For the Lifers out there: LIFE-AFTER-TEACHING (LAT)

yes one would imagine there’s something very special going on in that bedroom. a CEO doing ALL of the cooking and cleaning!

Question: would you guys really relegate all to bed performance? I mean, everything is lousy in your relationship, but sex is great? How can it be great with so much luggage outside the bedroom? It is like hooking up with a psycho xiajie! How can you be with someone who doesn’t love you, uses you, wiper her feet on you, just because she is good in bed? Which, BTW, how can you be good in bed if you do not care about the other person? A certain profession comes to mind…

[quote=“Mr He”][quote=“Indiana”][quote=“BlownWideOpen”]

I’m waiting for one of the Canadian women to comment. Ladies…what do you say? Back in Canada, have you ever had a man come home from a day of work where you were at home all day, and he cooked a meal or did dishes or laundry or whatever? I want an honest answer here[/quote]

I take it you have had this experience before…I would hope it would be a highly irregular one. That’s just plain old laziness.

My uncle married a woman like this and the whole family hates her. He is the CEO of a tech company and she gave up her teaching job when she had a kid…their kid (my cousin) is 25 now and she never went back to work. My uncle has always done all of the cleaning, cooking, EVERYTHING while she orders him around and has never lifted a finger. I don’t get it and have never seen anything like it before. He is completely smitten with her and no one can understand why.[/quote]

Sorry if I offend, however if a woman can get away with that for 25 years, she has either pussy-whipped him into a wreck or her skills in bed are out of this world.[/quote]

Yeah, I don’t know the answer to this one (and I don’t want to know!), but she is extremely manipulative (that’s why the family can’t stand her) and I think my uncle has simply been manipulated into thinking that this is a normal way of life for some reason. He is extremely bright, personable, handsome, athletic, funny, and well off; he would be quite an eligible bachelor if he ditched her, but I don’t think things will ever change. Ah well.

[quote=“RockOn”]
It’s going to be hard changing her mind, but I have already set a time to talk to her on the weekend. Will keep you updated as to her response. I predict a lot of shouting and name-calling, but so be it.[/quote]

Holy cow! So we had the “money talk” last night, and lo and behold, she didn’t bat a freakin’ eyelash. It was almost as if she was expecting it. There was no shouting or name-calling at all. I told her about my unhappiness with her current contributions to home expenses and the fact that I have to foot the bill for all the major expenses, including vacations, big ticket items, kid’s kindy registration, etc. At first, she did mention the “but you’re the husband” bullshit, but I shut it down quickly. We also discussed cutting back on certain household expenses to get more cash flowing into our savings. I didn’t get any real opposition until I talked about splitting big family expenses 50/50. She was quick to say that she would have to sleep on it, but I made it clear that that part wasn’t really negotiable.

After giving her a few minutes to think, she immediately suggested cancelling our September family vacation. Not cool, but I can live with it. She was so afraid that I would ask her to apply our new understanding retroactively…which of course I didn’t do…who am I, the fucking tax man.

I’m still in shock as to her relatively sanguine acceptance of the new understanding. I expected a lot worse, but I also have a funny feeling that this ain’t over yet. STAY TUNED.

Maybe she has an account here. :astonished:

Good. Now she knows where you stand. Stand your ground. Outline the benefits for her, maybe if she sees the Big Picture, she will cooperate more. There are many benefits for this plan, point them out.

I am not too keen on those cancelled plans or how this will be translated to the kids/family/friends. Keep on alert but emphasize the positive.

And start hiding some money anyways in a separate account.

As we say in Spanish, your eyes on the crucifix but your hand over the money purse.

Over here in CAlifornia husbands and wives have equal share in property, funds, etc. That means all funds in each others bank accounts, property in each’s name (yes singular, doesn’t matter).

They share all under the law.

Therefore a good way may be to impress upon the wife that fact and the fact that the family is a single unit. So that all funds spent are spent from the common fund. So that she can take ownership more of her expenses. IN that they affect the whole family unit.

Rather then a “this is mine, and i will allow you a portion of this, and you and i will fight as to how much more i will allow you from my money” ,etc.

This makes the wife more and more conniving in getting more of YOUR money into her account or at least spending more of YOUR money.

It becomees a YOU versus ME equation, which is not an equation.

It has to become very much understood that it is US and not mine and yours.

My wife is younger and less understanding of the fact that it is hard to make money and much much easier to spend it. And that just because you are getting a free gift when you spend 65 dollars at the store doesnt mean that you SHOULD spend 65 dollars. Etc.

It is not easy. But I am getting her more into the thinking that it is OUR money that you are spending. Wouldn’t it be better not to part with it so easily? Let’s be smart about what we spend and get max value out of it.

Its a long road but it is slowly sinking in. She looks for bargains and deals at least now.

There are still going to be disagreements about the spending of money but I think the wife has to be brought into the fold and be part of the TEAM.

not a YOU against ME thing. It has to be US. And if it aint US, it will have to become US down the road. Or its BUST.

LOLs at Western (or half western) individuals teaching the ‘asians’ how to think of the future and be thrifty and save. What is the world coming to!

[quote=“RockOn”]
I’m still in shock as to her relatively sanguine acceptance of the new understanding. I expected a lot worse, but I also have a funny feeling that this ain’t over yet. STAY TUNED.[/quote]

And so the whining begins. “But before you paid for this.” Now all of a sudden she wants to go on vacation again. But she doesnt wanna pay…still.So then she tried guilting me with our son’s childhood memories, and how precious they are and how we need to show him the world no matter the cost.

She also tried the," Your new way doesnt work" for one week, lets go back to the old way…HELL NO! That was a shitty way where I had to pay for everything.

Oh yeah, and last night I got the whole “money will be the reason we divorce” threat.

I am not going back…not in a fucking billion years.

Don’t blame the money. It’s just greed that would be the reason you divorce.

Hope you’re able to work through it, though. Stay your ground but let her know that you appreciate the things that she does for you. It must be a big lifestyle change for her having to contribute to the household expenses, especially since she didn’t have to pay much in the past. Helping her ease into her new responsibilities with love and kindness might soften the sting she feels in the wallet.

You could take the opposite approach and be like, “See what it feels to be a grown up now?” …but I’m not sure that would work very well! :slight_smile:

[quote=“rocky raccoon”]
Hope you’re able to work through it, though. Stay your ground but let her know that you appreciate the things that she does for you. It must be a big lifestyle change for her having to contribute to the household expenses, especially since she didn’t have to pay much in the past. Helping her ease into her new responsibilities with love and kindness might soften the sting she feels in the wallet.

You could take the opposite approach and be like, “See what it feels to be a grown up now?” …but I’m not sure that would work very well! :slight_smile:[/quote]

Good advice. Thx. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Found this very interesting article about couples’ finances:
finance.yahoo.com/news/relations … soc_trk=ma

It’s about Western couples and their household finances.

More than half of the respondents in Fidelity’s survey said they’re worried about outliving their retirement savings (up from 42% in 2013), yet only 21% report having actually come up with a joint retirement savings plan.”

“According to a new Fidelity survey, 43% of couples said they had no idea how much their partner earns.

“More than one-third of couples surveyed couldn’t agree on the balances of their investable assets.”

[quote=“RockOn”]Found this very interesting article about couples’ finances:
finance.yahoo.com/news/relations … soc_trk=ma

It’s about Western couples and their household finances.
[/quote]

Nope, it’s just about Americans.

forget the stats RockOn, and don’t take marriage advice from a bunch of scoundrels like us. These finance blogs and their retirement articles are nonsense. You know that they’ve been scaring old people in Canada for years saying that to retire on nothing less than a million is risky. This is horseshit, old people can make efforts to eat well and stave off serious health problems, exercise and live fairly modestly and will be OK. All you need when you’re an old fart is a TV, a bed and a roof over your head. You can pick blackberries on the side of the road and steal corn from local farmers

It’s true, owning a small farm might be one of the best retirement plans out there: Free food, trade the surplus, get light exercise, stay outside, make friends. My parents still grow food well into retirement.

[quote=“RockOn”]Found this very interesting article about couples’ finances:
finance.yahoo.com/news/relations … soc_trk=ma

It’s about Western couples and their household finances.

More than half of the respondents in Fidelity’s survey said they’re worried about outliving their retirement savings (up from 42% in 2013), yet only 21% report having actually come up with a joint retirement savings plan.”

“According to a new Fidelity survey, 43% of couples said they had no idea how much their partner earns.

“More than one-third of couples surveyed couldn’t agree on the balances of their investable assets.”[/quote]

Well, yes, circumstances might differ. I run a business, and if you ask me how much I earn, I will struggle with an answer. I really do not do my figures that way.

That provides a fairly reliable income of CA$40,000 a year, and considering how little the average person invests in generating their own electricity or growing their own food, that’s a very reasonable assessment for Joe Average.

For those with their own property and a setup that includes some energy generation and food supply, as well as the money-saving mindset, it could probably be halved. CA$500,000 in savings/investments + your own property. That’s only NT$12.5M + house. International travel on years when your investments go up, and a Cabbage Soup Week every month for a few months of the year during crashes. :wink:

That’s just looking at Canada, of course. But if you’re living in Taiwan and you’ve got NT$10M invested and your mortgage paid off, it becomes a realistic alternative to drop down to part-time work for a few years while your reserves snowball and you consider your options for retirement. (Not necessarily the BEST option, but if you’re burning out, a PT year with just enough income to cover outgoings might be just the ticket.)

I’d be kicking myself if I’d picked up a part-time contract just before a market crash, though! :smiley:

60 is the new 40.

[quote=“gavmasterflash”][quote=“RockOn”]I earn more than $100,000pm @ $800+ per hour excluding huge bonuses. My Taiwanese wife contributes $20,000 pm to family expenses, bringing our household income to over $120,000 pm. We have a kid, a few dogs, one car (with comp. insurance), no domestic help (at all), life insurance / private health insurance, no apartment of our own (renters), school fees, and a ton of misc. expenses. We haven’t been on a vacation outside of Taiwan in 3 years and I haven’t been back home in more than 5. We’re not scraping by, but we don’t live in the lap of luxury, either. I’m almost 40 and I’ve been teaching more than 10 years, and the thought of teaching another 10 scares the shit out of me.

To save myself from early death (=10 more years of teaching children), I’ve been saving and investing like a maniac. The point I’m trying to make is that as a foreigner in Taiwan with no local family to support you or help you out, you better have a plan B. Teaching in Taiwan until you’re 60 isn’t a plan. Spending all your money every month isn’t a plan. Traveling all over Asia and the world spending your money isn’t a plan, either. For those of us who are lifers nearing our 40s, if we don’t have a plan B (or a rich family at home), we’re fucked.

I read about 50 or 60-year old people becoming completely destitute when they lose their jobs or get divorced or through personal injury and it keeps me up at night. I have a “good” job, reasonably stable marriage (YEAH RIGHT!), and private health insurance to cover my expenses if I can’t work for an extended period of time, BUT I’m IN CONSTANT FEAR OF NOT HAVING ENOUGH MONEY WHEN MY LUCK TURNS. My household expenses are running at TWD85,000 per month, which is more than most salaries in Taiwan, but preparing for LAT (LIFE-AFTER-TEACHING) is my main focus in life. I have another 5-7 years of teaching in me before I suffer a massive fucking coronary event. I kinda feel like my life is just passing me by at this point and that all the worrying is just making the reality worse.

But this is the life I chose. In 5-10 years, hopefully, my investments pay off and my worries stop. Then finally, I’ll be able to live again. A SAD, BUT TRUE TALE OF LIFE, WORK, MONEY, AND HOPE.[/quote]

Okay, so since you’ve posted on here about your situation you should be open to advice. Therefore, what I am about to say may not initially sit well with you, but don’t take any of it personally. You really are going to have to think about this kind of stuff and it really is a serious matter and tough decisions will have to be made.

Before I start I want to say that I have been in Taiwan for 3 years now and I am looking at being a lifer myself but I have put some really serious thought into everything during the last two years especially into how to make that all happen.

Let’s begin where everything started with me here in Taiwan. I was promised a private school job that fell through when I arrived in July 2012. I came with far too little money to get started here and spent two weeks finding a job. I got a whack-ass kindy job way out in New Taipei City and was living in the (in)famous Taipei Hostel around Shandao Temple Station. I was fired from the kindy in less than two months and found myself looking for a job again for a period of five weeks. I was in and out of the hostel and was lucky enough to find a couple of one month short term inexpensive leases, but mostly lived in that hostel in the dormitory.

Now when I was living there, there were 3 people that really stand out to me as people who had completely fucked up in life. They were some of these people that you kind of describe, 50-60 years old and completely destitute. There was one guy who was over 60 who had been living in Taiwan for a while as some type of contractor so he said, telling me how he had been making over $100,000 USD year at certain points in his career but had to leave Taichung for one reason or another and ended up in Taipei Hostel with nothing to show for himself over all that time. In fact, he had mismanaged his money so much that he needed to get a repatriation loan from AIT just to get his ass on a plane back to the US. That’s right, he couldn’t even afford a one way ticket home. It was quite mind boggling to me that this guy said he was making so much money, I think as some type of engeineer, and had nothing, NOTHING, to show for it when he was 60 +. Part of me doubts that he ever did make that much but it was clear that he was not good at managing his money and no job he ever had provided a pension or any type of retirement and he clearly had not planned or saved for the eventuality of retirement.

Another guy that was there around the same time was about 50 years old and also completely flat broke. He was looking for English teaching work at cram schools at his age in Taiwan. It was really pathetic honestly. He couldn’t get hired anywhere. He said he had no money, but was living in a private room and getting drunk nearly every night. He had come over from mainland China I believe, because he got fired from his job there. I guess in the end he went back there because it was much easier to find work there than Taiwan at his age, although he said he had taught in Taiwan about a decade prior and had found the landscape for teachers had changed considerably during that time period. Before he departed he said something along the lines of a friend had wired him a few hundred bucks for his visa and plane ticket back to mainland China.

Another woman, over 40, also completely destitute had been fired from a cram school and was flat broke on her ass, also getting drunk every night on mijyo. She couldn’t find work probably due to her age and her apperance. She was missing several teeth and just looked like hell, like she had been doing crystal meth or something, honestly. She ended up out on her ass when she didn’t have enough money to even pay for a bunk in a dormitory and probably had to get money sent to her from her father if she ever wanted to get out of Taiwan and not become a homeless street person. I’m guessing she probably made her way back to the States with family or went on to mainland China for work.

These three people had set a very cautionary tale for me about how not to live my life in Taiwan. There was no way I wanted to be 40, 50, 60 years old and staying in a hostel because there was nowhere else for me to go. Being there at age 26 was bad enough. I couldn’t even imagine being twice as old and being in that situation, really, it would make me feel like a complete failure. It was very similar to me what my parents were like, in their 60s now and completely broke, still in debt. A lot of it might be generational, seriously, I think a lot of Baby Boomers are quite horrible at handling their money.
[/quote]

The only cautionary tale I read from that is if you have mental problems be sure to seek help. Their problems have little to do with their age and everything to do with the mental state.

[quote=“RockOn”][quote=“RockOn”]
I’m still in shock as to her relatively sanguine acceptance of the new understanding. I expected a lot worse, but I also have a funny feeling that this ain’t over yet. STAY TUNED.[/quote]

And so the whining begins. “But before you paid for this.” Now all of a sudden she wants to go on vacation again. But she doesnt wanna pay…still.So then she tried guilting me with our son’s childhood memories, and how precious they are and how we need to show him the world no matter the cost.

She also tried the," Your new way doesnt work" for one week, lets go back to the old way…HELL NO! That was a shitty way where I had to pay for everything.

Oh yeah, and last night I got the whole “money will be the reason we divorce” threat.

I am not going back…not in a fucking billion years.[/quote]
I genuinely feel for you man. I have not been able to stand my ground in a similar situation. It fucks with your head. Either you stay with your beliefs or you stay with your wife. How the hell do you make that choice?