After 5 years I have accepted that this is pretty much a BS society. The majority of people I get to do with daily are lying to ones face. From mechanics to lunch box salesladies to bosses. I think once you come to terms with that, things get better. A lot has changed in 5 yrs…it really isn’t as good to work here as it used to be. I used to be able to work only 4 hours at a buxiban and it would be worth it…now you need 2 jobs or 6 hours at least to make the move to Taiwan worth it.
Many things I do is illegal, but I know and I take their money. I made peace with that. The government changes their rules every month. For a while they didn’t accept 3 yr university degrees! Every single person that teaches students under 6 is teaching illegally. But many school owners gave up their savings to open these schools, and can’t give them up because they have so much debt or signed contracts to rent the vacilities for 6 years etc. I worked in a cool school that had the whole anchiban downstairs, and all of a sudden no students were allowed in the basement.(good rule but pricey for the owners)
I came here working for Joy. Found out later that the adress on my ARC was the adress that I was working at, but my paperwork stated I worked in Shi-jr! I then went to a Kid Castle, but then it became illegal to teach small kids. To make matters worse, they seperated the anchiban from the kindy, so my adress was wrong yet again, and then I got busted at the kindy.(luckily my bosses paid a hefty fine and I got to stay) Wanted to be legal, so went to Joy headquarters who placed me at a Joy in Shida that wanted to pay me NT$ 40 000 for 7 hours work a day.
so, it’s really hard to be legal around here and still earn more money than you would back home. I’m not complaining, just stating facts…love this little island to death!!!
[quote=“jman”]I believe the attitudes the original poster expressed are very representative of Western mentality. It took me many years and a lot of traveling/living in different cultures to understand they flaw in this type of thinking.
In the West we are taught that the societies we live in are noble and correct. That our democracies are the most advanced, and our people are the free est. I think many will agree this doesn’t hold true.
It’s in other parts of the world (places that have a bad connotation or are portrayed badly in our home countries) where you can find societies with true freedoms![/quote]
This is a completely bullshit reply. My original post has nothing to do with morality or imagined social superiority. It is about being deported.
What part of that did you not understand?
My boss asks me to do something illegal, if we get caught he gets a slap on the wrist and I get shoved on a plane and sent home. That was and is the thrust of the post.
This whole imagined moral superiority slant is you projecting your hang ups on this affair, WTF?
My point was only that types of systems like Taiwan’s are are best not resisted against but rather worked within their confines.
If a person has moral issues with things like basic corruption, or bribery for instance, they will likely have a hard time living in a polyactive culture.
I am sure the poster thinks they are really cool with the foul language and acronym but it certainly does not say much about their upbringing.
What is so FREE about giving up your whole life to come to a country (including making debt to get here) and then thinking that you are legal, only to be kicked out of the country because your boss gave your name up at another school. I worked at a Joy school for three years…I paid tax, my schools adress and my home adress was on the ARC…but I was registered somewhere else. How am I as a foreigner supposed to know that?
Free for who? What is so free about this place? Free tissues on every streetcorner maybe!
[quote=“jman”]My point was only that types of systems like Taiwan’s are are best not resisted against but rather worked within their confines.
If a person has moral issues with things like basic corruption, or bribery for instance, they will likely have a hard time living in a polyactive culture.
I am sure the poster thinks they are really cool with the foul language and acronym but it certainly does not say much about their upbringing.[/quote]
Come on now you were making a smarmy holier than ivory tower remark and you got spanked for it. No need for mental gymnastics, just admit it.
We won’t think any less of you for your misplaced arrogance. It is just that some of us have not been educated enough that we can see the big picture when asked to commit illegal acts that will get us deported.
I should have been culturally evolved to the point that I could see it was not just a cheap bastard trying to save a buck and skirt the law by risking my deportation, it was in fact an expression of his unrestricted freedom from silly things like rule of law and civic responsibility.
!
Thank you for opening my eyes o wise sage
I am not sure that this information would really be helpful as your experience may differ from mine.
Provided that you know what you will and won’t do you can lay down the law when finding work and ensure that you are 100% legal. At the end of the day you are the one who will wear the consequences of not being legal so you best prevent this from happening.
I know that Joy and other schools can employ you legally in that they have many positions that are 100% legal. Having said that there are Joy preschools out there and it is not unusual for them to ask you to work at more than one location. My point is that if you know that this is illegal and you don’t want to do it then Joy can give you options to ensure that you are 100% legal. They are not the only ones.
I support the concerns about so much ‘illegality’ going on regarding many of our work here, but if you want to keep your nose clean you can.
Wel, since folks reading F.com now are aware that some (not all) schools do “play games” with addresses in terms of work locations and ARCs/work permits, you can now take the initiative and check. I agree that it is very disheartening as a foreigner who has no idea about this practice if you find out your school was doing it to you. But now that anyone who has read this thread is aware of it, it’s no different than knowing to click on “delete” when you get an e-mail from a Nigerian bishop asking for your help in getting his $66 million fortune out of Africa.
Teachers have to do their homework (no pun intended) and keep their eyes open. It ain’t Kansas.
I only made a remark because I saw the tone of your post and I wanted to interject a differing opinion which I thought was completely relevant to the topic. The dialog you’re forcing does not make for good threads.
You will not get far by imposing your sense of civic responsibility on the locals, they have done just fine with their current system for a thousand years.
Back to my original point, it is your mentality that needs adjusted not your peers.
[quote=“jman”]I only made a remark because I saw the tone of your post and I wanted to interject a differing opinion which I thought was completely relevant to the topic. The dialog you’re forcing does not make for good threads.
You will not get far by imposing your sense of civic responsibility on the locals, they have done just fine with their current system for a thousand years.
Back to my original point, it is your mentality that needs adjusted not your peers.[/quote]
You are so right I should just be the patsy for what ever scam whatever scumbag wants to try and slip by.
“even though we sold 400,000 units could you sign this legally binding document that says we sold 4000? You can great!”
For future reference misunderstanding a post is fine, I do it all the time, being a know it all wanker who just can’t admit he made a mistake is.
[quote=“jman”]I believe the attitudes the original poster expressed are very representative of Western mentality. It took me many years and a lot of traveling/living in different cultures to understand they flaw in this type of thinking.
In the West we are taught that the societies we live in are noble and correct. That our democracies are the most advanced, and our people are the free est. I think many will agree this doesn’t hold true.
It’s in other parts of the world (places that have a bad connotation or are portrayed badly in our home countries) where you can find societies with true freedoms![/quote]
I don’t think this post is so flame worthy. He’s just saying in Taiwan no one cares about the fine print…or the legal way of doing things…and they bend the rules as they see fit…and most of the time the law turns a blind eye anyway. Unlike America where you get ticketed for chirping your tires as you accelerate away from a stop. If every school and buisness you’ve ever worked at does illegal practices…then that’s just how it is here.
But I would have a serious issue with being asked to sign my name on papers with lies on them. I try to lie as little as possible.
Mordeath I don’t think anyone will argue this point with you, however the thrust of this thread is that these people are breaking the law yes but they are risking my security, my safety, my name not their own. Obviously this is not just a mistake it is intentional, and as such it may be a reflection of the attitudes towards ex-pat workers as fodder or expendable.
Any quasi enlightened attempt to moralize this act as an expression of their true freedom rather than a predatory action is at best naive, at worst a pretentious expression of profound wankery.
:s
My friend, your dilemma would best be solved by moving back to the UK or wherever.
???
That statement is narrow minded, and obnoxiously egocentric! You gotta change your perception man, its not so hard to be happy. It is pointless to start a thread with a negative topic just to get yourself all worked up. Take some pointers from the Zen philosophy all around you.
Just today a school rang me asking if I could do their kindergarten class. I told the lady it was illegal and her reply was “but its only 1 class a day”. :saywhat:
What jman is saying, shifty, is that yes, they’re lying sacks of shit, but this is Taiwan. It’s OK! to be a lying sack of shit – it’s the culture, and let’s not forget, they have eleventy-billion years of culture.
Yes yes I see it but really the hucksting is not really hucksting but rather an expression of their true freedom; it is only our western egocentrism that defines it as hucksting.
Oh, to be an enlightened orientalist and not just a mere mortal struggling to find ones way in the big lights of the city
[quote=“jman”]My friend, your dilemma would best be solved by moving back to the UK or wherever.
???
That statement is narrow minded, and obnoxiously egocentric! You gotta change your perception man, its not so hard to be happy. It is pointless to start a thread with a negative topic just to get yourself all worked up. Take some pointers from the Zen philosophy all around you.[/quote]
Again I have to call shennagians on this one, you are so obviously blinded by your " I love Asian phil" that you ignore all the actual functioning realities that don’t quite fit into your idealized and romantic ideas of Asian culture.
Let’s se how much of a heartbroken and disillusioned wanker you are in 6 months.
