#169

Oh definitely, no one likes someone who just complains but takes no further action to better their station. My point is for the level of injustice its eerily quiet. I specifically mean people not making min wages but above that what should be the almost non existent, “middle class”, theres plenty of protests for that all the time everywhere.


#170

Starting a business is easy. Making money consistently is not. Hence not everybody can or should start a business.

Also business people are just business people making money for themselves mainly not some kind of heroes.

If China invaded they wouldn’t be any use.
When the air is black with soot they are no help…When an epidemic occurs who are dealing with it. I can think of a lot more inspirational people than the average business person.


#171

yea, its cultural imo. cultural masochism.

i find it insane how some taiwanese work the way they do all the while receiving zero benefits from it and just keep their head down as if its going to change. i think theres a lot of brainwashing involved from the bosses too.


#172

Brainwashing starts in school, continues in military, by the time they enter the workforce with the stagnant economy (17 years straight…definitely a record for Asia) they are already mostly beaten down.

Seriously how many countries can you find like Taiwan where the economy has been consistently poor for almost 20 years!

That my friends is the real problem .


#173

The Taiwanese worker thinks like this:
I work, you pay, that’s it. You tell me what to do, I do that, nothing more. I don’t need to think.
I don’t need to like you or your business, for me it’s just a deal.


#174

Like any unsensible reality, this one should render a sensible explanation. Why the Taiwanese gain so little while they put in so much?

I believe these are the main causes:

  1. The Central Bank has artificially kept Taiwan dollar weak.

You could easily infer many negative effects of this practice. High cost in purchasing research equipments, hiring global talents, attending international conferences, … etc is one.

  1. Looting, subtle as well as galant, by the Chinese Nationalist elites.

You may trace the crimes starting from the constant re-pavement of road and never-successful re-planting of trees in front of your residence.

If you get a full tank of oil and can only drive for a few miles, check the leak!


#175

If you put oil in your tank, you won’t make it that far. Unless you’re driving a diesel…


#176

I think you can find many examples.


#177

Uh… Japan?


#178

I think they are doing less of that now that they have been called out by the US government and put on a watch list. In 2015 they intervened almost daily.

EDIT:


#179

Yeah Japan was rich first and is still rich and Abenomics has been fairly successful. Apart from Japan though where?

Taiwan has just been on a Debbie downer for a long time


#180

Italy? Hong Kong?