You will find that every country’s problem is often a result of their culture, for example: big wealth gaps in third world countries, starvation, etc.
Greed, poor (if any) internalization of rules and laws, and lack of extension of moral obligations beyond one’s circles of guanxi, for instance?
In contrast America’s problem is excessive rule of law…
[quote=“headhonchoII”]Yep, Taiwan has some vertical mega companies like President which control sourcing, manufacturing, supply, distribution and retail and even has many of it’s own brands or licenses/franchise famous foreign brands.
According to the Wiki it’s the largest food company in Asia (Master kong must be bigger in terms of sales though).
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uni-Presid … orporation
pecos.com.tw/brands.html
In the restaurant sector the holding company for Wow prime controls many popular restaurant chains in Taiwan.[/quote]
I was thinking about this issue again earlier, and I do believe it’s a systemic issue that cuts across Taiwan society, which why they have been struggling to tackle this food safety issue effectively. However there are a few reasons that make the situation especially bad here.
1) Vertically integrated food companies
In the West we don’t see Tesco or Carrefour making their own food. They contract out, but here Tong-Yi and Wei-chuan etc actually process the food and distribute it and sell it through their own outlets in many cases. This means that when THEIR own food brands are tainted they don’t have any incentive to expose this or serve any punishment on themselves. ?In the case of Tesco or Carrefour they could just switch suppliers or blame it on the suppliers and they can force the suppliers to follow high standards even if it costs the suppliers more than they would like to spend. The situation in Taiwan encourages lax behaviour through the whole organisation. China has changed the law now and made supermarkets liable for any shoddy food they sell. Some supermarkets in China now have very expensive testing equipment actually in the supermarkets, although whether they use it properly is another issue.
2) Weak central government and legal system
Taiwan is very unusual being a small island with such a weak central government with little leverage over many local government functions. The central government is easily cowed or blocked by big business interests or local government administrations. The legal system doesn’t have enough severe punishment for errant companies or individuals in the food industry, this seems deliberate due to big business lobbying.
3) Going through the motions
Many things in Taiwan are done simply to show things being done. GMP and ISO are simply stamps on a package that are needed to export or reach markets, they are not actually internalised culturally.
The same goes with the inspection process, stamp here, stamp there, good enough, a few NTD all round, maybe a little warning to do better next time, no punishment and no improvement saving face all round and maintaining good guanxi.
We can’t blame the restaurant owners for using this lard, it was from a GMP approved company and was the biggest single supplier in Taiwan. There was no way for them to know it was tainted.
4) Consumers do not say ENOUGH is ENOUGH.
7-11 is still as popular as ever, people still buy the crappy instant noodle brands, buy the milk that had (has) the antibiotics, the egg pudding and the sports drink that had the plastic, they don’t get angry enough except on an individual basis. They have done it with other issues…so there is hope.
When my ex wife joined the housemakers coop they said they did not sell any pork as they could not find a single farm that was up to standards. I rarely ate pork in Taiwan as it just seemed so clearly tainted.
An article (in Chinese) pointing some tainted products in Taiwan, including the Mos burger’s food problems.
[quote=“robert the bruce”]An article (in Chinese) pointing some tainted products in Taiwan, including the Mos burger’s food problems.
udn.com/NEWS/NATIONAL/NATS3/8931552.shtml[/quote]
I don’t read Chinese … so here’s a translation.
[quote]新北市衛生局續追強冠新增的24款劣質油品，續查中下游廠商的下游，除了12日的摩斯漢堡、喬麥屋以外，13日又查出王品的曼咖啡、山崎麵包、沃克牛排，廣達香、三協成、宏品(七七乳加、禮坊)、石門劉家肉粽統統中鏢。
New Taipei City Health Bureau continued to chase strong crown new 24 models of inferior oil, continued Charles River downstream manufacturers, in addition to Mos Burger, buckwheat house on the 12th, and the 13th king of goods Mann also find coffee, Yamazaki bread, Walker steak, Quanta incense, Sankyo into macro product (seventy-seven milk plus, Levon), Shimen Liu meat all the dart.
其中，王品的曼咖啡以及山崎麵包，都是使用到魔術食品提供的番茄蔬菜湯，沃克牛排則是使用到紅酒牛排醬。
Among them, the king of chemicals Mann coffee and Yamazaki bread, tomato vegetable soup are using the magic of food provided, Walker steak is the use of the red wine steak sauce.
幾分甜進芳福香豬油 蔥花麵包也染餿 新北市衛生局追查問題油下游產品，知名的幾分甜幸福城堡也中鏢，藍海國際總監李慧珊表示，從3年前開始，向芳福公司進「芳福香豬油」，製作蔥花麵包，製作過程是用芳福香豬油先炸成蔥仔油，再揉進製作蔥花麵包的麵團中，餿水油事件爆發後，立即清查所有產品，僅有蔥花麵包用到豬油，擔心有疑慮，9月5日就立刻下架停售。 李慧珊表示，蔥花麵包在全台47家門市都有販售，但並不是暢銷產品，平均一家門市一天僅會賣出10個，目前只要有購買過蔥花麵包的消費者，只要憑發票都能夠全額退費。
Hong Fu Jin Fang somewhat sweet onion bread dyed rancid lard New Taipei City Health Bureau to trace the problem of oil downstream products, well-known castle is also in a bit of sweet happiness dart, Blue Ocean International director Li Huishan said, from three years ago, Fang good fortune to feed, “Fong Fuk Heung lard”, making green onion bread, production process is first blasted Fong Fuk Heung lard onions Aberdeen oil, then rub it into the production of bread dough green onion, sour water and oil after the outbreak, immediately inventory all products, lard used only green onion bread, fearing doubt , September 5 on the shelf for sale immediately. Li Huishan said green onion bread in Taiwan 47 stores have sold, but not the best-selling product, with an average of a store one day be sold only 10, there are currently just bought green onion bread consumers, as long as the invoice can be fully refund.
摩斯醬料用強冠油 即起停賣5款漢堡 新北市衛生局公布強冠下游業者名單，其中魔術食品經查是摩斯漢堡的醬料供應商，摩斯立即發聲明回應，業者提到上周9月5日第一時間擴大自主管理，針對有使用豬油和豬肉的產品先行預防性下架，目前暫時停售摩斯漢堡、辣味摩斯漢堡、摩斯吉士漢堡、辣味摩斯吉士漢堡和Keema咖哩豬排堡等商品，先進行全面清查，確認魔術食品更換其他經SGS認證的油品，確認醬汁品質無慮後，再擇期上市。
Holmes sauces crown with a strong start and stop the oil that is sold five models Hamburg New Taipei City Health Bureau announced the list of strong crown downstream industry, including magic food investigation is Mos Burger sauce suppliers, Holmes immediately issued a statement in response, the industry mentioned last week, September 5 the first time to expand self-management, for There use lard and pork products in advance preventive shelf, currently temporarily sale Mos Burger, Spicy Mos Burger, Holmes cheeseburger, cheeseburger and spicy Holmes Fort Keema curry pork chops and other commodities, the first After a comprehensive inventory, confirm magic food replace other oil certified by SGS, without taking into account the quality confirmed sauce, then elective listing.
乖乖五香、孔雀香酥脆都中鏢 強冠24品項豬油今天全下架，乖乖中壢廠向桃園衛生局通報，乖乖五香口味和孔雀香酥脆都中招了，衛生局正了解中
Obediently spiced, crispy all the dart peacock Strong crown 24 items under this shelf full of lard, obediently Chungli, Taoyuan plant informed the Health Bureau, obediently spiced crispy taste and aroma are caught peacock, the Health Bureau is to understand the
慘！國民零食「乖乖」也中鏢。聯合報系資料照
Miserable! National snacks “nice” is also the dart. United Daily News photo information
黑心油擴大！旺旺九項產品也中招 生產旺旺仙貝的宜蘭食品中招，從3月至今已叫強冠豬油，包括全統精製豬油672桶，庫存35.5桶，使用至8月底。宜蘭縣衛生局今天已前往封存問題產品。衛生局表示，宜蘭食品使用的豬油，製作產品包括夾心酥、捲心酥，彭派包等9項。
Black-oil expansion! Want nine products caught Want crackers Ilan production of food caught from March has been called strong crown lard, including full integration of refined lard 672 barrels, inventories 35.5 barrels, used until the end of August. Yilan County Health Department today has traveled to seal the products in question. Health Bureau said, lard, making the product Ilan used include nine food sandwich crisp, crunchy roll heart, Peng send packages.
味丹道歉 海鮮、牛肉泡麵下架 強冠問題豬油延燒，味丹企業今天主動向台中市衛生局通報，使用強冠精豬油生產泡麵，美味小舖系列與台灣好味系列的牛肉湯麵、海鮮湯麵，都有用到問題豬油，將全數下架回收。
Vedan apologize seafood, beef noodles shelves Strong crown problem lard spread, Vedan Enterprise initiative to Taichung City Health Department briefing today, with a strong crown refined lard production of instant noodles, tasty Shop series with Taiwan beef noodle soup taste good series, seafood soup, has used the issue of pig oil, will be fully recovered the next frame.
興霖食品代工 五木肉燥拉麵也中鏢 以生產五木拉麵知名的南投縣興霖食品，今年4及7月共購入強冠「RL（E）精豬油」（散裝）12,000餘公斤，衛生局已要求興霖通知62家下游通路商，將五木肉燥拉麵、五木麵大師香蔥拌麵及OEM代工的惠康「頂好WELLCOM肉燥風味拉麵」、家樂福「快煮拉麵（肉燥風味）」及三商行（美廉社）「好麵到肉燥味拉麵」全面下架回收。
Xing Lin Food Foundry five wooden Rouzao Ramen also dart Five well-known to produce wood Ramen Nantou County Xing Lin food, and in July this year, a total of four acquired strong crown “RL (E) refined lard” (bulk) of more than 12,000 kilograms, Xing Lin Health Bureau requires notification 62 downstream distributors, The five wood Rouzao noodles, five wood surface Masters onion noodles and OEM OEM Wellcome “Top good WELLCOM Rouzao flavor ramen” Carrefour “quick cook noodles (Rouzao flavor)” and three firms (MerryMart Club) " Ramen noodles taste good face to Rouzao 'shelves full recovery.
[/quote] 
Sorry, the translation is as bad as the oil …
Basic Translation: Latest news on stomach health: The following products do not contain gutter oil–please feel at ease to drink.
Come on, guys, I saw people kowtowing on tv. Sure now everything is fine again and this thread should be deleted. They apologized, so it never happened and we all need to forget about it.
Yesterday, the headline went like this:
Farmer hailed as ‘hero’ for exposing oil scandal
My first thought was, oh, oh, they are going to send gangsters against him. I shouldn’t have worried, as they had already done that.
Whistleblower threatened by ‘men in black’
[quote]TAIPEI, Taiwan – Police in Taichung yesterday received reports from several elderly farmers of suspicious “men in black” that were allegedly looking for the old farmer who filed complaints about tainted oil manufacturer Chang Guann (強冠).
Local media outlets reported that a farmer living in Pingtung County had collected evidence over two years in order to prove the existence of the underground factory operated by Chang Guann’s major oil provider Kuo Lieh-cheng (郭烈成), and the tainted oil that he manufactured.
The farmer’s investigation had begun after his own farmland had been polluted by Kuo’s factory. Having taken the evidence he had gathered to the police in Taichung, the farmer refused to be named, only stating that he had previously lodged his complaints to the Pingtung County Environmental Protection Bureau five times without being taken seriously.
Shortly after Kuo was released on NT$50,000 bail, a friend of the farmer reported that two cars caught up with him when he left the farmer’s house, with men in black who stated that “this isn’t the man” before leaving. Concerned for his friend, the farmer called the Taichung police, who had taken in his complaints in the first place.
Yesterday, the farmer reported a similar case to the police when an elderly couple informed him of their fears after seeing a strange car parked in front of their apartment.
The police in Pingtung had not received information on the farmer’s identity yet, as he had provided his evidence to the Taichung police through a friend, but despite that there were also no reports of said threats in Pingtung over the last few days, the Pingtung police will be keeping an eye out for similar cases and launch a probe on suspicious individuals reported by the locals
[/quote]
Explains a lot, doesn’t it?
And on the international front (love the map at the link, BTW)
Hong Kong ‘gutter oil’ map: Is your neighbourhood store on the list?
Zoom in to see whether your bakery is suspected to have used tainted oil sold by Chang Guann, the Taiwanese firm at the centre of the ‘gutter oil’ scandal.
[quote]About 70 per cent of the lard that bakeries used in Hong Kong came from Taiwan, according to an estimate by Simon Wong Ka-wo, chairman of the Chamber of Food and Beverage Industry. Chang Guann’s oil customers ranged from five-star hotels to traditional bakeries and Japanese noodle restaurants.
Hong Kong has since banned the sale of all products made with the firm’s oil.
[/quote]
I don’t get why they have to use gutter oil for food. There are millions of other use you have for them like biodeisel or machine lubricants that they could get more money for and have no moral dilemma
Nice stuff. So I am now eagerly awaiting:
Will that happen? Perhaps it already has and I missed it.
It would cost a lot more money to make biodiesel instead of just skimming out the contaminants. But yeah this is what they should be doing. Logic fails here.
- everyone’s doing it
- convenience
- easy money (there are ways to make more, but they are more ma-fan)
- almost certainty of little repercussions
- people buy shit they have no guarantees on
Also, the “moral dilemma” is most easily solved with kowtowing once one has been busted. If it works for exploding people with shoddy pipeworks, it works for feeding them gutter oil.
So if they could make say 200% more money turning gutter oil into lubricants than selling them as food, they would still sell them as food?
There has got to be way more money turning those oil into lubricants or biodiesel than using them for food.
[quote=“Taiwan Luthiers”]So if they could make say 200% more money turning gutter oil into lubricants than selling them as food, they would still sell them as food?
There has got to be way more money turning those oil into lubricants or biodiesel than using them for food.[/quote]
maybe it’s more trouble and time to get the extra money. plus I’ve concluded that Taiwanese have few morals. If they can get away with it then they will. that seems to be status quo here.
- everyone’s doing it
- convenience
- easy money (there are ways to make more, but they are more ma-fan)
- almost certainty of little repercussions
- people buy shit they have no guarantees on
Also, the “moral dilemma” is most easily solved with kowtowing once one has been busted. If it works for exploding people with shoddy pipeworks, it works for feeding them gutter oil.[/quote]
Plus no one has done that before. Why risk something different/new, if they have been doing this for over 13 years? If it ain’t broken, don’t fix it… until you get caught. Then you call upon a few “favors” from Big Mountains You Lean On, and it’s back in business.
Pity, seriously. This biodiesel business could solve a lot of problems. Instead, we have even more.
Back in the ol country, we have a murder every 6 minutes. Here, it is a new cancer patient every 6 minutes. I don’t see the difference. Murder is murder.
[quote=“Tempo Gain”]Took me a bit to figure out this headline:
Oil scandal causes NT$5 bil. loss: Duh[/quote]
It’s all only about money.
You just don’t understand Chinese culture.
It’s ok to poison our own people. At least our exports won’t be affected.
Foreign countries are too picky about food health issues. Let’s keep it at home.