we have the right to disagree.
yes they are people in AFRICA, IN EUROPE ( WEST AND EAST) AND IN TAIWAN who behave exactly like the mainlanders
ps: africa is a continent with many countries and 1.2 billions persons.
i guess you are talking about one country, probably a couple of cities in that country and for sure not more than 20 main roads. you have been there for a year.
reply following…
i mean iam just saying, stop putting everyone in the same basket.
I am going to put everyone in the same basket in China because they represent the same culture and their culture puts a really big stress on being the same, homogenous and similar. Everybody must think, act and behave in the same way, unlike in the West or in other non-western cultures. The way the communist party tells them to think, behave and act. everything else must be discouraged at best or distroyed at worst.
So yes, making sweeping generalisations is actually what the Chinese would encourage themselves and thats exactly the same way they project their own experience on other cultures (Western culture being American).
Some mainlanders may seem more educated, polite and polished but sooner or later they will show their pushy, disrespectful side. Its enough to spend enough time with them.
What do you know about me and my travels in Africa, I have travelled extensively around Africa. People in Arab countries can be annoying in their on way but they represent the level of politeness and respect towards strangers that the Chinese dont do, because they are more of an insider -outsider culture so in their twisted socipathic mainland way outsiders are worth nothing. If you sometimes have a feeling that a mainlander is being nice and helpful its all really about them, not you. You will learn soon enough when you try to object to something they are imposing on you under the cover of “politeness”.
And if someone really likes to dig deeper under the surface of such shallow terms like “booming economy” and “development” you can take a look at the prosperity index published every year by the Legatum Institute. China last year was merely number 90 with a lot of factors actually getting worse than better. The “Economy”, however, is improving.
disagree - and will not comment
my mistake - i misread and thought u have lived there for a year ( it was for china)
i lived in dubai for just a year - hate all of them especially the ranking among races---- ( and sorry for using the word race as we are ALL from the same race: the human race) i mean how you get paid or serviced because of your nationality. politness out of the window when you are not white ---- i left my job and dubai because my boss refused to let my staff go on holiday ( they were JUST south east asian for him)
at least they have the merit of being straight —
what do you think arabs for example want from you when you are there and covered with compliments ( just MONEY — OR LABOUT, SKILLS) — so many super millionaire get kickout without a cents once they are at the top — ( except some free zone there, if you want your business in the city, well you own only 49% of YOUR company—)
happen to me quiet often here ( this is a very recurrent topic here on forumosa) -
hey, let’s agree to disagree — you will not be able to make me change my point of view- I strongly believe that what you apply to the rest of the world should be applied for Chinese too.
now let’s get back to the topic: ‘’ WHT’S REALLY WRONG WITH MAINLAND TOURIST HERE?‘’‘’
my answer= not much — need time for education
Arabs are extremely polite to wanted guests and hospitality stands very high on the ladder of Arab cultural values. I have been treated like a queen in Arab countries and people never wanted anything in return.
In China they always wanted something in return. I have been tricked many times into scams when people pretended to be friendly locals who invite you for a cup of tea that you have to pay for later. Never happened to me in Africa even once and now that is a poor continent (in general).
‘‘to wanted guest’’- LOL ( i hope you are not serious)
same with those guys
70 to 80% of the main labor comes from south east asia with 7 days a week of work and a salary of 1500 aed =13000nt$ ( and iam being generous)
more than 5 in one rooms -no air con
no holidays - their passport is taken out
without them, not a single building will rise
without them not a single dish comes out from any and i said ANY restaurant or fast food there
but i guess they are the ‘‘unwanted guest’’ because???
did you watch the qatar marathon???
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/04/02/slaves-to-run-shoeless-in-qatar.html
or maybe you should just google ‘‘construction worker in dubai’’
ps: sorry for using the word ‘‘workers’’ — ‘‘slave’’ is more appropriated
But it happens in every single country in the world. Including China, which is one of the most populous countries in the world ad still gets migrant workers.
Legal and illegal immigration is globally the source of underpaid verging on slavery labor force. there are thousands of such people in your developed and civilised country too, i dont know why you decided to single out dubai.
so what does it have to do with the price of tea in Beijing and the mainlanders being rude in taiwan (and 210 other countries as well)?
well i was just responding to your comments that i have found to be very harsh.
Regarding Dubai, we are talking about LEGAL immigration.
I personally hate that country and their people- i use the word HATE- this is my opinion about who they think they are. same with the saudi and all the rest of them-
i left that place just because of how ‘‘non white’’ people are treated and i am white.
We are talking about super mega rich arab countries, where the only laws are their laws. However, because they provide such good service to us ( white developed country), we just have to turn an eye on what is really happening there. This would never happen in any other given place on earth.
ps= did you hear about some bombing going on in yemen – or maybe there are unwanted news to be put on tv or just double check on internet.
that is what i cant stand.
already answred that
I’ve known African refugees in the US. They do their laundry in the toilet bowl.
They’re not necessarily bad people. They just don’t know what they’re doing. Gotta cut them some slack.
On the other hand, there are plenty of awful people in Africa. That’s why there are refugees.
I dont mind people doing their laundry in the toilet bowl. It means they are clean.
Chinese in the winter dont wash at all, they stink for months.
Not that Africans are particulary clean either, they just dont pretend to be numbawan country in the world and dont preach you about 5000 years of civilisiation on every step. While they spit on your feet and elbow the hell out of you. And in fact they could, everything started in Africa.
I had a client that comes from Beijing to party and I would set up his whole deal. Hotels, clubs, girls, etc. The dude legit spits in the lobby of the hotel, I was blown out of my mind.
I spent some time up on the Buddhist mountain again and there were mainland members there, parents and Children. They were nice, polite. no spitting and friendly.
I guess they are “educated” and come from the same backgrounds as educated people in Taiwan do.
Question: These bad Chinese tourists? Are they lower class people who just got enough money for a vacation or are they professionals or semi professionals like Doctors, car salesmen and the like? I will pay attention next time we go to a Tourist site which sadly is not often.
It sounds like you ran into individual Chinese tourists that applied to visit Taiwan by themselves.
People here are mainly against Chinese tour groups, which evolved out of the ECFA deal, giving Chinese tour organizations the ability to run a monopoly here in Taiwan.
These tour organizations own the hotels, the buses, the gift shops, the restaurants that their Chinese group tourists are forced to go to. The benefits of monopolizing Chinese group tourism is that Chinese tourist companies can cut their tour package prices, making Taiwan tours seem affordable to the average Chinese people, then force them to buy overpriced luxury items at their gift shops to make a profit. When tourists don’t buy the luxury items, they actually get threatened with no food or abandonment.
These Chinese tourists were sheltered from interacting with the locals. Their tour guides were all hired by Chinese controlled tour companies, who would reinforce Chinese’ propaganda, instead of telling them a balanced view of the local perspective. What’s worse is that being in a group often emboldens these Chinese tourists to act out their prejudice views. They would not only ignore signs and rules, but when asked to follow the rules they would insist Taiwan is a part of China and as such they are free to do whatever they want. With mob mentality to back them up, these tourists have smoked in Alisan’s forest, beaten people who informed them it’s a nonsmoking area. They have also snap off living corals, and beaten the guide to told them not to.
Local tourism businesses profits very little from these Chinese tourist groups. The sheer number of these tour groups before the last election meant Taiwan’s famous destinations were packed with tourists who contributed next to nothing to the local economy. The crowd and their behavior turned away local and international tourist alike.
With these Chinese group tours now being frowned upon in China, because they want to boycott the Tsai administration, Taiwan’s tourism saw an increase of 2.4%. That’s in spite of a 16% decline of Chinese tourists.
No other post is necessary to explain mainland tourists “problem” from the past 4-8 years.
Thank you @hansioux
great post.
Make Taiwan Tourism Great Again!
Whoa! citation?
What Hotels? Aren’t the workers of these hotels local residents who must in spend the money in the community?
Citation? I really would like to read these stories.
http://www.appledaily.com.tw/realtimenews/article/new/20160909/945874/
http://www.chinatimes.com/newspapers/20131008000984-260309
This one is in Hong Kong, but basically the same deal
http://www.chinatimes.com/newspapers/20160503000874-260301
There’s more, just google 陸客 導遊
Monopoly isn’t good for anyone except for those running it. Monopoly isn’t free market, and as such Taiwan’s tourism suffered greatly. Money aren’t put in to provide the best service, but to cater to the will of those running the monopoly, and stops being competitive to non-Chinese tourists.
At the same time, the lack of resources and crowded tourist destination dries up customers for those not involved in the monopoly. If Taiwan’s entire tourism industry is dependent on this monopoly, then getting boycott by the Chinese government means the collapse of the industry.
The affected business owners were mobilized last year to go on a protest. The funny thing is if the overall tourists visiting Taiwan increased, why couldn’t these businesses involved in the Chinese tour group monopoly make money off it? Simply put, they provide services no one wants, and if the Chinese tourists were given a choice, they probably wouldn’t stay or shop at those places either.
They stationed two police officers at Yeliu because they can’t stop Chinese tourists from climbing it.
Police arrested Chinese tourist from damaging and collecting a bag full of living coral
http://www.appledaily.com.tw/realtimenews/article/new/20150610/626021/
Another smashing coral incident, the Chinese tour group guide said to the authorities “don’t open tourism if you can’t take it”
http://www.appledaily.com.tw/appledaily/article/headline/20130914/35294759/
Chinese tourists at Alisan beating a local who asked them not to smoke and not to be so loud on the forest trail. The local was accompanying a Chinese friend who visited Taiwan sans tour group.
Seeker, turn on the TV or ask any local travel agent. That the locals are disgusted with these unfair business practices towards the Mainlanders tells you a lot.
I also presneted an example from one article where a hotel owner said they were offering rooms for 600 ntd to Mailanders but no one was coming, so they would fail. Now, if you have slashed your prices 50% only for one market, and no one is coming, wouldn’t you say there is a bigger reason for it? And if that market isn’t responding, why not open up to other markets? If you are already losing everything -the money quote was that any other loses were jkust kicking on a dead dog- and you see your business as a dead dog, why not try selling your services to locals or Jorean sor whatever markets at that same 600 ntd price? Why?
There is a collusion that allows almost mafia style business to survive. And to make matters worse, this kind of businesss all support the mentality of “we must attach ourselves to Chinese economy or die”. They refuse to look up or around. Only down. Lower prices, lower quality, insure monopoly. They do not want to acknowledge that the increase dependency in a single market weakens the economy overall. And kills their business in the short run.
Recently, there was a Chinese tour bus accident down South. News coverage was ample even though injuries severe not severe. All of the news pieces carry the story of last year’s killer driver. During the investigation of that incident, many unethical practices like the ones mentioned were publicly exposed. Yet now each accident or incident with bus tours is linked to the killer, not the companies. The message that Taiwna is not safe for Mainlanders is reinforced. One wonders why.
There is always more money to be made from loses than winning in business.
Recently there was an article where a Japanese coffee shop owner was lamenting that the Taiwanese tourists’ behaviour has also seen a decline over the years. Massive tourism reaching the bottom of the pile? Superiority complexes from suddenly feeling into money? Brain washing against other countries, especially Japan? If thsi can happen to Taiwanese, imagine Mainlanders with a lot less access to outside influences and too much propaganda/disposable cash.
The number still augmented because there were still a lot of these Chinese tour groups during the first half of 2016, then it went down. It is likely that the number will drop in 2017, especially with the Korean rape incident.
I don’t think of it as a big deal though. There’s no reason to rely on tourism too much, besides the infrastructure for tourists is crap, I feel like we’ve already had enough tourists for our merits.