Hong Kong Citizens Move to Taiwan in Waves After Political Upsets


#41

well if you think that you should be allowed freedom to go about your life on both sides of the straights, but a mainland person should not have the same right, then there is definetly some kind of prejudice at work.


#42

I never said I think I should be. It’s not a decision made by me that I’m allowed to. I don’t think I have the right to just go wherever to work. I never said that, I’m given the privilege to my the PRC and can be taken away anytime I’m sure. Both governments made their own rules, I don’t see how it’s racist.

You think the PRC gives a shit what I feel like I can do? No, I’m following their rules. You’re very confused on my feelings and the legality of things decided by 2 countries.


#43

I never applied for a taobaozheng, or invested any money there. Wtf are you talking about? If others do, it’s their decision.

I simply asked why the ROC should not consider PRC nationals to come and go as a security risk? I didn’t say the average PRC nationals are security risk.


#44

you have and have used the right to pass freely and you are questioning the rights of others to do the same. spin it anyway you like but it still comes out looking like you see yourself as better than those others


#45

I do not see anything wrong with a Taiwanese benefiting from their Chinese nationality in Mainland China. It does invalidate your claim about China being dangerous for Taiwan though if you feel comfortable working, investing, and living there under their terms, i.e. the One China principle.

You have an entire thread deliberating it.


#46

I think before we start worrying about the potential few thousand Hong Kong people that might milk the health system, how about the government first crack down on all the granny and gramps who go see the hospital doctor every day because they are bored or because they feel they want to get “their moneys worth” from their small nhi payment.


#47

Quote me on where I said I believe I have the right to just go there. And I never went to China as a ROC nationals. I went through and studied as an American citizen and American student from an American school with the security of being one. I got the proper documentation and multiple entry student visa into the PRC for my America passport. I didn’t just waltz in there and do whatever I wanted.

I would have serious issues going as a ROC national. I talked about that in my thread you keep mentioning. And if you read the thread, it’s literally me just asking about moving their and possible problems, risks, and living conditions. It’s not a thread about moving there, it’s a thread about what’s life there because I was offered a job. I wasn’t just going there to fuck around.


#48

Well if you read, I actually brought up the risks of doing so. And deliberating is not the same as doing. I think about doing a lot of things.

I’m simply asking why Taiwan should not consider allowing PRC nationals a security risk?


#49

you have an entire thread about moving to shanghai, and often mention your trips to china and the family business in china.


#50

I don’t think taiwan government should issue a passport to mainland Chinese because mainland China issues it to taiwanese.

And I think not all of taiwanese are happy with the inclusive treatment for taiwanese in mainland China.


#51

I asked about what it’s like in Shanghai…I also brought up problems and risks of living under PRC controlled China. Let’s not pretend there’s none. They can fuck up your life and there’s nothing you can do about it.

I talked about my time there as an American student from an American school abroad. Far from going there working freely.

Yeah, like almost every country and business that manufactures, they probably have a factory to take advantage of cheap labor. Those of which have been moved to cheaper places like Vietnam. It’s hardly a business in China. It’s a factory to take advantage of cheap labor.


#52

Ok, Americans taking “advantage of cheap labor” in “third world” countries. I get it now😉 Anyway, no worries man we are all entitled to our opinions. its a problematic world we live in.


#53

Stop making stuff up. It’s like you want to argue for no reason. I’m not the king of Taiwan. I’m not xi Jing ping. I didn’t make any of the laws up for this. You’re confused on what I’m allowed to do from what I feel.

The PRC and ROC don’t have to have reciprocal laws. US citizens can enter EU without visa but EU citizens have to have a visa to enter the US…it happens all the time.

I have no idea why you’re getting so sensitive and putting words in my mouth and making up things that’s are not even true. How many scarecrows do you want to kill here?


#54

no offence intended. im not going to get into the who said what cause its storm in a teacup stuff anyway. peace brother Andrew.


#55

I’m not offended man, I just don’t think you are fully understanding what I’m trying to say are arguing things I’m not even trying to say. No worries, there are some limitations to conversing on a forum. I do understand what you’re saying, there is absolutely an argument for reciprocal laws on work cross strait.


#56

Eh most cancer and broken pelvis are paid by private insurance. We now have foreigners coming here for medical tourism for that. If we throw in a couple of perks and give them a pensioner visa, they will pay for all those gaps in NHI. Atoga like high quality service. As long as you do not charge them the 100k for an Xray a la US, you can make good money out of them. Works for 3rd world sh***holes, Taiwan can make it better.

Oh and remember most Taiwanese have cancer insurance. It is not optional if you want to survive most modern treatments are not within NHI.

Race in this case is working against Taiwan and the NHI.


#57

That is simply not true! Private insurance will make your stay in the hospital nicer and pay a per-diem to alleviate the fiscal burden on the family, but the principal cost of treatment is covered by the NHI.

Yes, and these foreigners are entirely outside of the NHI. There is nothing wrong with medical tourism.

As stated above, there is nothing wrong with medical tourism. But again, medical tourism is entirely unrelated to the NHI as these foreigners are not part of the NHI.

That is not true. The NHI does cover modern treatments. The insurance industry is big and offers valuable additions to the NHI. That however does not mean that the majority of costs is not paid for by the NHI.

Your proposal to let old foreigners settle in Taiwan and join the NHI for 1,200 NT$ a month says everything one needs to know about your understanding (or rather lack thereof) of how an insurance system or any sustainable organization works.


#58

This is off topic, but

made me smile. You’re right: $1200/m won’t cover the legal fees when you try to get your employees arrested for warning students not to fall for your recruitment scheme! (Cough, Nanshan…)


#59

Eh most Taiwanese would disagree. Not all cancer treatment is free, just as not all surgery cost is. Some medications are way above average payrates and that has been documented and on the news. Heck people have complained and protested and managed to lower costs. But I have had many Taiwanese friends and colleagues with cancer. Extra insurance assures best treatment.

Elderly may get a lot of free stuff after 65 years old but that is not top of the line, which means the hypothetical HK elderly, unless very stingy and willing to die.

1200 over 0 NTD is an improvement but heck let’s throw 5k. Still a good deal. We can make money out of this if they allow people who are not ethnic Chinese in.


#60

Even 5,000 NT$ a month will not be sufficient. When it comes to old people, no amount of money will be sufficient to make it a profitable proposition. Charging 5,000 NT$ instead of 1,200 NT$ will still result in negative performance. 34% of NHI expenditure already goes towards elderly afflicted with non-communicable diseases [Source] What Taiwan needs are young premium payers, whether ethnic Chinese or not.

Your anecdotal evidence has already been in stark contrast to government statistics in the thread on female foreign residents in Taiwan (“Why do men get bashed for no reason these days?”). Not only did your personal experience contradict statistics, but also the legal situation in almost all cases you mentioned. Cancer treatment ranks as the highest single expenditure for the NHI [Source] Surely people nevertheless complain and just as in other countries some new (others would say experimental) treatments are not included. That however does not mean that complementary cancer insurance alleviates the burden on the NHI when you have an influx of elderly immigrants who pay 1,200 NT$ or even 5,000 NT$ a month.

Your numbers do not add up, and neither does your perception of reality.