Sure, Caucasians can be proud of their identity. But these days they usually identify as Armenians, Georgians, Azeris, Chechens, etc.
It’s Daughters of the American Revolution (DAR). My Mom is an officer in both the DAR and the United Daughters of the Confederacy (UDC).
[quote=“Flipper”][quote=“cornelldesi”]
But over here I kind of have to label myself as ABC otherwise they think I am retarded or something for saying I am American.[/quote]
why? just use the Chinese term. mei guo hua qiao.[/quote]
I’m a little confused about this. I read somewhere an explanation of the term hua qiao and learned that it simply means “overseas Chinese.” As I understand it, it doesn’t necessarily mean the person was born and raised overseas. I think that’s why I usually get asked, “How long have you been back (in Taiwan)?” by the locals when I say simply that I’m hua qiao.
However, most people seem to understand the term ABC. Or, if by their facial expression I see that they’ve never heard that term before, I just give them literal translation of it: zai mei guo chu shen de.
But I do agree, we’re not in an age yet where I can just tell a Taiwanese/Chinese person that I’m American and get complete understanding and acceptance.
It seems to me there is a difference between calling yourself an “American born Chinese” or “Canadian born Chinese” and calling yourself “Chinese-American” or “Chinese-Canadian.”
With the first two, the implication seems to be that you are a Chinese person who just happens to be born in America or Canada – e.g., your parents are diplomats and you just happen to be born in a foreign country. It is all in that “American/Canadian born” part.
Where, at least to me, calling yourself “Chinese-American” or “Chinese-Canadian” indicates that you are American or Canadian, and happen to be of Chinese descent. Though, I think this kind of labeling is unnecessary – i.e., we are all Americans or Taiwanese – I don’t have a problem with it, as I just see saying, “I am an xxx-American/Canadian” as just being a recognition of your ethnic heritage, within the context of your nationality.
However, if someone calls themselves “ABC” or “CBC” or “ABS” (American born Scot :p), it seems to me to be kind of… ah… separating.
Just my thoughts…
good observation.
My gf says never to forget your heritage and blood.
I said OK, but what about my grandchildren, great grandchildren…
what if I marry someone who is African American?
Man…
So i think name calling is just name calling. I can call myself Taiwanese, American whatever, it just depends on what I like to identify myself as.
And I would say I identify myself as more Taiwanese, like 55%.
Labels are just labels.
I thought ‘hua qiao’ should just refer to those whose ancestors were part of the earlier great wave of Southern Chinese emigration - to Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia etc.
Brian
For once I’m with CD on this one. Maybe some people from the states or Canada are hardcore about calling themselves ABC’s or CBC’s, but I’ve only seen such people refer to this when an ignorant Taiwanese disputes their nationality because the aren’t white. :raspberry:
Off topic, but when are we white people going to rid ourselves of the idiotic “Caucasian” label? It’s totally non-descriptive and offensive if you know the etymology of the term. It originated when a 19th century phrenologist (scholar of skulls) found the “most perfect!” skull in the Caucasus region, and thereby determined that place must be the racial homeland of white people - you know, white people had the most evolved skull structures. I don’t know why the label got stuck, but it’s asinine in the 21st century to continue to call white people a name from some 19th century racist with a skull fetish.
“European-American” is more accurate.
Wish it were so simple. If you are of Asian descent in the US, and you tell the average Caucasian American that you are American when they ask, they will look at you funny, and then ask you where you are really from. Stuff like that contributed to the coining of these terms.
Off topic, but when are we white people going to rid ourselves of the idiotic “Caucasian” label? It’s totally non-descriptive and offensive if you know the etymology of the term. It originated when a 19th century phrenologist (scholar of skulls) found the “most perfect!” skull in the Caucasus region, and thereby determined that place must be the racial homeland of white people - you know, white people had the most evolved skull structures. I don’t know why the label got stuck, but it’s asinine in the 21st century to continue to call white people a name from some 19th century racist with a skull fetish.
“European-American” is more accurate.[/quote]
For some reason I seem to remember it’s because it is “politically correct” to say “Caucasian” in the U.S. I’m not sure if that’s right or wrong, it’s just what I seem to remember. :s
It does seem that many white people avoid “white” as an ethnonym. The word may come across as too accurate in describing our actual ethnic identity (based on self-perception and the perceptions of others) viz. the other races we habitually come into contact with. So we seek to dilute or relabel it, out of politeness / timidity.
There does exist a discipline, allegedly academic, called “whiteness studies.” These are mainly UC Berkeley-type liberals who wish to study “whiteness” in order to deconstruct the underlying power relations, &c &c. (They might as well have called it “peckerwoodology”.) “Caucasian Studies” would have been too confusing.
Interestingly, census-style articulations of “Caucasian” often specify that Middle Easterners are meant to be included (and God only knows where the boundary line is supposed to go). I think the motivation was to avoid questions about whether Jews are white or Middle Eastern (if that had remained a separate category, in line with our folk perceptions).
[quote=“Screaming Jesus”]There does exist a discipline, allegedly academic, called “whiteness studies.” These are mainly UC Berkeley-type liberals who wish to study “whiteness” in order to deconstruct the underlying power relations, &c &c. (They might as well have called it “peckerwoodology”.) “Caucasian Studies” would have been too confusing.[quote]
And I think the anthropological definition of ‘Caucasian’ in terms of the three racial divisions actually includes Indians, who, by and large, ain’t white. So there seem to be a few meanings associated with the word depending on context.
Indians are more closely related, genetically speaking, to Europeans than their Asian neighbors. “Indo-European” could be considered a (very) broad ethnic as well as linguistic category. There have been studies showing how many odd ‘coincidences’ there are between Irish Celtic and Hindi culture - a lot of the folk sayings are exactly the same, etc. We both originated from steppe nomads somewhere in Central Asia.
[quote=“QuietMountain”]It seems to me there is a difference between calling yourself an “American born Chinese” or “Canadian born Chinese” and calling yourself “Chinese-American” or “Chinese-Canadian.”
With the first two, the implication seems to be that you are a Chinese person who just happens to be born in America or Canada – e.g., your parents are diplomats and you just happen to be born in a foreign country. It is all in that “American/Canadian born” part.
Where, at least to me, calling yourself “Chinese-American” or “Chinese-Canadian” indicates that you are American or Canadian, and happen to be of Chinese descent. [/quote]
What if you were born in Taiwan, immigrated to the US, and have dual citizenship? 
[quote=“Tiggerrr”][quote=“QuietMountain”]It seems to me there is a difference between calling yourself an “American born Chinese” or “Canadian born Chinese” and calling yourself “Chinese-American” or “Chinese-Canadian.”
With the first two, the implication seems to be that you are a Chinese person who just happens to be born in America or Canada – e.g., your parents are diplomats and you just happen to be born in a foreign country. It is all in that “American/Canadian born” part.
Where, at least to me, calling yourself “Chinese-American” or “Chinese-Canadian” indicates that you are American or Canadian, and happen to be of Chinese descent. [/quote]
What if you were born in Taiwan, immigrated to the US, and have dual citizenship? [/quote]
Then you are a US and a Taiwan national.
I think you would qualify as MIT ABC or MIT FOB? Made in Taiwan ABC or Made in Taiwan FOB.
Among asians ABC and FOB are really just relative labels to acculturation to the USA.
blueface666,
Wow that so cool. What do that talk about at their meeting?
SteveZeAuthor,
I believe the census in the USA says “White” now. Although I have heard of ethnic whites being upset about this in Urban areas in the States. Politics and Federal funding for ethnic whites.
I believe the next big issue with “white” label is the growing hispanic population in the USA and what they will check off in later generation. Some predict they too will be checking off “white” in the future as well in the USA.
“Hispanic” is such a confusing label. It means “one of Spanish-speaking descent” which can include:
blacks
Native Americans
mestizos (mixed-white/NA)
mulattos (mixed-white/black)
descendants of European immigrants (aka “whites”)
As a racial label it’s close to meaningless. Technically it can include blonde-haired Welsh-Patagonians but in the U.S.A. it’s usually just the politically correct short hand for Mexican-Americans.
Related: how are South American Japanese/Chinese/Koreans considered? Like Alberto Fujimori, former president of Peru? Are they Hispanics or SABCs?
[quote=“mod lang”]“Hispanic” is such a confusing label. It means “one of Spanish-speaking descent” which can include:
blacks
Native Americans
mestizos (mixed-white/NA)
mulattos (mixed-white/black)
descendants of European immigrants (aka “whites”)
As a racial label it’s close to meaningless. Technically it can include blonde-haired Welsh-Patagonians but in the U.S.A. it’s usually just the politically correct short hand for Mexican-Americans.
[/quote]
Hispanic may be useless as a racial label, but it’s pretty spot-on as a cultural one, in most cases…IMHO…
[quote=“Tiggerrr”][quote=“QuietMountain”]It seems to me there is a difference between calling yourself an “American born Chinese” or “Canadian born Chinese” and calling yourself “Chinese-American” or “Chinese-Canadian.”
With the first two, the implication seems to be that you are a Chinese person who just happens to be born in America or Canada – e.g., your parents are diplomats and you just happen to be born in a foreign country. It is all in that “American/Canadian born” part.
Where, at least to me, calling yourself “Chinese-American” or “Chinese-Canadian” indicates that you are American or Canadian, and happen to be of Chinese descent. [/quote]
What if you were born in Taiwan, immigrated to the US, and have dual citizenship? [/quote]
I would refer to you as a true Taiwanese-American. Meaning, anyone of Taiwanese descent who was born in the US, I would prefer to just call American. But, since you have dual citizenship and were born in Taiwan, while you are living in the US, you’d be a Taiwanese-American. However, in Taiwan, I’d probably just think of you as American-Taiwanese.
Confusing, ain’t it?
I prefer just calling someone by their nationality, no matter their ethnic background. If they are immigrants that became naturalized citizens and maintain dual citizenship, I can see calling them something hyphenated. If they are immigrants who became naturalized citizen and gave up their original citizenship, then I say just call them the nationality of whatever country they are now citizens of.
Born in the US - American
Born in Taiwan - Taiwanese
Born in another country, but now a US citizen - American
Born in another country, but now a dual citizen - Hyphenated-American.
Ultimately, it is up to the person to define themselves, of course. But, that is how I’d refer to them.
As for caucasian vs. white. I don’t like either, because they do not describe ethnicity clearly enough. I say, if we can have regional-Americans like African-Americans, Asian-Americans, etc. – or ethnicity-Americans like Chinese-Americans, Brazilian-Americans, etc… – then why can’t we have European-Americans or Scottish-Americans?
That is, if you need, for some reason, to distinguish a persons ethnic heritage, rather than their nationality.
By the way, I am a GCSGA. If we still had guanxi, I’d give some some if they could figure out what that is. 