Another secular revolution hijacked by Islamists

Reminds me of Iran back in 79. The Ayatollah must be dancing a jig in his grave.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h9oihHJ5wDEMzQwQa3KHU9yDfE2A?docId=a9ca53329e1f4c55bc91f9b67189770f

Many of us saw religion as harmless nonsense. Beliefs might lack all supporting evidence but, we thought, if people needed a crutch for consolation, where’s the harm? September 11th changed all that.
Richard Dawkins…my hero :bravo: i post at the risk of upsetting many blind followers of “faith” Fortunately i am entitled to my beliefs now…i wouldnt be in many extreme countries…or Utah :unamused:

I posted this …in part… to the established Forumosa posters complaining about lack of juicy posts…this should get you going! :bow: lets go :popcorn:

You, my dear sir, are a filthy atheist, and therefore NEVER entitled to your beliefs.

As for Morsi, he’s a filthy Islamist, and therefore wrong and dangerous. Someone should blow them all up.

I called this right at the beginning. Not one to float my own boat, but I wonder what all the dissenters to my comments will have to say now. Let the excuses roll…

And old Obummer must be chuffed for the wrong call. He fucked over Murubak who at least was a secular dictator and a long time US ally, for what is looking like an Islamist dictator.
Well, as usual out of the frying pan into the oven.

I don’t think US foreign policy has ever been so bad.

Mubarak was going to be taken down sooner or later, it was the right call. It’s up to Egyptians to make the right choice, it’s their country and they are working through the options. The majority voted for Morsi. I hope they can reach a solution without further violence and that the balance of power can be maintained somehow.

QFT

Decades of dictatorship don’t get washed away over night. It’ll take time for the democratic process to unfold, and it won’t be any easy path but at least it’s the path the Egyptian people have chosen, and not one that’s been forced on them from outside. Give them time.

[quote=“shiadoa”]Many of us saw religion as harmless nonsense. Beliefs might lack all supporting evidence but, we thought, if people needed a crutch for consolation, where’s the harm? September 11th changed all that.
Richard Dawkins…my hero :bravo: i post at the risk of upsetting many blind followers of “faith” Fortunately I am entitled to my beliefs now…i wouldnt be in many extreme countries…or Utah :unamused:

I posted this …in part… to the established Forumosa posters complaining about lack of juicy posts…this should get you going! :bow: lets go :popcorn:[/quote]

One man’s “juicy” is another man’s slobbering drivel.
The Punctuation Gods will surely punish you for your sins.
Tremble and beg for mercy, as you await the Divine Spanking Hand!!!

QFT

Decades of dictatorship don’t get washed away over night. It’ll take time for the democratic process to unfold, and it won’t be any easy path but at least it’s the path the Egyptian people have chosen, and not one that’s been forced on them from outside. Give them time.[/quote]

You have the remove the bogeyman of the outsider. Where I’m from it literally took 70 years to loosen the grip of religion on the state from the year of it’s founding. If one reads the article one can see that there is a plurality of voices in Egypt. One should also know the vast majority are Muslims but not all Muslims believe in shariah law.

QFT

Decades of dictatorship don’t get washed away over night. It’ll take time for the democratic process to unfold, and it won’t be any easy path but at least it’s the path the Egyptian people have chosen, and not one that’s been forced on them from outside. Give them time.[/quote]

You have the remove the bogeyman of the outsider. Where I’m from it literally took 70 years to loosen the grip of religion on the state from the year of it’s founding. If one reads the article one can see that there is a plurality of voices in Egypt. One should also know the vast majority are Muslims but not all Muslims believe in shariah law.[/quote]

Unfortunately this is the first step in a Brotherhood coup. Next comes the press restrictions against criticizing Morsi, and round and round it will go until a new dictatorship is born.
The Egyptians might have chosen the Brotherhood, but they did not choose what is happening now, that’s for sure. Although it was not unexpected based on history.

Unfortunately this is the first step in a Brotherhood coup. Next comes the press restrictions against criticizing Morsi, and round and round it will go until a new dictatorship is born.
The Egyptians might have chosen the Brotherhood, but they did not choose what is happening now, that’s for sure. Although it was not unexpected based on history.[/quote]
Dictatorship,metered by assasination, :whistle: is the best form of Government

QFT

Decades of dictatorship don’t get washed away over night. It’ll take time for the democratic process to unfold, and it won’t be any easy path but at least it’s the path the Egyptian people have chosen, and not one that’s been forced on them from outside. Give them time.[/quote]

Unless, of course, you’re a Copt or some other disapproved of minority…

QFT

Decades of dictatorship don’t get washed away over night. It’ll take time for the democratic process to unfold, and it won’t be any easy path but at least it’s the path the Egyptian people have chosen, and not one that’s been forced on them from outside. Give them time.[/quote]

You have the remove the bogeyman of the outsider. Where I’m from it literally took 70 years to loosen the grip of religion on the state from the year of it’s founding. If one reads the article one can see that there is a plurality of voices in Egypt. One should also know the vast majority are Muslims but not all Muslims believe in shariah law.[/quote]

Unfortunately this is the first step in a Brotherhood coup. Next comes the press restrictions against criticizing Morsi, and round and round it will go until a new dictatorship is born.
The Egyptians might have chosen the Brotherhood, but they did not choose what is happening now, that’s for sure. Although it was not unexpected based on history.[/quote]

Chill out man, it’s the religion of peace!

QFT

Decades of dictatorship don’t get washed away over night. It’ll take time for the democratic process to unfold, and it won’t be any easy path but at least it’s the path the Egyptian people have chosen, and not one that’s been forced on them from outside. Give them time.[/quote]

Unless, of course, you’re a Copt or some other disapproved of minority…[/quote]

As stated, it takes time. Copts have been marginalized for centuries in Egypt. It’s ridiculous to think things will magically be perfect overnight.

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Of course. When discrimination happens in the West towards minorities, it’s evil and must be immediately stopped, no justifications though. When it happens elsewhere, it’s part of a rich, vibrant culture that we can’t criticise. Fascination with the Other. Islam has been an intolerant scourge for well over a millenium, and was founded in such intolerance. How long is actually necessary? Another few centuries in Egypt, perhaps?

The thing is, we can criticise it and try to put pressure, but as outsiders it makes no difference and usually makes things worse for the local inhabitants (at least in the case of mild repression). The government play it so that it is outside interests that are interfering , same thing happens in Russia, same in China, same in Venezuala…

I’ve been to Egypt, it’s a real mess. It was obvious when I was there that the state was decrepit and barely functioning. Their medical system had collapsed, their incomes didn’t match inflation, and their population growth was running way past their ability to improve living standards. The system they had was not working. It is true of course that a change of government may not improve on this. If they can, well then they have earned their right to govern for the moment, as long as there is no increase in repression. If they cannot improve on it it can also be construed as good, because the democratic process proceeds and people aren’t pulled into the idea that there is ‘one true way’.

It has to come from them in the end, in terms of education, national unity and equal treatment. It’s also a process, it’s often two steps forward and one step back.

Simple. Withdraw foreign aid. If America withdrew its financial support for these mouth breathers and actually demanded something resembling civilisation, these cretins would disappear. They’re not Iran with its oil reserves.

What do you want to achieve by withdrawing aid. Is that going to make things better or worse in terms of the objectives? Or just have no objectives and let them at it. I’m not American, but if I was I agree I would not like my tax dollars supporting this type of regime either. Or any regime really unless there were really good reasons for it.

Well, it’s like any other set of incentives. You encourage good behaviour and discourage bad behaviour. I suspect that little of this aid really gets to ordinary Egyptians anyway, but even if it does, that’s just propping up a useless government. If someone else foots the bill for feeding the people, then the people don’t have to ask hard questions of their government and how corrupt and incompetent it is. This goes for the previous regime, the current regime, or any other regime in a barely functioning society. Western nations have been pumping aid into certain regions (particularly Africa and the Middle East) for decades and there hasn’t been a lot of improvement. There are many Africans themselves who claim aid itself is the problem.

Let them have Sharia Law and generally be extremely antagonistic towards both ethnic/religious minorities and foreigners (including Israelis who represent a lot of tourism money, or used to at least). It will fuck their tourism and broader economy. The take home message then is not to be a bunch of regressive jerks, but to be modern and civilised and your standard of living will increase. The U.S. and everyone else can incentivise good and bad behaviour, productive or unproductive behaviour.

it’s a double edge sword if you simply withdraw.

normally, it makes sense to tie “good behaviour” with aid. here, the risk is losing even more influence than the little influence/goodwill you have. You don’t want someone else to replace you who could be worse. And yet, you don’t want to be accused of subsidizing a bad thing, or risk the locals accusing the government of being unduly influenced by America. The best you could hope is that the aid goes somewhere useful (instead of someone’s bank account in CH) and it continues to moderate political thinking. The best bet is that it helps creates jobs. It’s back to the adage “it’s the economy, stupid”. if they had one, they wouldn’t be busy burning flags in the streets, etc. of course, there’s more to it. you’d have to change the culture fundamentally in eradicating corruption for one, and that takes persistence and time. you could hope to change the next generation through education and enforcement of law, etc.

Somehow I do not think the Islamists give a fuck about tourism and the economy.
I somehow cannot remember “The Mullah Omar Funtime Funbags Holiday Resort” in Afghanistan.

All they care about is destroying both the Great and Little Satan, killing all the Jews or driving them into the sea, killing all minorities (even their Muslim brethren), and basically killing anyone else who does not agree with their perverted outlook.

Iran is for the most part secular, and so was Afghanistan. However, once the Islamofacists are in power, they will just repress and murder anyone with outspoken secular views, and the rest will shut up in fear.

Fuck Guatanemo Bay. They should stick them all on Bikini Atoll, and when there is no more room, airburst a low yield (5 kilotons should do it) nuclear bomb on their heads.

Will save the US taxpayer a shiteload.