While I agree with much of what you say, US law does not preclude dual citizenship.
[quote=“ac_dropout”]I usually get negative vibes from non-Asian foriegners on the island. There was this one guy who was an English professor at a university in Taiwan, that would have these weekly meetings at a pizza place. A good bunch of girls from his class would go with him. I don’t know if they were kissing up for a good grade or wanted to hear his native accent. But somehow 1 of the girls invited me. Anyways as I was setting up my language exchange appointments with the girls that were introduced to me I just got a negative vibe from this guy like I just ruined his perfect little world of being an English professor.
But I just usually let stuff like that blow over me. Since I never gave much though to what non-Asian thought of me in the USA, I definitely don’t care what a minority group thinks of me in Taiwan…just party on.[/quote]
I’m curious… You say that you receive negative vibes from non-Asian foreign nationals… But, I wonder… in the example you cited above, the negative vibe would have had NOTHING to do with the particular guy’s race or nationality… you were competing with him for girls… ANY guy would likely have the same reaction… Have you never watched the Discovery Channel?
[quote=“aprimo”]And then the same old converstaion usually follows: Are you from overseas? When did you return/come to Taiwan? What do you do here? Are you used to life here? Do you have any family in Taiwan? The same questions, invariably.
Another interesting thing is, because I’m dating a white foreigner here, the foreigners are more likely to think I’m Taiwanese. If I don’t say anything at first, and he introduces me, some foreigners will say, “Oh, that’s a nice name,” with a tone suggesting they think I wasn’t born with my English name, that I or both of us had spent some time thinking one up for me. 
[/quote]
Maybe you’re a sparkling conversationalist 
but that conversation usually applies to any foreigner, with a couple of minor differences. Which country are you from? When did you come to Taiwan? What do you do here? How are you finding Taiwan? Have you been to Taiwan before? It’s right there in my Manual of Social Conversation, section VII, paragraph 12.
Also, I have to say I think your name is an unusual one, and hence IMO people are more likely to assume it was chosen if they’ve just heard it and you haven’t said anything. If it was something like ‘Jennifer’ or ‘Lisa’ people might be less likely to assume that. Or not. Of course there is always the distant possibility they actually, you know, think it’s a nice name. Let people assume - it’s always entertaining proving them wrong
I guess your right about that one. I suspect he thought he was unchallenged for those student girls attention in that environment, since he was using his native english and status as a teacher. But you’re right it could have been another ABC or anybodyelse using thier native english ability as the primary attractor that could have seen me a potential usurper.
I was really young back then so didn’t think much of it. I really was there with a primary goal of getting native Chinese speaker to be my language partner since I was adamant on regaining what I lost growing up oversea in a relatively short amount of time.
The whole romantic aspect “language exchange” totally escaped me until I realize there was a small competition to get my affection among some of the girls. That’s the first time I heard the terms like:
“Xiao bai lain” (little white face) - Which my first response was “I’m not white”
and
“hua hua gong zi” (flower guy) - which my first response was “I’m not a pansey or gay”
It’s simply not enforced (from the US side; Taiwan side permits it). You can’t have 2 passports.
It think it is the deepest form of ethnocentrism for anyone to look at a person’s face and make an assumption that he/she should speak ____ language fluently or else his/her parents betrayed their heritage. People migrate. They migrate for many reasons. The US is a total stir-fry. Why are Chinese people so hung up on this ABC stuff when other cultures are not (or at least not to the same extent)? Answer: cultural chauvanism. Otherwise known as: Confucianism.// Parents who make the decision to emigrate from Asia sometimes mistakenly assume that because the Chinese cultural influence is soooo strong and all-pervasive, their kids will grow up to be just as Chinese as they are, except speaking great English. Not so. Something is lost. Parents sometimes figure this out when their Chinese daughter or son marries a white guy and ends up having 1/2-1/2 kids that can’t speak any Chinese at all. Tee hee. // If I were a socio-centric Chinese and I wanted my kids to turn out Chinese- hey. I’d raise them in a Chinese place, like Tianjin or Taipei…not emigrate to Michigan and then wonder if my ancestors will be mad cuz my daughter married an atheist of Jewish descent…or WORSE…decided to stay single. or WORSE…came out of the closet as gay.//
Not certain what you are saying.
There is NO US law that precludes dual citizenship. If you think there is such a law, please cite the same.
Many US citizens hold passports from other nations. My wife is one such US citizen.
[quote=“Kick-Stand”]It’s simply not enforced (from the US side; Taiwan side permits it). You can’t have 2 passports.
It think it is the deepest form of ethnocentrism for anyone to look at a person’s face and make an assumption that he/she should speak ____ language fluently or else his/her parents betrayed their heritage. People migrate. They migrate for many reasons. The US is a total stir-fry. Why are Chinese people so hung up on this ABC stuff when other cultures are not (or at least not to the same extent)? Answer: cultural chauvanism. Otherwise known as: Confucianism.// Parents who make the decision to emigrate from Asia sometimes mistakenly assume that because the Chinese cultural influence is soooo strong and all-pervasive, their kids will grow up to be just as Chinese as they are, except speaking great English. Not so. Something is lost. Parents sometimes figure this out when their Chinese daughter or son marries a white guy and ends up having 1/2-1/2 kids that can’t speak any Chinese at all. Tee hee. // If I were a socio-centric Chinese and I wanted my kids to turn out Chinese- hey. I’d raise them in a Chinese place, like Tianjin or Taipei…not emigrate to Michigan and then wonder if my ancestors will be mad cuz my daughter married an atheist of Jewish descent…or WORSE…decided to stay single. or WORSE…came out of the closet as gay.//[/quote]
I’m not sure why you are so adamant about how someone should label themselves. So what if someone prefers CBC over Canadian. I really don’t think that Asians are the only ones hung up about this. Americans themselves can get hung up about this. Look at the media in the States…labelling people as Hispanic, African American (or blacks) rather than Americans.
My opinion- just call yourself what you are most comfortable with.
Blah… blah… blah. reiterate… agree… disagree… abc this abc that… skip ahead…
My friend once said that being part of the overseas Chinese diaspora is like being a lapsed Catholic. Somehow, you can never escape it, not even my buddy who is a 4th generation Panamanian, born in NC, californian (chinese descent).
Aprimo is most certainly not a boy. i can vouch for that. although i thought the user name suggested someone italian at first. isn’t there a motocycle company with a similar name?
[quote=“Jack Burton”]Blah… blah… blah. reiterate… agree… disagree… abc this abc that… skip ahead…
Aprimo is most certainly not a boy. I can vouch for that. although I thought the user name suggested someone Italian at first. isn’t there a motocycle company with a similar name?[/quote]
Sir, that motorcycle co is Aprilla.
[quote=“Jack Burton”]Aprimo is most certainly not a boy. I can vouch for that. although I thought the user name suggested someone Italian at first. isn’t there a motocycle company with a similar name?[/quote]You’re thinking of Aprilia. Very fast little bikes, often used in racing. Saw one up in the hills the other day.
[Edit: I see Mungacious got there before me!]
That rings a bell: You’re not by any chance stragbasher’s better half, are you?
Blacks, african-americans, etc. also have terms like Oreo, something I heard very often growing up…funny how in denying mainstream American culture, people use terms that epitomize it.
Blacks, african-Americans, etc. also have terms like Oreo, something I heard very often growing up…funny how in denying mainstream American culture, people use terms that epitomize it.
[/quote]
Stop acting white, the two of you.
This is my point, actually:
Oreo. Apple (red on the outside, white on the inside), Banana (Yellow on the outside, white on the inside) are NEGATIVE terms. If someone is using this term to describe himself/herself, then it is with irony or as a joke. My friend Nneka (black) got called an Oreo once and nearly started to cry!
HOWEVER. This ‘ABC’ and ‘CBC’ thing. It’s not negative. It’s positive…in fact, people are actually beginning to ‘fake it’ now and call themselves such even if they just got a degree abroad, but weren’t born abroad.// When a Chinese goes abroad, their identity becomes co-opted, never evolves into something else. They always stay Chinese. No matter how they act, what they believe, etc. That is the belief of Chinese people.
ABC stereotype
I heard about this stereotype last year, even though it might have been old news for native Taiwanese. For some reasons a lot of the natives (including my gf) think that most ABCs are obnoxious, lazy, disrespectful and party all the time. I was very surprised by this at first because almost all my ABC friends aren’t like the way that the natives here describe them to be. The ones I met in NJ, in Cornell, and especially the older ABCs (25+) all are pretty good in studying (like half of them all went to Ivy schools) and are working for freaking nice companies now, and rarely go hang out at bars (house parties are exceptions).
However, I realized that a lot of the people who do tend to come back to Taiwan are usually from big cities - LA or NYC. Lots of them go to this thing called Love Boat - hook up city + learn chinese at the same time. I guess that might be part of the reason why there stereotype exists. Another reason could be that the younger generations and immigrants whose parents live in Taiwan but children grew up in the states are usually a bit out of control. I don’t really consider this group ABC at all. They are pretty much natives, but at least the ones I met, there is a type of twisted thinking… kind of like they feel really free from Taiwan, but get really fucked up in the US. Coming back, their personality changes, becomes cocky cause they stayed in the states for some reason, and is neither accepted by Americans or Natives. This group I have met on several occasions however, never joined in with their pot smoking, beer chugging times. I preferred to study, stay in US, find a nice job… thats about it-- same with many of the other Asian Americans that I grew up with.
cornelldesi,
“Love boat” - forgot all about that. That’s one screw up program.
ABC could have a negative connotation or postive one. Usually it is just to describe a Chinese individual who cannot speak Chinese properly. The after effect is of course they are more accultured to the Western way of life.
As for ABC vs. FOB work ethics. Well it is usually assumed that an ABC will not be working 24/7 for the rest of their lives just to send their kids to college. America is their country now. So they can be just as lazy as the next American to live the “Dream” life.
As for ABC in Taiwan…They have to work as hard as the next foriegner to be accepted. Perhaps even more so, because ABC look native to Taiwan, so when we act foriegn people think we’re crazy and do not think it is because we are also in a sense foriegners.
I remember when I was younger and in college buying birth control at a pharmacy in Taipei. The sales girl, probably a high school aged, gave me the nastiest look and the manager almost gave me a lecture about the evils of “Tong Ju” life style. I’m pretty sure no foriegners every got this kind of treatment from the locals. We don’t get the benefit of the doubt when commiting cultural faux pas due to phenotypical features.
Don’t sullen young innocent virgin girls mind with your evil deeds. Only buy that kind of stuff with a guy behind the register or order online and pay for the shipping.
Kick Stand
The US does recognize dual citizenship. Every time my wife leaves the US she gets both her ROC and her US passport stamped. Same on leaving Taiwan.
My ABC son has only visited Taiwan but he is as Taiwanese & Chinese in spirit and culture as he is American. We know that each individual has the capacity to embrace and participate in more than one culture.
Those who insist on a singular loyalty have subscribed to a platform that contains no good agenda. For one to decide on singularity is the right of the individual. For one to embrace all of the factors of one’s existence is an equally valid individual choice.
OutofChaos,
Isn’t that something people should not do. Present 2 passport to the customs and immigration people. They get confused easily.
The way a friend of mine who is a judge in the USA immigrations (or whatever that department is called now) informed me that dual citizenship is something the USA doesn’t enforce unless it is from a restricted country like China.
This judge informed me that his interpretation of taking the Oath of allegiance was basically giving up your prior citizenship.
“I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state or sovereignty, of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the armed forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God.”
However, the loophole occurs when your not coming from a restricted country, like China and Russia, they don’t go to the other embassies to tell them you are renoucing your prior citizenship. Or if you gain citizenship through a parent that was naturalized, you don’t take the oath.
But he also stated that another immigration judge could challenge his opinion at anytime. And often do.
I’m sure there are enough loopholes in USA immigration policies that allows for all those nice immigration lawyers to work in the USA.
AC D
No loophole. When leaving the US she presents the American passport first and gets it stamped. Then she presents the ROC passport and asks to have it stamped as well. She reverses the procedure when leaving Taiwan.
Upon entering the US she presents ONLY an American pasport as she is required tro do under law - Americans must use an American passport to enter the US. ?Use of another pasport is illegal. This regulation was often the basis for saying “no two passports” - it is no longer seen that way.
By the way, entering Taiwan is exactly the same, only one passport permitted for entry. - Getting two stamped for exit is no problem.
The US State deparetment determines the legal status of citizenship requirements and their rulings are inclusive of dual citizenship. Just have to know and play by the rules.
OOC
– Oh, China is a country that does not recoginize dual citizenship status. Each person can be a citizen of only one country at a time according to them. –
That rings a bell: You’re not by any chance stragbasher’s better half, are you?[/quote]
You’re a quick one. 
You should give him some advice on keeping his memory in shape.