US Presidential Election 2004 IV

And didn’t Bill Clinton also get the shot?

This really is turning into the most stupid election ever. It’s more like a husband wife argument than a real political debate. Can we put both teams in a room, lock the door and through away the key (and yes they can have flu jabs if they want).

It’s not the election that’s stupid, it’s the supporters. On both sides.

Seems every election year some folks bemoan the state of political campaigning and the general lack of civility involved, and seems too that I read an article like this every election year. Here are some excerpts from the article:

[quote]Whenever I hear the complaint that today’s politics has reached unprecedented levels of nastiness, I recall that poster from what was supposed to be a “golden age” of politics, brimming with civil discourse, bipartisanship, and national unity. In fact, politics for our parents’ “greatest generation” was just as boisterous, nasty, and over the top as it is today - indeed, as it always has been, for Americans.

Why? Because our democracy is grounded in realistic expectations about how politics would be conducted, once the rule of the “enlightened” few gave way to the sovereignty of the everyday person. The Founders believed, as James Madison noted in Federalist No. 10, that “So strong is this propensity of mankind to fall into mutual animosities, that where no substantial occasion presents itself, the most frivolous and fanciful distinctions have been sufficient to kindle their unfriendly passions and excite their most violent conflicts.”

Is incivility a new and growing threat to American politics? No. American politics has always been robust, edgy, overstated, and “simplistic.”

Only in the eyes of certain elites is our politics today more than ordinarily nasty. And the solutions to that nastiness just happen to augment the influence of those very elites. Though they argue for a transcendence of the Founders’ low expectations for American politics, even they live down to them. In the closing days of this election season, American citizens should celebrate, enjoy, and throw themselves into the exasperating, wonderful spectacle of our presidential election.[/quote]

Marshall Wittman, who with William Kristol was an early proponent of National Greatness Conservatism as well as a charter member of the neoconservative movement and who has thrown his support to Kerry, has some excellent suggestions for the President-elect. (Wittman aligned with John McCain rather than W in 2000; his differences with Bush largely centered over whether the threat from terrorism comes from ‘failed’ or ‘rogue’ states as well as nationbuilding tactics)

Wittman thinks the first order of business for whoever is President-elect is to undo the damage to American national unity done by Bush’s 9/12 return to 9/10 politics as usual, and I agree.

The US is unbelievably and bitterly fractured now; I find shocking the various ‘promises’ made (mostly in the undercurrent of American thought) by some on both sides to instigate some form of civil disorder no matter who’s elected (if Bush wins, some Dems have sworn to ‘fill the streets’, a few have even advocated what amounts to a limited civil war; if Kerry wins, some Bushies have advocated basically the same in Missouri, West Virginia, and Arkansas, all of which are uncomfortably located along ancient and still-fractionable national fault lines, imo).

No, I am not kidding. It’s that bad.

I find these arguments in favor of sedition are made even more disturbing due to the credibility of those proposing them, although they currently exist only at the fringes of public debate (thank God).

At any rate, here are Wittman’s comments. They’re directed at Kerry, but of course that doesn’t mean they’ll be implemented (it hardly even necessarily means they’ll be entertained). However, one of the very strong reasons, imo, to support Kerry is that I believe ideas like these are much more likely to be implemented under Kerry than under Bush. I have no doubt that, if Bush wins, then - given his first term - it will be politics as usual, f*** the loyal opposition, and damn the consequences. Kerry is the only candidate who can heal these deep divisions if only because Bush doesn’t/can’t/refuses to see them.

These ideas are excellent, imo, and there’s absolutely no way for them to be enacted under Bush.

From Wittman’s page:

[i]1. Construct a cabinet of national unity. Name Republicans to positions of prominence (and that does not mean HUD or Transportation).

  1. Focus on legislative issues that have bi-partisan support and span the ideological divide such as drug importation, patient

So I am working late and I get this anonymous message with an attachment from Republicans Abroad Taiwan. I then got another one from a friend, so this must be making the rounds. It took me a while to figure out what they meant by “start pushing the Guardian off the editorial pages”. Do Democrats also sit around and plot this way?

October 21, 2004
Let us meet this coming Monday, October 24, at the American Club, in the Chicago Room, to discuss, in particular, the following:

  1. The November 3 AmCham election party (with media)

  2. A possible celebration for that evening.

  3. Further media contacts and developments, i.e., to start pushing the Guardian off the editorial pages of the Taipei Times, the Taiwan News, etc.
    Looking forward to seeing you and welcoming you to our meeting next
    Monday, and with kind regards,

    Sincerely yours,

    E. F. Einhorn
    Chairman

So, some RINO nobody’s ever heard of joined up with the “New Democrats Online”, and this is important why, exactly??

Sorry, you were saying?

Actually, the “Bushies” are just sitting back and laughing at the dumbass hippies who are threatening to rush out and buy machine guns from the ice cream guys so that they can heroically defend the revolution.

Yeah, I know, those hippies really are pathetic.

Eh. The hippies aren’t really all that credible, although the union goons have shot at and invaded a few Bush campaign offices, oh, and attacked a five year old or two. Fortunately nobody’s gotten seriously injured yet. But a lot of Republicans are gun nuts, and actually know how to shoot. I predict a rather lopsided fight if the union goons actually pull any crap – not that they will, they’re a lot smarter than the hippies.

BWAHAHAHAHA! Man, you have a career ahead of you in net.comedy! Go ahead and quit your day job.

There’s a “loyal” opposition? I thought there were just the Democraps and comsimps, who are basically a disloyal bunch of traitorous scum.

Thank Buddha.

[quote=“flike”]From Wittman’s page:
… bunch of crap deleted …
[/quote]
Cool. Anyone got some nachos?

[quote=“Flicka”]So I am working late and I get this anonymous message with an attachment from Republicans Abroad Taiwan. I then got another one from a friend, so this must be making the rounds. It took me a while to figure out what they meant by “start pushing the Guardian off the editorial pages”. Do Democrats also sit around and plot this way?
[/quote]
Hmm? You think that the Democratic “strategy memo” telling everyone to make false accusations of minority-voter intimidation just came out of thin air??

The Republicans are meeting to plan their party, and to talk about how they can chat with the media to get their viewpoint printed.

The Democraps are meeting to discuss how they can spin, sue, intimidate, lie, and otherwise create havoc.

Which group is behaving properly?

[quote=“MaPoSquid”][quote=“Flicka”]So I am working late and I get this anonymous message with an attachment from Republicans Abroad Taiwan. I then got another one from a friend, so this must be making the rounds. It took me a while to figure out what they meant by “start pushing the Guardian off the editorial pages”. Do Democrats also sit around and plot this way?
[/quote]
Hmm? You think that the Democratic “strategy memo” telling everyone to make false accusations of minority-voter intimidation just came out of thin air??

The Republicans are meeting to plan their party, and to talk about how they can chat with the media to get their viewpoint printed.

The Democraps are meeting to discuss how they can spin, sue, intimidate, lie, and otherwise create havoc.

Which group is behaving properly?[/quote]

Oh, yes, I can just imagine that Tammy woman and the gang sitting around trying to see how they can spin, sue and intimidate.

No one mailed me the Democrat’s strategy memo, but this hits a little closer to home. They are meeting to plan their party? The AmCham election party is not their party, even if the GOP does win.

QED

:laughing:

flike,

I disagree with the suggestions from that fellow. Look, whoever wins can fill his cabinet with whoever he wants, and most likely they will be people from his own party. The nation is not fractured. People simply support different political candidates… its a democracy, after all.

I predict that the US people will elect… [color=green]
a shrubbery!
[/color]

[quote]Kerry was hunting for geese

foxnews.com/story/0,2933,136153,00.html

Tigerman:

Your father is a doctor in Pennsylvania. Why don’t you chime in with some of the stuff that is going on in that state that make it nigh impossible for doctors to practice any more because of lawyers like John Kerry.

I’m surprized this video of Edwards doing his hair hasn’t been posted.

He likes his hair just right… :laughing: :unamused: What a girlie boy.

Run out of issues to discuss have we?

Not at all. I just think that if mofangongren can use for his avatar a picture of Bush after he took a spill on his mountain bike, then, who would complain about posting the Edwards hair video.

And c’mon… Edwards does look like a girlie boy in the video, doesn’t he?

Its politics in an election season…

I much prefer the footage of Wolfowitz lubin’ up his comb with a great wad of spit and running it through his hair – not once but twice. He then gets some goo onto his fingers and starts tweaking his hair.

Yeah, that’s how a real man does his hair, right Tigerman?

How about the footage of Bush wearing wildly rouged makeup, with lots of people hovering over him putting his every hair into place. Is that how a real man does it?

teresa, how much damage can she do to the kerry campaign with her big mouth?

kerry, hunting geese makes vegan treehugger dems squeal and gives the nra great ad material.

forumosa liberals, don’t quote polls you’re going to dismiss later when they show bush ahead. :wink:

Hmmmm this could be interesting. All polls show strong Republican trends in the Senate and House. If Kerry is making such an effort to “play soccer” and “hunt geese,” as a president with such a strong republican congress looking at his every move, would he also feel the need to display his “manly strength” by invading Syria and Iran? With the right pressure, he caves. Even the Democrats admit that. They just hate Bush more. But given his personality and his “caving” wouldn’t we be well placed to push him into taking strong action, action that really Bush is no longer capable of taking because of the media and public outcry? There would be silence if Kerry were to attack Syria right? It would be the Nixon going to China, Clinton reforming welfare thing. What do you think the chances are?