For some reason I always overlooked the CB400sf but since the local big bike ‘school’* use them for ‘training’* I was forced to try them out and have to admit I’m quite smitten. Originally my budget big bike of choice in Taiwan was the Kawasaki ER6f but the more opportunities I had to ride it the more I was convinced it’s not the bike for me. A few riding buddies have kindly loaned their various bikes for me to test out and nothing has really grabbed me apart from the CB400 or rides completely out of my price range.
So are any Forumosans riding CB400s and have any comments, good or bad? If I don’t find any compelling reason to decide otherwise then my cash is going on a 2005 or newer 2nd hand CB400sf.
While I was having some work done on the 650R the shop gave me a CB-400 as a loaner. I put about 50km on it that day so can give some general impressions.
First the build quality is top notch.
Second it’s reasonably comfortable.
Third it’s very easy to ride with very predictable handling
Fourth very peaky powerband above 9,000RPM
you compared this as a possibility to the 650R…Interesting.
First, there is no comparing either the power itself or the powerbands of the respective bikes. While the 400 requires a quick downshift to get things moving the in-line twin is right there, right now. Being able to blurp around while consistently in your power band is a highly under-rated weapon in your riding arsenal. The 650 feels much bigger, but actually has a lighter touch to the bars. The 400 bucks a bit at street putt-putt speeds, and demands a more exacting throttle input. Both bikes offer a very upright seating position as shown by me in one of Mordeth13’s videos. I think the fit and finish are a bit nicer than Kawasaki, but for ride quality, style, power (usable power), double up road trip potential etc…The 400 simply doesn’t reside in the same territory as the 650R.
To each his own I guess. But dude, outside the zingy power-band the CB is seriously…slow. I will say this for it though…At 12,000RPM it sounds really nice.
[quote=“MJB”]Being able to blurp around while consistently in your power band is a highly under-rated weapon in your riding arsenal.[/quote]Quoted for truth.
[quote=“MJB”]
To each his own I guess. But dude, outside the zingy power-band the CB is seriously…slow. I will say this for it though…At 12,000RPM it sounds really nice. [/quote]
Okay, I know it probably sounds weird to have me comparing the CB400 and ER6f but these things are IMO pretty much the only decent sportsbikes available in Taiwan for under NT$300k new.
A major consideration for me is that I’m leaving Taiwan temporarily in 2009 and won’t be coming back for two years, so I don’t want depreciation to completely kill my investment. If I was looking at new bikes only then given similar ticket prices it would have to be the ER6f, no questions asked. However, 2nd hand ER6fs are in short supply and I’m pretty much comparing low mileage late model CB400s at NT$150-160k vs brand new ER6fs at NT$280k. If I lose maybe NT$50k on the sale I can live with that, but am I going to be able to sell a two year old ER6f for NT$230k? I honestly don’t know, plus realistically if I wanted a new Ninja now I would have to fen qi it.
Without considering finances the ups and downs of each machine are almost neck and neck for me, with a slight edge for the Ninja. I much prefer naked bikes (is the ER6n available here?) and I appreciate the fit, finish and smooth ride of the CB400. But I don’t like the idea of screaming around at high revs because I can do that already with the RZR, and even though I don’t do much 2-up now I would probably take the gf riding a lot more if I had a bigger bike.
My first “big heavy bike” (I love that retarded classification) in Taiwan was a used CB400SF a 2002 model to be precise, my experience of it was much like MJB’s… Ridden in isolation you’d wonder why anyone would want anything else, very natural transition (and massive improvement) from most 125/135/150 bikes in terms of looks, riding position and power delivery, but with way better handling due to proper (if basic) suspension, geometry and rubber… It’s when you ride it back to back with other bikes that it’s weak points become more apparent and it’s these weakpoints that make me think that it is a good buy for Taiwan, but probably not the best buy for the money…
For me, these shortcomings were… V-Tech: star trek whoosh of going to double valves at 6,500rpm is awesome for the first week and f**king irritating every week thereafter, it’s a nice idea but it trips you up more than it helps you… footpegs are low and if you ride it like you mean it, they scrape on Taiwan mountain corners all the time, which gets tedious (and dangerous) quickly… forks are totally un-adjustable and double rear shocks are pre-load only, great for courier riders in Tokyo, not so hot for Taiwan’s post war Bosnia inspired road surfaces… lastly the frame and swingarm are the chunky steel backbone construction originally designed by Leonardo DaVinci for the 1467 Italian GP, so not quite cutting edge technology… all in all not ‘that’ much to complain about then, but it doesn’t end there…
our nefarious friend the V-Tech system still has final curtain call… picture if you will our hero Ah-Huang knee deep in greasy engine parts and rounded off spanners, peering at a Honda V-Tech inline 4 engine’s valve train with the shock, fear and confusion of a Tibetan goat herder who’s been whisked off of his mountain side and asked to disarm a nuclear warhead… then imagine our hero barreling on regardless stripping threads, losing shims, rounding bolt heads and bloodying knuckles as he utterly hacks setting the valve clearances… then as if this wasn’t horrific enough imagine Ah-Huang’s feverish attempts to bodge together the Honda special tools he doesn’t have using NT$99 store wire strippers and a glue gun, as he tries to lock down the 8 valves he’s already “set” and then synch the additional 8 V-Tech valves, their actuating system and then the bank of 4 carbs… if you’re buying a 2nd hand CB400 this “Nightmare of FuXing Street" is going to be a reality sooner rather than later…
On the other hand, you’re likely to get a killer deal since CB400s sold like warm buns (ie. slightly less well than hot cakes) in the early days and loads of inexperienced people bought them as a first bike before ditching them to move up to a GSR-Z 1400 megablaster GP race-rep a week later… Bottom line is if you really want one you’ll probably get a good deal, so it probably won’t hurt that much when the honeymoon wears off and you want to switch it for something else…
Looks like the comments above are pretty much what I told you dude…I took a CB400 around Taiwan a few years back and it wasn’t so bad…sure, there was a lack of power at times and it sure wasn’t designed with mad cornering angles in mind…but, if you ride it within it’s capacities, it’s all good…sure, when the VTEC gets going and it starts screaming, there’s a slight improvement on acceleration, and I would say that this extra pull and sweeter sound are enough to give you a good rush, all the while not actually blazing down the road at break neck speeds…so, basically, it’s a marginal performer with just enough to give you the impression it’s fast…I would say that this is not a bad formula for leisure riding in Taiwan. cheap thrills that won’t put you in a situation beyond your abilities…
There are heaps of these around with lots of costly mods on them…get one that’s as stock as possible and try your best to make sure it’s been correctly serviced…(or even better, not crashed).
Enjoy for what it is and you’ll be happy.
Now, if your budget was bigger, we could talk about many other bikes that could do a better job on the roads here…I’ll save this for next time!
[quote=“llary”][quote=“MJB”]
To each his own I guess. But dude, outside the zingy power-band the CB is seriously…slow. I will say this for it though…At 12,000RPM it sounds really nice. [/quote]
Okay, I know it probably sounds weird to have me comparing the CB400 and ER6f but these things are IMO pretty much the only decent sportsbikes available in Taiwan for under NT$300k new.
A major consideration for me is that I’m leaving Taiwan temporarily in 2009 and won’t be coming back for two years, so I don’t want depreciation to completely kill my investment. If I was looking at new bikes only then given similar ticket prices it would have to be the ER6f, no questions asked. However, 2nd hand ER6fs are in short supply and I’m pretty much comparing low mileage late model CB400s at NT$150-160k vs brand new ER6fs at NT$280k. If I lose maybe NT$50k on the sale I can live with that, but am I going to be able to sell a two year old ER6f for NT$230k? I honestly don’t know, plus realistically if I wanted a new Ninja now I would have to fen qi it.
Without considering finances the ups and downs of each machine are almost neck and neck for me, with a slight edge for the Ninja. I much prefer naked bikes (is the ER6n available here?) and I appreciate the fit, finish and smooth ride of the CB400. But I don’t like the idea of screaming around at high revs because I can do that already with the RZR, and even though I don’t do much 2-up now I would probably take the gf riding a lot more if I had a bigger bike.[/quote]
There is the used CB-400 and a Grey Ninja (both 2006 models) for sale at our local Chungli big bike shop. Interestingly the same price.
No possibility that two-upping on the CB400 is going to be anything but annoying. The Ninja however, rides very well doubled up. I do it all the time.
Well, since I trust MJB’s advice and know that although plasma moans a lot he’s normally right and most importantly because I got a pretty good deal I’ve signed up for a brand new 2007 ER6f. After a few hours the deal turned out to be 120k down, 160k interest free credit for 18 months, he will pay the NT$9k plate fee, throw in a new aerial and mount for my transceiver, a few other little accessories and a couple of oil changes. The only colour they had was exactly the one I wanted (metallic blue) so in Taiwanese style I called it yuan fen and agreed to buy it.
BTW, they had some really sweet looking Triumph speed triples in the store too. The big Japanese bikes weren’t doing much for me but those Triumphs are sex on wheels.
[quote=“MJB”]
There is the used CB-400 and a Grey Ninja (both 2006 models) for sale at our local Chungli (Zhongli) big bike shop. Interestingly the same price.
No possibility that two-upping on the CB400 is going to be anything but annoying. The Ninja however, rides very well doubled up. I do it all the time.[/quote]
I’m very curious what that price is. PM me if you don’t want to say here.
jeez plaz, at least when i"m drunk i keep my posts short.
you generally have a good perspective, but now you’re saying,
“I was young once, but if you can’t buy a 7000 cc skyrocket,
you aren’t a real motorcycle rider!”
[quote=“llary”]Well, since I trust MJB’s advice and know that although plasma moans a lot he’s normally right and most importantly because I got a pretty good deal I’ve signed up for a brand new 2007 ER6f. After a few hours the deal turned out to be 120k down, 160k interest free credit for 18 months, he will pay the NT$9k plate fee, throw in a new aerial and mount for my transceiver, a few other little accessories and a couple of oil changes. The only colour they had was exactly the one I wanted (metallic blue) so in Taiwanese style I called it yuan fen and agreed to buy it.
BTW, they had some really sweet looking Triumph speed triples in the store too. The big Japanese bikes weren’t doing much for me but those Triumphs are sex on wheels.[/quote]
What?.. moan a lot?.. I’ve been framed… Right on Llary, Congratulations!.. Let me be the first to welcome you to the wonderful new world of near bankruptcy and borderline obsession that will now be brought on by the myriad of aftermarket parts catalogues… Which shop is it coming from and when?..
and don’t tell the wife, but how much are the speed triples?..
[quote=“old canuck”]jeez plaz, at least when i"m drunk i keep my posts short.
you generally have a good perspective, but now you’re saying,
“I was young once, but if you can’t buy a 7000 cc skyrocket,
you aren’t a real motorcycle rider!”[/quote]
eh?.. hang on, who said anything about drinking, hey, it that a fifth of Canadian Club you’ve got behind your back there?.. I’m kind of at a loss to explain where I was obtuse enough to give you the impression that I was saying “you’ve got to ride a gargle-blaster-9000 or you’re not a real biker” because that’s the last thing I would say… nothing pisses me off more than the “we’re cool bikers and you’re not in our little gang” attitude, and the only reference I made to gargle-blaster-9000s was to say what idiots the fools who buy them as their first bikes are… Ewan McGregor summed it up well when he said “there are two types of motorcycle people, those that love bikes and those that love being bikers”, I vastly prefer the former… to recap, I think the CB400SF is a great bike that is very suited to Taiwan, but due mostly to servicing issues and being just tad long in the tooth, compared to the other options in our wierd local market, isn’t necessarily the best choice IMuselessO…
I too used to have a 03 CB400 VTEC2 for about a year (sold already)…it’s a good beginner bike but in the end you’ll want more than what 400cc can deliver…ER6F is “kang-kang hau” for taiwan road and paralel twin would give a lot of torque at lower rpm which is good for mountain road…
"jeez plaz, at least when i"m drunk i keep my posts short.
you generally have a good perspective, but now you’re saying,
“I was young once, but if you can’t buy a 7000 cc skyrocket,
you aren’t a real motorcycle rider!’”
Lord I don’t even remember wriiting that! and I’m not sure what it means.
Sorry …
Although the first line isn’t even true.
I do want it known - if I kill somebody- I don’t have one beer before driving.
A) I couldn’t live with the guilt.
B) With a boozy breath I would be assumed guilty.
C) I couldn’t live with the guilt.
And if someone kills me and I have a boozy breath I would be assumed at fault.
First I was apoplectic then apologetic, now exculpatory.
I’m a little more Irish- Canadian, the Canadian Club is a little
too sweet for me.
They have a wide selection of Scotch here, but going into the
big city (Taichung) I don’t see any Jameson or Bushmills.
The local convenience stores have sometime specials on
Murphy’s and Guinness - get good use out of the “saddle bags”.
Mostly though it’s Kiriin.
Anyway plaz’ I forget who it was that didn’t “suffer fools gladly”,
but thanks that it seems you do.
I too used to have a 03 CB400 VTEC2 for about a year (sold already)…it’s a good beginner bike but in the end you’ll want more than what 400cc can deliver…ER6F is “kang-kang hau” for taiwan road and paralel twin would give a lot of torque at lower rpm which is good for mountain road…
welcome to BB community…[/quote]
In the end I bought a secondhand (Forumosan’s) ER6f. He managed to squeeze in a better offer just as I was about to sign off on a brand new bike… woohoo. I’m very glad I didn’t buy the CB400 because otherwise I would be extremely disappointed already. Jeez… what was I thinking? I used to ride bigger machines back in the UK and even after a long absence the memory comes back, the thrill starts to fade and you start to pick holes in your new toy. The Ninja has a good amount of power* for Taiwan, decent handling and a very surprising powerband… and all for NT$280k new
I smoked a Ferrari on the trip home and that’s what counts, right?
** I still want that Speed Triple though in case Santa is reading.
No problems yet but the bike only has 6,000-odd km on it so far. I’ll keep an eye on it but from what I’ve seen it seems to be an issue with installing crash bungs that my bike doesn’t have.
For Taiwanese roads, I’d actually prefer a CB400 to an ER6. The CB400 feels quite a bit lighter than the ER6 (at least the one of each that I rode).
Of course the ER6 has nicer power delivery. But it would take me quite a while to get confident enough on one to throw it around, and even then I think I’d have more fun on a lighter bike.
No problems yet but the bike only has 6,000-odd km on it so far. I’ll keep an eye on it but from what I’ve seen it seems to be an issue with installing crash bungs that my bike doesn’t have.[/quote]That’s not quite what I read about it. Seems like the pre-'07 models had a pretty flimsy engine mount and maybe had a spacing washer missing. As the engine bolt is torqued down it bends the bracket and closes that gap up. Of course, fitting a crash bung there will transfer stress to it when the bike is dropped, but there were stories from Europe that brackets had cracked simply from fatigue. The '07 models are said to have a beefed-up bracket, but they deny this. If I owned an ER-6 I’d loosen off that engine bolt and see if a gap opens up between it and the engine. If it does, I’d install a suitable spacer (washer) in there to close that gap, and then torque the bolt back down.
But that’s just me!
Right on Llary, Congratulations!.. Let me be the first to welcome you to the wonderful new world of near bankruptcy and borderline obsession that will now be brought on by the myriad of aftermarket parts catalogues… Which shop is it coming from and when?..
I’m kind of at a loss to explain where I was obtuse enough to give you the impression that I was saying “you’ve got to ride a gargle-blaster-9000 or you’re not a real biker” because that’s the last thing I would say… nothing pisses me off more than the “we’re cool bikers and you’re not in our little gang” attitude, and the only reference I made to gargle-blaster-9000s was to say what idiots the fools who buy them as their first bikes are… Ewan McGregor summed it up well when he said “there are two types of motorcycle people, those that love bikes and those that love being bikers”, I vastly prefer the former… to recap, I think the CB400SF is a great bike that is very suited to Taiwan, but due mostly to servicing issues and being just tad long in the tooth, compared to the other options in our wierd local market, isn’t necessarily the best choice IMuselessO…