And yet again...another shooting rampage in the USA


#1

edition.cnn.com/2015/07/24/us/lo … ?sr=cnnifb

Do we need to start a separate forum for this subject?

3 dead including the gunman (suicide) and 7 injured.

Yes you big dummies, you have the right to bear arms. Good for you.


#2

[quote=“Toe Save”]http://edition.CNN.com/2015/07/24/us/louisiana-theater-shooting/index.html?sr=cnnifb

Do we need to start a separate forum for this subject?

3 dead including the gunman (suicide) and 7 injured.

Yes you big dummies, you have the right to bear arms. Good for you.[/quote]

Why even bother posting about this anymore? Take it as read Americans are going to be shooting each other up for all eternity. Stupid is as stupid does.


#3

[quote=“the bear”][quote=“Toe Save”]http://edition.CNN.com/2015/07/24/us/louisiana-theater-shooting/index.html?sr=cnnifb

Do we need to start a separate forum for this subject?

3 dead including the gunman (suicide) and 7 injured.

Yes you big dummies, you have the right to bear arms. Good for you.[/quote]

Why even bother posting about this anymore? Take it as read Americans are going to be shooting each other up for all eternity. Stupid is as stupid does.[/quote]

Check this out: vox.com/2015/6/25/8836735/ma … sandy-hook


#4

[quote=“Toe Save”][quote=“the bear”][quote=“Toe Save”]http://edition.CNN.com/2015/07/24/us/louisiana-theater-shooting/index.html?sr=cnnifb

Do we need to start a separate forum for this subject?

3 dead including the gunman (suicide) and 7 injured.

Yes you big dummies, you have the right to bear arms. Good for you.[/quote]

Why even bother posting about this anymore? Take it as read Americans are going to be shooting each other up for all eternity. Stupid is as stupid does.[/quote]

Check this out: vox.com/2015/6/25/8836735/ma … sandy-hook[/quote]

Some of the farming states in the mid-north need to up their game, looks like.


#5

A mass shooting in anywhere else in the world = a shocking tragedy that rarely happens.
A mass shooting in America = another weekend.

:s


#6

Is Iraq “in the world”? On the other hand, it was America that opened the Pandora’s Box there so maybe there’s a connection.


#7

Does murdering two other people constitue a mass killing?


#8

Definition of a mass murderer:
A mass murderer kills four or more people at one location during one continuous period of time, whether it is a few minutes or over a period of days.
I guess 3 isn’t quite enough.

Ok sorry. Anywhere else in the world that isn’t a warzone.


#9

Too late to do anything about guns now. The right to bear arms is too deeply engrained in the American psyche, the gun makers have too powerful a lobby, and there are simply too many guns out there for the government to get them all back even if laws were passed to make owning guns illegal.


#10

The right to own slaves was also deeply engrained in the American psyche. When you stop believing change is possible you stop being human.


#11

Hmm, owning slaves and owning guns sure have a lot in common…not.

Are you American? Have you lived here for an extended period of time? What i said reflects the reality. I would love to have a gun free America but its not happening. You must be confused about hoping for change and believing in change.


#12

America doesn’t need to get rid of guns. They need to make the penalty so severe that committing a crime at gun point is removal from society. Permanently. That’s step one. Step 2 is an intense psychological evaluation for the right to bear an arm or two. Not at all an insurmountable problem. Just takes the will to write such laws. That’s the beauty of America, on paper. But the lobbyists control the lawmakers. I’m pretty sure the will of the people would elect any official who worked towards the end I’ve proposed.


#13

I have a few questions on this regard.

After the civil wars in Central America, they thought they wouldn’t be able to recall the armament. And we are talking about AK 47s, rocket launchers, the works. True, some criminal elements did use the AKs afterwards to attack and steal from people, but currently, they have the newest weapons imported from the US. Stuff far heavier and nastier than anything seen during the wars. Except the land mines, which they are still removing. But most of the old stuff rotted and was used for sculptures or was resold/exchanged… they faded away from the hands of the common people. Even now, with the levels of crime, people find it hard to grab a gun, let alone something bigger. Most guns have been used in tragic mistakes -children as victims- or neighbor/traffic disputes -again, senseless tragedies, not heroics against bad people.

I understand the cultural element in US psyche but the underlying concept is being at war. Who is the US population at war with? When you ask them, they say they cannot trust the government, the police. So, basically, it is the right to arm yourself to overthrow your government, more than to defend yourself against “bad people”. If they say they want to defend themselves against intruders or anyone who is lazy and does not work hard and wants to get what they have worked so hard to obtain, then, when you press them to specify who these thieves are, things get… complicated.

And the police are armed with heavy weaponry too. Riot police with tanks. Evokes South America in the 70s. Chilean September 11. So, is the situation on the streets that bad? Are robbers and such armed with similar or better weapons? Is it already a war in the streets that everyone needs to live in a state of fear, fortifications and weapons a la Purge, as a right, constitutional right, to survive. They say they fight against terrorists, terrorist attacks in their own land. But then the would be terrorists are protected by this amendment to buy as many and as heavy weapons as they can… yet the one sthat have attacked have done so under the radar.

Why does a civilian need heavier weaponry than an AK 47? Hunting rigfles make sense in Wyoming or Montana. Elsewhere, why do you need an exploding grenade? To fish? You can defend your home effectively with a gun if you are trained. The Constitutional amendment specifically mentions groups, and one surmises groups have a purpose and hence, prepare themselves, implying some kind of training, knowing what you are doing. Yet, you have people with not one gun they know how to use, but apocalyptic preparations for the breakdown of society with an individual holding 20 to 50 high caliber rifles. Unless they are staging a revolution, how can they legally own all that? Which means cartels and whatevers civilians supposedly arm themselves against have easy access to weaponry, legally bought, in the end.

In the ol country, someone buys 20 rifles, probably is going to stage an uprising. So this right to bear arms seems to me rather than the right to pull the plug by force and violent means. From our fourth world experience, we know that these revolutions are easily manipulated and hardly ever improve anyone’s life. The heroics of a French or American revolution are romantic but hard to revive and anyone with a bit of history knowledge can tell you there was a hell of a lot bloodshed during and after, and lots of petty interests and manipulations and simply travestied justice. That there are lobbys that promote buying too dangerous weapons and obstruct attempts to regulate who can legally own them, is a travesty. And no, te excuse that the bad guys an acquire them anyway si not an excuse. No faith in the system, no gfaith in the government, no faith in the democratic rule of law is what this gun madness expresses, IMHO.


#14

[quote=“allan_chang”]

Hmm, owning slaves and owning guns sure have a lot in common…not.

Are you American? Have you lived here for an extended period of time? What I said reflects the reality. I would love to have a gun free America but its not happening. You must be confused about hoping for change and believing in change.[/quote]

if you can outlaw slavery you can outlaw private gun ownership. Its not that difficult. The legalization of gay marriage surely shows that change is possible.


#15

Sections of America glorify guns AND for some sections of the culture going to prison is very much a badge of honour. America needs to stamp out gang culture and gun culture and the ridiculous ease with which guns can be bought. How in the heck you achieve these aims is beyond my scope though. Shooting shit seems like the American way of life even though modern America is ridiculously new.


#16

[quote=“the bear”][quote]

Hmm, owning slaves and owning guns sure have a lot in common…not.

Are you American? Have you lived here for an extended period of time? What I said reflects the reality. I would love to have a gun free America but its not happening. You must be confused about hoping for change and believing in change.[/quote]

if you can outlaw slavery you can outlaw private gun ownership. Its not that difficult. The legalization of gay marriage surely shows that change is possible.[/quote]

it only took a bloody civil war to outlaw slavery. Seems bloody difficult to me. Gay marriage is about giving rights to people; its easier to give something than take it way.


#17

These shootings generally happen in gun free zones, so we need to grab all the guns. People who think this way are stupid beyond hope of redemption.

Go ahead. Try and grab them. Make Darwin’s job easier. When you’re fighting over a gun, it makes a big difference which end of the gun you have your hand on.


#18

I don’t know about you, but when I read that I don’t see anything that says there can’t be stricter background checks. I see nothing in there that talks about what type or caliber or bullet capacity of arms we’re talking about. For the life of me I can’t find the part where it says the right to bear arms extends to the Apple store or the Gap. The 2nd amendment is written in perfectly clear English.

The 2nd amendment gives people the right to bear arms, that’s it. It’s up to society in general to determine what arms they can legally bear, where they can legally bear them, how easy or hard it is to legally obtain them, what type and capacity is allowed, etc etc…

A 6 shot revolver that took a written and proficiency exam plus 90 day wait period and strict background check to obtain is still “ARMS”

Can any gun loving Americans help me out here. Can you point to the part in the 2nd amendment that gives you the right to do that? Or is it possibly just nonsensical laws that allow it? :ponder:


#19

thefreedictionary.com/infringe

But in the end, the only interpretation that matters is the one you can enforce. Casuistry is just words. It may sell snake oil, health insurance scams and hedge funds, but it won’t get far in grabbing guns.


#20

[quote=“rowland”]http://www.thefreedictionary.com/infringe

But in the end, the only interpretation that matters is the one you can enforce. Casuistry is just words. It may sell snake oil, health insurance scams and hedge funds, but it won’t get far in grabbing guns.[/quote]

OT, but nice to see you’re still around, rowland. Not seeing you in IP , I was starting to worry :bravo: