What happens to president horsey


#181

One of the commonly used tactics by the Chinese when talking to a Taiwanese is to persuade Taiwan that the world contains only China and Taiwan. The tactic is used both by the Chinese on the other side of the strait and the Chinese on this side of the strait.

The same tactic is known as G2 persuasion by the American. The Chinese speak to the American in a G2 world.

With regard to the Japanese, China invoked a pre-Korea war world.

The 3 worlds are 3 manifestations of the same.[/quote]

I do not see how this series of statements addresses my question at all.

Do you not see that your proposal of a federation consisting of the U.S., Japan, and Taiwan is completely unrealistic, if not only because the U.S. and Japan would never have any of it?

I mean I assume that Hok was asking for your opinion on a realistic resolution to Taiwan’s status. I seriously doubt that there is another poster on this forum that thinks your proposed federation is a realistic possibility.[/quote]

While I also find sofun’s proposal to be surprising, it struck me that most of the possible solutions to Taiwan’s long term status might seem unrealistic to many.

Full Independence - unrealistic because China will probably start a war

ROC Reconquest of China - unrealistic for military and many other reasons

PRC’s One Country Two Systems Unification - unrealistic because Taiwanese people will never accept it (quite possibly the only thing that the Greens and Blues agree on; alas, this is my preferred outcome)

Aside from “the status quo”, the only proposals I’m aware of that aren’t entirely unrealistic involve aome kind of con/federalistic or “dominion” system that allows Taiwan to retain its separate “sovereignty” but somehow still links Taiwan into an ambiguous “China”. Of course, once people start actually fleshing out the specifics, I’m sure the whole plan again becomes “unrealistic.”


#182

[quote=“hansioux”]someone recently ranked the top 10 kongfus in the world (fictional and real), and Ma’s Handshake of Death is number 3.

Getting hit by this kongfu is said to result in illness or publicly disgraced at the least, those who got a direct hit could even die of unknown causes.

So far the tallies of known cases are:
Major injury or death: 37
Major disaster: 10
Losing mojo: 14
Major accident: 13
Divorces: 4
Unexplained damages to aviation equipment: 34
Bankrupted corporations: 2

The effectiveness of the handshake of death is attested by a comment stating her dad shook President Ma’s hand twice, and both times ended up staying at the hospital soon after.

Another comment marvelled at her dad’s resiliency.[/quote]

I better watch out then. I shook Ma’s hand once.


#183

[quote=“hansioux”]someone recently ranked the top 10 kongfus in the world (fictional and real), and Ma’s Handshake of Death is number 3.

Getting hit by this kongfu is said to result in illness or publicly disgraced at the least, those who got a direct hit could even die of unknown causes.

So far the tallies of known cases are:
Major injury or death: 37
Major disaster: 10
Losing mojo: 14
Major accident: 13
Divorces: 4
Unexplained damages to aviation equipment: 34
Bankrupted corporations: 2

The effectiveness of the handshake of death is attested by a comment stating her dad shook President Ma’s hand twice, and both times ended up staying at the hospital soon after.

Another comment marvelled at her dad’s resiliency.[/quote]

This is the funniest thing I will read all day for sure. Can I repost on Facebook, or if you’ve done it already can I share? I think I know who you are. :laughing:


#184

[quote=“Zhengzhou2010”]
Aside from “the status quo”, the only proposals I’m aware of that aren’t entirely unrealistic involve aome kind of con/federalistic or “dominion” system that allows Taiwan to retain its separate “sovereignty” but somehow still links Taiwan into an ambiguous “China”. Of course, once people start actually fleshing out the specifics, I’m sure the whole plan again becomes “unrealistic.”[/quote]

Any type of integration with China is unrealistic as long as China remains a non-ally of US.

The Taiwan Federation that I spoke of is one that is integrated with both Japan and US. It is not the kind you envision.

This is not a conspiracy theory because nothing is unrealistic about what I say. When Dr.Ko won the election I was the very first one on this forum to point out the significance of the election is that the result is one-step further toward regional integration within Formosa. Now we have Chu talking about some sort of “constitutional reform” possibly of a westminster system, albeit in the roc framework.

ps I am not here to win a popularity contest.


#185

[quote=“sofun”]Taiwan should develop into a federation that is dependent on both US and Japan, and independent of China.

Given that China has decided to become the Russia of the Orient, it is not in Taiwan’s self interest to be independent from US and Japan. An independent Taiwan becomes viable only if China were to become in the same civilization camp as US and Japan. If China is not, then an independent state will likely be annexed by China in a short period of time, assuming non-interference from US and Japan. This is because independent states still have the potential of being merged or annexed. See for example, Korea, and Singapore’s constitution. Again, if China were to become in the same civilization camp as US and Japan, then an independent Formosa would be beneficial to all Japan, US, Taiwan, and China in the long run. (Think 300+years instead of 30 years.)

Alternatively the worst case scenario is the Korea peninsula example, or the Ireland example: meaning that an indepdendent Taiwan state is backed by US and Japan but some territory is carved out, for example Jinmen and Mazu. Half a Korea is still a Korea state. ¾ of an Ireland is still a Ireland State.

Taiwan’s independence will be accepted by the Chinese if Taiwan becomes English or Taigi with its own writing system. Mandarin puts Taiwan at great risk. I won’g go further because this is the irony only someone who really understands Chinese-ness can comprehend.

A Federal Government of Taiwan assuming the role of Taiwan Authority as per TRA will be popularly accepted by Formosan. There are many examples in the world where the figurehead is a Monarch or a Governor General. For example Malaysia and Canada. This is full autonomy currently supported by US.[/quote]

I find myself completely turned off by the idea of adopting English in Taiwan (sounds like post-colonial Stockholm Syndrome), but the rest of your argument makes a lot of sense. I don’t personally feel it’s the right way to go, but it’s one possible future for Taiwan, and I do like when people think outside the box. Thanks for sharing!


#186

[quote=“Taiwanguy”]
I better watch out then. I shook Ma’s hand once.[/quote]

it all depends on one’s resiliency.

Take famous baseball players for example:

Chien-ming Wang, shook president Ma’s hand back in 2008.

He injured his leg rounding off third base during a game at Houston that same year. He hasn’t been on the starting rotation of any MLB team for a full season since.

林智勝 shook President Ma’s hand after the World Baseball Classic, on March 21st 2013.

Jul 17 of the same year, Lin got into a serious car crash, broken his leg, out for the rest of the season.


#187

[quote=“Mucha Man”]
This is the funniest thing I will read all day for sure. Can I repost on Facebook, or if you’ve done it already can I share? I think I know who you are. :laughing:[/quote]

I found those comments here:

shareba.com/?do=/blog/156832/


#188

Man! Ngayaw Ake got hurt? I did not know about it. I did not know… One of my favourite players. I totally didn’t notice.


#189

[quote=“Mr He”][quote=“Taiwanguy”]Here’s the quote in full:

Rough translation: “Of course the judiciary should be independent, but it cannot be isolated from society and must not deviate from the reasonable expectations of the people. The judiciary must safeguard the interests of good people. That is the bare minimum of justice.”[/quote][/quote]

There’s a precedent:

15 Now at the feast the governor was accustomed to releasing to the multitude one prisoner whom they wished. 16 And at that time they had a notorious prisoner called Barabbas.[c] 17 Therefore, when they had gathered together, Pilate said to them, “Whom do you want me to release to you? Barabbas, or Jesus who is called Christ?” 18 For he knew that they had handed Him over because of envy.
19 While he was sitting on the judgment seat, his wife sent to him, saying, “Have nothing to do with that just Man, for I have suffered many things today in a dream because of Him.”
20 But the chief priests and elders persuaded the multitudes that they should ask for Barabbas and destroy Jesus. 21 The governor answered and said to them, “Which of the two do you want me to release to you?”
They said, “Barabbas!”
22 Pilate said to them, “What then shall I do with Jesus who is called Christ?”
They all said to him, “Let Him be crucified!”
23 Then the governor said, “Why, what evil has He done?”
But they cried out all the more, saying, “Let Him be crucified!”
24 When Pilate saw that he could not prevail at all, but rather that a tumult was rising, he took water and washed his hands before the multitude, saying, “I am innocent of the blood of this just Person.[d] You see to it.”


#190

Seeing the sorry state of affairs the world is in, there is more to it than “liking” - it is desperately needed, in Taiwan and elsewhere.

:2cents:


#191

Federalism is something that the CPC opposes; I believe it was Lien Chan that floated the idea (in the 90’s?). They want full sovereignty as can be evinced by Hong Kong. Don’t ever trust the CPC.


#192

[quote=“yuli”][quote=“Mr He”][quote=“Taiwanguy”]Here’s the quote in full:

Rough translation: “Of course the judiciary should be independent, but it cannot be isolated from society and must not deviate from the reasonable expectations of the people. The judiciary must safeguard the interests of good people. That is the bare minimum of justice.”[/quote][/quote]

There’s a precedent:

15 Now at the feast the governor was accustomed to releasing to the multitude one prisoner whom they wished. 16 And at that time they had a notorious prisoner called Barabbas.[c] 17 Therefore, when they had gathered together, Pilate said to them, “Whom do you want me to release to you? Barabbas, or Jesus who is called Christ?” 18 For he knew that they had handed Him over because of envy.
19 While he was sitting on the judgment seat, his wife sent to him, saying, “Have nothing to do with that just Man, for I have suffered many things today in a dream because of Him.”
20 But the chief priests and elders persuaded the multitudes that they should ask for Barabbas and destroy Jesus. 21 The governor answered and said to them, “Which of the two do you want me to release to you?”
They said, “Barabbas!”
22 Pilate said to them, “What then shall I do with Jesus who is called Christ?”
They all said to him, “Let Him be crucified!”
23 Then the governor said, “Why, what evil has He done?”
But they cried out all the more, saying, “Let Him be crucified!”
24 When Pilate saw that he could not prevail at all, but rather that a tumult was rising, he took water and washed his hands before the multitude, saying, “I am innocent of the blood of this just Person.[d] You see to it.”[/quote]

And there’s more recent precedent:

[quote]For establishing himself on the wrong side of segregation and white supremacy, [Judge Richard] Rives was ostracized and harassed as a traitor to his state and his race for the rest of his life. His only friends in his hometown of Montgomery seemed to be former New Dealer and civil rights advocate attorney Clifford Durr and U.S. District Judge Frank Johnson – who was himself enormously important to the cause of civil rights in Alabama and the South, and who was the concurring judge in Browder. Having Rives on the panel offered the plaintiffs a flicker of hope in an otherwise dark room.[/quote]–from Joseph Mark Bagley,“School Desegregation, Law and Order, and Litigating Social Justice in Alabama, 1954-1973.” Dissertation, Georgia State University, 2014
scholarworks.gsu.edu/cgi/viewcon … story_diss

[quote]State Senator Sam Englehardt declared that “the real white people of Alabama [will] never [] forget the names of [Judges] Rives and Johnson. Nothing they can ever do would rectify this great wrong they have done to the good people of this state.” An anonymous caller told Judge Rives’s wife to “enjoy your husband while you can. You won’t have him long.” Rives’s son’s grave was desecrated by vandals.[/quote]–from Amanda Frost, “Honoring Your Oath in Political Times,” Pound Civil Justice Institute, 2013 Forum for State Appellate Judges
poundinstitute.org/docs/2013Poun … st2013.pdf


#193

[quote=“sofun”][quote=“Zhengzhou2010”]
Aside from “the status quo”, the only proposals I’m aware of that aren’t entirely unrealistic involve aome kind of con/federalistic or “dominion” system that allows Taiwan to retain its separate “sovereignty” but somehow still links Taiwan into an ambiguous “China”. Of course, once people start actually fleshing out the specifics, I’m sure the whole plan again becomes “unrealistic.”[/quote]

Any type of integration with China is unrealistic as long as China remains a non-ally of US.

The Taiwan Federation that I spoke of is one that is integrated with both Japan and US. It is not the kind you envision.

This is not a conspiracy theory because nothing is unrealistic about what I say. When Dr.Ko won the election I was the very first one on this forum to point out the significance of the election is that the result is one-step further toward regional integration within Formosa. Now we have Chu talking about some sort of “constitutional reform” possibly of a westminster system, albeit in the roc framework.

ps I am not here to win a popularity contest.[/quote]

Sofun,

Thanks. I recognize that the federation you are referring to covers US/Japan and is thus different from the China federation I mentioned.

I am strongly in support of all us Forumosans expressing our views here and sparking interesting discussion. Like Hok, I appreciate out of the box thinking and even when I disagree, I find it very interesting to consider new ideas.

Personally, as a Red, I know that I won’t be winning any popularity contests here either! I’m glad we have this place where all ends of the political spectrum can exchange our views.


#194

There are two things that I talked about.

One is a Federal Government of Taiwan, which will resemble that of Canada or US. The federal government is a stable framework for 5~7 states on Formosa, and safeguard an independent democracy. The federation can very easily accommodate the existence and perpetuity of the roc in some context, through legislating an “Roc Relations Act.” The federation also guarantees the self-determination of Jinmen and Mazu, should they feel no need to join the federation.

The other is Taiwan’s integration with the rest of the pacific, namely US and Japan, which is of high level. The integration will involve many aspects from economy to military.


#195

As of today, Horsey is accused of exactly the same thing as peddling influence, the reason that former president CBS is in jail for.

The event is unfolding, staring Horsey and DingXin, the king of instant noodles of China, the master craftsman of gutter oil, and the board and CEO of Taipei 101, the bulk-buyers of Di-bao luxury residences, the bid winner of 4G network, among other titles.

(to TGM(mod) this is not gibberish. I’m just faithfully providing the context. These titles are facts do not require web links to back up. )

The journalist who writes about this hints at involvement at the national security level. (To Taiwanguy, this is not a conspiracy and does not require links. The journalist’s source comes from unnamed top national-security person, according to herself.)


#196

sofun, links are useful also to keep a conversation going. Why not just provide people with links so they can read about this story themselves?


#197

okay. Please see my-formosa.com/article.aspx?cid=5&id=72933 and major news talk shows.


#198

[quote=“sofun”]

(to TGM(mod) this is not gibberish. I’m just faithfully providing the context. These titles are facts do not require web links to back up. )

The journalist who writes about this hints at involvement at the national security level. (To Taiwanguy, this is not a conspiracy and does not require links. The journalist’s source comes from unnamed top national-security person, according to herself.)[/quote]

[color=#008000]~~~Mod’s note:
“Conext”, as you describe it, is merely unsubstantiated opinion, without links. Leaving one well open to one’s post being labelled gibberish, or conspiracy-minded.
Supplying links is accepted practice in most discussion forums. This is not a chat room, and as MM noted, providing a link is common courtesy.
Thank you in advance for your future co-operation in this matter.
[/color]


#199

Ding Xin. See the following Wiki entries

zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/康師傅
zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/台灣之星
stormmediagroup.com/opencms/ … 2804cba5a1
zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/頂新國際集團
zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/旺旺中時併購中嘉案

Behind all of these activities are the financial activities that Central Bank Chairman criticizes on record. (youtube.com/watch?v=E_849wV2Aqs). These are relevant context not because I say they are, but because the aforementioned journalist who exposed Ma’s peddling influence says they are. She is on 5 shows per night according to herself and I’m sure if you watch one you won’t miss it. The unnamed source of the journalist from the national-intel circle is in the eye-witness protection program, according to herself. This one there is no link because she said in on public tv. You’d have to search for it in newspapers. Or, you’ll read about it in a few days.

Latest update in English can be read on Taipei Times here. taipeitimes.com/News/front/a … 2003607765 . The banks are giving Ding Xin 3 days to do what the banks demand for. But speaking from my experience, a bank can freeze an account without notifying the account owner.


#200

Great post, sofun. Thanks for this.