My wife is Taiwanese--does my JFRV give me any benefits on living and working in mainland China?

I forgot to add that there may be health checks involved. It would be best to call the PRC embassy responsible for your case about that.

HS78…Pray tell me how this works!! I got my Taibaozheng and the first time they only gave me a 1 year multiple visa. My wife is Chinese and based on marriage the max I got the second time was a 3 year visa.

Am living in China and even though my wife is Chinese and having established household registration, have not received a 5 year visa on my Taibaozheng nor got any 10 yr ID card like any other Mainland Chinese.

Checked with one of my wife’s best friends who happens to be a Khe Zhang in the immigration department where they handle this kind of stuff day in and day out, and she said she has never heard of Taiwanese nationals getting a 10 year ID card like any other Mainland Chinese.

Hell I cannot even buy an apartment in my name and get mortgage rates like the local Chinese. This was possible about 5 - 6 years ago but not possible now. Now I have to cough up nearly 60% - 70% as down payment. Gone are the days of paying 20% - 30% down payment.

Yes, your comments about them not recognizing the Taiwanese passport are correct but you do need to provide some proof to back up your comments regarding the 5 year visa and 10 year ID card

Then hsinhai will answer ‘China does not recognize Taiwan’ blah blah fantasy land blah blah Taiwanese are not foreigners we are all Chinese blah blah…

eztravel.com.tw/ezec/visa/pa … untryCd=CN

It is so easy that even travel agencies openly advertise 5 year Taibaozheng on the internet. I don’t know what your problem is, but with an ROC ID and Lüxingzheng in hand the Public Security Bureau in Shanghai did not give me any troubles to receive an endorsement with unlimited validity that shows my registered address although I actually only went there to register the place where I stayed during a short trip (I didn’t stay in a hotel, so I needed to do that).

If you want the ordinary 10 year and up ID card of Mainland China you need to change your household registration from Taiwan to whichever province in Mainland China you live in.

A bank not giving you a loan at local rates has to do with the location of your household registration. On the other hand, if you are from some peasant province and want to buy a house in urban China, the bank will give you trouble as well.

And as far as your Ke Zhang friend is concerned, ID cards and Taibaozheng for Taiwanese who are already inside Mainland China are not the responsibility of the “immigration department” but the local PSB station.

Wanted to write a long reply but am too tired to get into an argument with you. Just one piece of advice…stop providing incorrect information!!

Bring it on with arguments or stop alleging I am giving any wrong advice.

I have honestly no idea why the local PSB gave you any trouble since you are not providing many details. Besides, as a Taiwanese your case is vastly different from a foreigner who applies for a spouse visa to Mainland China. Taiwanese do not get visas for Mainland China.

Has anybody ever accused you of living in your own world Hsinhai?

You take your concepts and expand them far beyond the reality on the ground.

I really doubt the PRC authorities will provide me a spousal visa in the same manner as a PRC citizen spouse visa, Im guessing there are significant hurdles related to household residence.

In the end it’s often easier just to buy these long term visas through unofficial agents.

What you call “your own world” has more than often convinced authorities (and courts) and grants me a comfortable living standard.

I have provided the actual articles from the law, scanned my own Mainland China-issued documents and attached them to my posts here. What more do you want me to do?

Once your Taiwanese wife has a Taibaozheng and a registered address (that is different from household registration!), there is no reason for a PRC overseas mission not to issue you a visa type “L” with the purpose of joining your Chinese spouse. Once you are in Mainland China the PSB will treat you like any other foreign spouse.

I don’t quite understand what you mean with “household residence”. If by that you mean household registration, rest assured that there is no hurdle related that that. In fact a Shanghai woman who know lives in Beijing and maintains her Hukou (household registration) in Shanghai can still sponsor her foreign husband to join her in Beijing. As long as there is a registered address you are fine. Certain Mainland Chinese will actually have a more difficult time at this than Taiwanese.

Just as it is probably easier to live visa-exempt in Taiwan rather than on a JFRV. No need to get any marriage certificates authenticated or to pass a health exam. Once you passed the initial threshold your life will be much more comfortable though.

I am not alleging…I am outright saying that you are giving wrong advice.

You don’t understand the difference between a Taibaozheng and the entry exit permit stamp / sticker that you have to apply for when you are in China. EZ Travel will help get you a Taibaozheng which is valid for 5 years BUT you have to personally go to China, go to the PSB office as you call it and apply for an entry exit permit. This is only valid for one year and you can stay in China as long as you like and can leave and enter China as many times as you like within that one year. This permit has an expiry date.

Did I say the PSB gave me any trouble?? No they did not. I had to follow the same procedure as is followed by all holders of the Taibaozheng. The only benefit I had was that since I am married to a PRC citizen they gave me a entry permit valid for 3 years.

You keep saying Taiwanese don’t need a visa for China but they sure do need the entry exit permit stamp / sticker in their Taibaozheng. Taibaozheng may not expire for 5 years but the entry exit permit does have a validity date. You cannot enter China just using the Taibaozheng. If the permit in the Taibaozheng has expired they will tell you to go back. I know because it has happened to me personally. I wanted to enter from HK and the permit had expired. They told me to go back to HK, go to China travel agency and apply for a single entry permit, then come into China and go to the PSB and apply for the one year multiply entry permit.

I am sure CFI’s wife must have had the same problem. She had a Taibaozheng but she did not have a valid entry / exit permit stamp / sticker in the Taibaozheng. Do you me a favour and go check your Taibaozheng and then come back and give us your comments!!!

You also mentioned to HHII that there is no reason for a PRC overseas mission not to issue you the L type visa – this is China we are talking about, they do things w/o any reason or logic and you cannot even challenge them. If they want to refuse they will refuse and not even give you a logical explanation.

So if you don’t know the facts stop blowing your trumpet!!!

Bring it on with arguments or stop alleging I am giving any wrong advice.

I have honestly no idea why the local PSB gave you any trouble since you are not providing many details. Besides, as a Taiwanese your case is vastly different from a foreigner who applies for a spouse visa to Mainland China. Taiwanese do not get visas for Mainland China.[/quote]

I am not alleging…I am outright saying that you are giving wrong advice.

You don’t understand the difference between a Taibaozheng and the entry exit permit stamp / sticker that you have to apply for when you are in China. EZ Travel will help get you a Taibaozheng which is valid for 5 years BUT you have to personally go to China, go to the PSB office as you call it and apply for an entry exit permit. This is only valid for one year and you can stay in China as long as you like and can leave and enter China as many times as you like within that one year. This permit has an expiry date.

Did I say the PSB gave me any trouble?? No they did not. I had to follow the same procedure as is followed by all holders of the Taibaozheng. The only benefit I had was that since I am married to a PRC citizen they gave me a entry permit valid for 3 years.

You keep saying Taiwanese don’t need a visa for China but they sure do need the entry exit permit stamp / sticker in their Taibaozheng. Taibaozheng may not expire for 5 years but the entry exit permit does have a validity date. You cannot enter China just using the Taibaozheng. If the permit in the Taibaozheng has expired they will tell you to go back. I know because it has happened to me personally. I wanted to enter from HK and the permit had expired. They told me to go back to HK, go to China travel agency and apply for a single entry permit, then come into China and go to the PSB and apply for the one year multiply entry permit.

I am sure CFI’s wife must have had the same problem. She had a Taibaozheng but she did not have a valid entry / exit permit stamp / sticker in the Taibaozheng. Do you me a favour and go check your Taibaozheng and then come back and give us your comments!!!

You also mentioned to HHII that there is no reason for a PRC overseas mission not to issue you the L type visa – this is China we are talking about, they do things w/o any reason or logic and you cannot even challenge them. If they want to refuse they will refuse and not even give you a logical explanation.

So if you don’t know the facts stop blowing your trumpet!!![/quote]

CFI’s wife did not even have a Taibaozheng :loco: :loco:

I sent a formal letter via fax to the PRC embassy in Washington and will post their answer here in regard to L visas for the foreign spouse of a Taiwanese who lives in Mainland China on a Taibaozheng.

I suggest you to enter Mainland China with a Lüxingzheng as I did. You do not need any permit attached to it. The Lüxingzheng is valid for 2 years, but once you are in Mainland China the PSB will give you a permit that looks like a cardboard version of an ordinary ID card. In case your Lüxingzheng expired and you want to leave you need an entry/exit permit from the PSB. Downside: Lüxingzheng cannot be obtained from within Taiwan but only at PRC consulates and embassies.

For the record. After living in China for 18 years and on several occasions asking at PRC embassies and through agents if using my wife’s TBZ and residence certificate etc I could apply for PRC Family ‘Q1’ or Private ‘S1’ long term visa, I have always been told absolutely not. This is up to and as of September 2017.

I have always been told it is not even of any benefit, in terms of providing and invitation letter, in obtaining a short term 30 day Tourist ‘L’ visa. Although I believe, some consulates may accept this, though none I have dealt with.

The bottom line answer the OPs original question, from my experience and researches is “no”.

That is very strange. I personally know of Taiwanese/Foreign married couples where the foreign spouse has joined the Taiwanese spouse in Mainland China based on family relationship. I was told that the tricky thing is that usually a Hukou is required - but Taiwanese have their Hukou in Taiwan. To avoid any hassle, one can ask the PSB for a statement of residence/ entries and exits to show that the Taiwanese spouse really lives in Mainland China. Obviously, just showing a Taibaozheng isn’t good enough as it is only a plastic card and doesn’t show residence duration. In practice, things will probably differ from location to location, but it shouldn’t be a problem in 1st tier cities.

You may be right, location by location. Shoulds and hearsay may be correct. All I know is in Shanghai it is a total no go, maybe in the Taiwan enclaves like Kunshan and Dongguan the interpretation of ‘family’ and ‘compatriot’ may be more liberal. That is of course referring to renewing or converting a visa within China. Outside, applying for a visa from a Cconsulate or Embassy abroad in Hong Kong or Bangkok at least, it is absolutely impossible to use a Taiwanese citizen to obtain a long term Q1 or S1 visa.

I am also not sure whether visiting the PSB will be much help with providing their records. When my wife tried to obtain hers to prove she had lived in Shanghai for more than 5 years, the local PSB at which she had been registered simply said they were unavailable as they had moved location. What can you do if they will not give you your records?

Bottom line, Taiwanese are treated as foreigners in China in ~90% of situations excluding a few minor exceptions, or most often, exemption from some of the more stringent requirements placed on foreigners. For instance, in order to buy a property in some districts Taiwanese are not required to show income tax receipts whereas a foreigner would. In terms of business ownership, property ownership, in law suits, residency, foreign currency transfer, banking etc, etc, they are treated fundamentally no different from foreigners. The idea of Taiwanese being treated equally as Chinese citizens under the law in China is a complete fallacy.

This never happened to me or my circle of friends. Taiwanese wives not being able to procure documents is not completely unheard of however - even in Taiwan :slight_smile: It all comes down to knowing regulation and asking the right questions. The immigration sub-forum here is full of expats suffering the same when they rely on their Taiwanese wives to deal with the NIA in Taiwan.

Let us consider this on a material level first:

  1. Immigration: Taiwanese are to line up at “Chinese national” lines
  2. Train stations: Taiwanese can swipe their Taibaozheng to pick up tickets just as locals with their ID card
  3. Municipal services: Taiwanese get local treatment in Shanghai, e.g. housing, education, hospitals, and so on. This even places Taiwanese above the often-loathed 外地人 .
  4. Work permit: not required
  5. Residence permit: not required, the Taibaozheng is valid for 5 years and its conditions of issuance are tied to household registration in Taiwan - hence renewal is easy and cheap.
  6. Taiwanese can apply for household registration in Mainland China, rather than needing to apply for naturalization, after which they would experience no different treatment from authorities whatsoever (but would at the same time lose their household registration in Taiwan)
  7. Taiwanese can apply for both a PRC passport and a China Travel Document. Both documents explicitly state nationality as “Chinese” and “the bearer is a citizen of the People’s Republic of China.” Whereas hardly any Taiwanese applies for a PRC passport due to the same consequences as in (6), many Taiwanese residing overseas apply for China Travel Documents rather than a Taibaozheng, as the former can be issued on the spot.

These 6 differences are immense. I do not understand where you get your “90% treated as foreigners” from. There is continuous trend of Mainland China amending regulations so that Taiwanese can benefit from full local treatment.

Furthermore, on a formal level, the relevant regulations for issuance of Taibaozheng as well as the entry and stay of Taiwanese in Mainland China explicitly refer to Taiwanese as “Chinese citizens of the Taiwan Area.” (第二条 居住在大陆的中国公民(以下简称大陆居民)往来台湾地区(以下简称台湾)以及居住在台湾地区的中国公民(以下简称台湾居民)来往大陆,适用本办法。) 中国公民往来台湾地区管理办法.

Surely Mainland and Taiwan people experience different regulations/treatment. But that is also the case for Hong Kong and Macau people living in Mainland China. That does not change their nationality status as far as the government in Beijing is concerned. Consider that the regulations for foreign spouses in Taiwan also differ depending on the Taiwanese spouse having household registration or not.

They’ve abolished the “Taiwan residents” lines?

Dear hsinhai78, you clearly want to have a broader political discussion which is perfectly within your rights, however I have no axe to grind and you clearly have very strong views. May you continue to propagate them in an environment where freedom of expression exists.

You make valid points regarding some perks such as immigration queues and HSR tickets, but when it comes to business ownership and real estate ownership, I am sure you will agree, there is a long way to go.

However, interesting this discussion may be, I responded to this thread because I felt, and still do, that you were in error as regards your opinion that a foreign spouse can obtain a long term visa in China based upon their Taiwanese spouse and wished to share that with other forum members, just as you enjoy sharing your views.

To date I have seen nothing from you to refute my contention that a Taiwanese resident in China can NOT invite their foreign spouse to stay with them so the spouse can obtain a long term China visa. Please believe me, I would be frankly delighted if you are correct.

Other than that you know people who have, if you could provide actual specifics, such as consulates or embassies offering such visas, or immigration offices in China which accept such applications, it would be great.

The website of Shanghai municipal government has clear instructions on how to process a residence permit for the foreign spouse of a Mainland citizen, Hong Kong/Macao/Taiwan citizen, foreign citizen holding PR. See the following link: http://www.shanghai.gov.cn/nw2/nw38589/nw38718/index.html?MattersType=2&index=1&ParentClassID=54&ClassID=267&ElementTypeID=2&MatterID=45187

Required documents are 1) Taibaozheng and 2) evidence of a residence period of 6 months or more in Shanghai.

Foreign spouses not holding a Q1 visa need to submit evidence of the family relationship authenticated by the Chinese embassy in the foreigner’s home country (非持Q1签证入境的,还须提交家庭成员关系证明,系国外机构出具的,须经我驻外使领馆认证,并提供国内翻译机构出具的中文翻译件)

Hence, even if the Chinese embassy abroad gives you trouble and does not want to issue a Q1 visa, you can nevertheless apply with any visa provided you and your Taiwan spouse otherwise fulfill the requirements mentioned before.

Hard to believe that a savvy Shanghai expat as you, dear dpitcher, with a wife proficient in Mandarin Chinese cannot perform this simple task. In case you want to apply, please go to the following address:

周一至周六9:00—17:00
注:周六仅受理证件
浦东新区民生路1500号

Thanks for the link and street directions. I am very familiar with this office. Have you actually been there? Have you ever asked to make an application? I have, several times over many years.

The link you refer to is applicable to those being sponsored by ‘Chinese citizens’ and ‘Foreigners with Permanent Residency’, Taiwanese (I assume HK and Macau citizens) are deemed to be neither.

Any more specifics, based upon actual experience?

The regulation clearly mentions that it applies to Hong Kong, Macao, and Taiwan residents as well. I do not see your problem. I personally know of Western foreigners with Taiwanese spouses who did exactly this. Maybe print out the regulation and ask? I do not know your specifics - there could be many reasons why you run into these problems. Likewise, there are many people on this forum who constantly complain about the NIA in Taiwan, whereas for others it’s a breeze. Personally I am fortunate not to need a visa to reside in Mainland China.

Sorry, where does it mention " that it applies to Hong Kong, Macao, and Taiwan residents as well"

It mentions their requirements as applicants but not as sponsors.