A hell of a time with a 7-yr-old boy

Hi Forumosans:

New here and wondering if any of you is dealing with boys around 7 year old at the moment…

Our 7-yr-old moved to Taiwan with us a year ago and started a local regular grade school. He is doing great at school and the teacher said that he’s got many friends and get around well. However, for the past year or so, he has gotten to be very difficult–doesn’t listen to us, disrespectful, loud, rude, disregard any of our requests (such as, time for bed, brush teeth, clean up, walk the dog, etc.) His brother is a year and 2 months now, and he treats him, often, like he is the same age as him.

I cannot not get upset with him because the way he talks to us. I am at the point where I think he is really driving me crazy and I wonder how he got to be like this. I am feeling like we are dealing with a teenager. Any suggestions? :unamused:

kids will often try to get away with what you let them do.

the way you state your question makes me wonder if yiou have a problem in this area. for example, time for bed. at 7 it is clearly physically impossible for your boy to be out of bed at the proper time unless you have by defenition allowed that situation to occur.

why can you not get upset? i would be and i think in a few more years you could potentially be a lot more upset.

[quote=“Tempo Gain”]kids will often try to get away with what you let them do.

the way you state your question makes me wonder if yiou have a problem in this area. for example, time for bed. at 7 it is clearly physically impossible for your boy to be out of bed at the proper time unless you have by defenition allowed that situation to occur.

why can you not get upset? I would be and I think in a few more years you could potentially be a lot more upset.[/quote]
I agree. You can’t do much with a 17 year old rebel, but a seven year old rebel should be quickly schooled in the harsh realities of the household hierarchy. Don’t ask him for his best behaviour, require it, and be fair and consistent with punishment or praise depending on how he responds to your expectations. It’s not a contradiction to love a kid and implement law and order in the household at the same time. A happy kid is one who knows what the limits are.

We had a very similar experience with our son. He started going to a local public school, and suddenly his behaviour starting going all to hell. I am not blaming this on the public school, but my feeling at the time was that he was just unhappy in general, and stressed out. There is A LOT of pressure on the kids to perform well, even in the early grades. For instance, my son’s teacher (who is a sweet lady, very kind) would publicly berate the kids who didn’t score more than 90% on any exam.

Also, I would take just about anything the teacher says with a grain of salt. Often our son’s teacher would say things that I think she thought we wanted to hear, rather than the truth.

We took him out of that school and put him in a much smaller one. His attitude and overall behaviour improved almost overnight, as he was no longer being pressured all the time. He has less homework and more friends. He sleeps better and wakes up happier these days.

Not sure what else to say. Of course this was our experience and your mileage may vary.

At 7 kids have this period when they act like little teenagers or big babies. But you should also think of the fact that within the past 14 months he has moved to another country, gone to a new school and got a baby brother. No wonder he’s impossible not to get upset with.

Now, instead of yelling at the kid, think what bothers him most. He’s probably jealous of his little brother. A 7yo understand that the 1yo is NOT the same age as him - it sounds to me that he is trying to ridicule him. He throws a ball into the kid’s face to show that HE is better than his little bro, who is too stupid to even catch a ball.

He just wants your attention - with the baby around, you probably don’t have enough time to spend quality time with him - so he goes for the negative attention, whatever it takes to be noticed.

It’s difficult to change this pattern of behaviour now. The more harsh you are, the worse it gets - unless he became totally scared of you and started to hide things from you. :s

Would it be possible for you to have 1 hour EVERY day when you could be just for him. No stupid baby brothers, TV-s, chores etc. Just you and him and having fun. He would know that the Happy Hour would come and give you a break during the rest of the day. I know it helps with 2-3-year-olds, I don’t have much experience with older children. :idunno:

Dear Forumosans:

Thanks for the very valuable thoughts so far–between last night and today, I have become one of the Forumosan myself. :notworthy:

I know that no one is born to be a natural parent and know all that there is to know to be a good one. I am sure having a tough time at the moment. Finding this forum is like finding heaven to me–as now we have been away from the States for one year now and not really have many friends here just as yet, to talk about kids or anything at all. :frowning:

What bothers me the most is that he is so self-centered, very selfish, not wanting to help the family (I have tried to pay him for helping doing chores, for getting TV and/or PC times, etc. w only 5 mins success.) He is very rude, loud, disrespectful, harsh, critical, ant just anything you could think of. It’s very uncomfortable for me to be around him in public… :fume:
His attitude makes me feel like he is the one who is running the show at all times, i.e. He is the boss…

Oh well. I am very glad that I’ve got you guys to talk to now though. :slight_smile:

Do you think it would be possible for you to sit down with the kid and talk to him about it. Not when you or he is upset - you’d have to find a quiet moment when you’re both in a normal mood and there are no distractions (like the baby crying or his favourite cartoons on the tele).
Don’t throw accusations at him, just tell him that you don’t know what to do and ask HIM for an advice. Maybe he would help you find out the reasons why he’s acting like this. Ask him what he thinks would help make him feel better - more attention, more privacy, more independence, a vacation - whatever.

He is seven years old, he knows what is ok and what is not. He knows he’s been terrible. But before you can do something about it, you need to find out WHY he’s doing this.

All the best, I hope things will work out for you and your son one way or another.
(My kid is only 13 months old, so everything I write is fiction, based on what I’ve read or heard from other parents.)

Kids only very rarely act up simply because they are pigs–although some kids are more difficult than others.

It is actually very likely he is fine at school–possibly trying to be perfect there which is wearing him out at home. I used to be able to spot the terrible kids at home (when I was teaching) by finding the “perfect” kids in my class.

Now as a parent, I can only stress it is essential to get this sorted now rather than when he is a teenager. He has had a lot of stress the last year or so–new brother, new country, new school, new languages. Alot to cope with.

I have some suggestions but they are a little longwinded. Most structure around forming some boundaries and then sticking to them. I am really happy to send you some info that I use when running my parenting programmes–just pm me if you want it.

Remember, you are the parent, they are the child. You need to get this sorted for both of your own good :slight_smile:

Good luck and please don’t hesitate to PM.

[quote][quote=“Ginny”]Dear Forumosans:

Thanks for the very valuable thoughts so far–between last night and today, I have become one of the Forumosan myself. :notworthy: [/quote]

We’re glad to have you Ginny. Welcome.

Our son is 5 and he has a star board. He gets a star for helping out around the house, being polite without being asked…things like that. He can deceide when to cash in his stars…5 gets him an ice cream at McDonalds, 10 a movie from blockbuster, 20 a trip to Warner Village to see a real movie. We explain why he gets the reward repeatedly, and we do deduct stars for bad behavior.

[quote]
He is very rude, loud, disrespectful, harsh, critical, ant just anything you could think of. It’s very uncomfortable for me to be around him in public… :fume: [/quote]

Loud? Well, seeing that he’s surrounded by Taiwanese kids in school, doesn’t surprise me at all. :slight_smile: As for the other stuff…best to deal with it now. If you go out shopping or something, you or hubby stay with him and the other go shopping. Explain to him that he lost the right to go shopping because he did xyz. Tell him that this right may be returned when he is good. And follow through on it. If you say, “When we get home you’re going to your room,” then do it. I know it sounds simple, but many many MANY parents do not follow through and their kids are incredibly misbehaved and impolite.

Well, he’s not. And if you wait much longer, you’ll think he was being an angel now. :smiling_imp:

There is a good book, a bit mushy and fuzzy wuzzy, but it has some interesting points to make about changin an undisciplined child’s behavior: How to Talk So Kids Will Listen and Listen So Kids Will Talk

amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/de … ce&s=books

[quote]
Oh well. I am very glad that I’ve got you guys to talk to now though. :slight_smile:[/quote][/quote]

That’s what we’re here for. :slight_smile:

Peace

jds

Ginny I have a friend who has a 4 year old. At the time I visited her, the girl was 3. We were out shopping at a bookstore when the girl thought it was time for her to ‘show out’ for not getting what she wanted and proceeded to lie on the floor and thrash about while screaming. My friend stayed calm and near by while reading a book,allowing her daughter to do her ‘thing’. After awhile of not getting the result she wanted (attention) she gave up, and during the rest of my visit I never saw the behaviour repeated. DOg trainers say this is what to do with dogs, so if it can work with dogs, why not kids?

Whenever I read the title of this thread, I think it’s the Michael Jackson thread. :smiling_imp:

I found 4 Supernanny episodes on eMule…

I suggest the “naughty mat” technique.

If I had been in the bookstore, I would have given your friend a whole lotta eye. She allows her kid to thrash about in a public place…a bookstore of all places…come on…pick her up and remove her from the scene…it’s not right to inflict one’s child’s bad behavior on other people, again, in a public place…and how long was this “while?”

Would she have done the same thing in church? We all have bad parenting days, but IMHO I think your friend was being selfish, inconsiderate and/or lazy.

Did I mistakenly post my message in the wrong forum? :blush: :frowning:

[quote=“jdsmith”]There is a good book, a bit mushy and fuzzy wuzzy, but it has some interesting points to make about changin an undisciplined child’s behavior: How to Talk So Kids Will Listen and Listen So Kids Will Talk

amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/de … ce&s=books

[/quote]

Great book, I have this one and … so Kids Will Learn book. While we’re recommending books, there’s a great new one that I’ve started recently, found at Amazon and at the author’s site playfulparenting.com

I have quite a few children of my own and the 8 y.o. often feels like I don’t spend enough time with him. I’m learning through Playful Parenting how to reconnect with him.

I agree with most of what’s been said here, and I think an important point is this: don’t wait another minute to implement some SERIOUS ground rules. Seven is getting a little big for a ‘naughty mat’ or standing in the corner. If I send my boy to his room he goes happily and plays for ages without learning any consequences.

You’ve got to re-assert your alpha dog status, and quickly. Is the father around? He should also be playing a big part in this situation, if he is. Otherwise, is there a man around that could/would spend time with your son? Some good clear man-to-boy communication (and no, this is NOT the Michael Jackson thread) may go a long way as well.

Good luck!

And as to that woman with the screaming kid in the bookstore: holy hell would I have done a good bit of evil-eyeing myself had I been there. That is definitely NOT the way to deal with something like that in a public space. Have some respect for everyone else!

Here’s one of the newsletters from the playful parenting website. The parent has a happy 7 year-old that suddenly starts acting terribly:

Playful Newsletter

Thank you braxtonhicks and FearsomeOrange so much!!! You sure rescued me from the out-of-focus comment.

And yes, FearsomeOrange, his dad is around. I kept thinking that with moving, adjusting to the new country, having a baby brother, going to grade school could be playing huge roles here in his big shift in attitudes but it seems to be happening too frequent to the point where I would like to have better and easier time with him…

I will check the book out for sure. Thank you all for all the great different views here! :slight_smile:

[quote] Do you think it would be possible for you to sit down with the kid and talk to him about it. Not when you or he is upset - you’d have to find a quiet moment when you’re both in a normal mood and there are no distractions (like the baby crying or his favourite cartoons on the tele).
Don’t throw accusations at him, just tell him that you don’t know what to do and ask HIM for an advice. Maybe he would help you find out the reasons why he’s acting like this. Ask him what he thinks would help make him feel better - more attention, more privacy, more independence, a vacation - whatever.[/quote]

Okay! I sat down with him just now tonight. I asked him if he was happy. He said that he was happy every day, but he would be happier if he had been in the States. I asked him why. He answered, because there were no roches, more garbage dumpsters, smelled better, and some thing not really hitting the spot (from my point of view.)

I figured that it was going nowhere with the above question since he claimed that he was happy every day. I then said, “Do you feel that your little brother is getting all the attention and you get not enough attention?” He said, “No, because I am getting all the attention from him.” I asked him if he felt that we did not spend enough time with him ever since his little brother came around, and he again, said no, and said that it was great to have the brother around and he loved him very much.

So, I was not really getting any help from him form the above asked questions. I then said, “Well, could you tell me what your dad and I could do to make you happier?” He first answered nothing, he was as happy as could be. So I said, “but I sure did not feel like that because you screamed, yelled, and refused to cooperate, plus, stumped, shouted “No,” and shut the door hard, kicked stuff around in his room. And those things made me feel that you were not happy.” He responded that maybe if I would not say “No” to everything, maybe he would not be so sad and angry. So I asked him, “What would you like me to say “yes” to?” He said, “buy me my roller blades, buy me drinks at the tea stand when I ask, not tell me to wash up, brush teeth, etc.” I asked, “Well, would you want me to say yes to buying roller blades if they would cost us the entire month of pay from work?” He said no to that. I asked him if he thought that it would make sense to buy the drinks whenever he asked for. He said maybe just buy him the $5 or $10 N.T. ones. I told him that he would not need to wash up for a month since that made him mad. He said that he would not want to not wash up for a day. SO, IT SEEMED THAT IT WAS GOING NOWHERE AGAIN WITH THAT. (However, I do think that started him thinking…)

I don’t know. He seemed like a little matured person but not sure what he really wanted and what he really could do yet… Arrrrr, this world is a tough place. I had been though the whole deal of being able to support myself and now my kids have to do it all over too… Don’t get me wrong though–life is well worth it and wonderful after all.

I have a nephew who went through something like this. I know this may not be the case in every case, but my sister finally took him to a shrink. They found he was a bit beyond gifted and completely bored with life. So she started him on learning games at home. Found and researched a lot of hobbies and games that would not only entertain him and make him smarter, but give him something to be competitive with and proud of. She also enrolled him in martial arts.
He changed dramatically.