I’m doing fine with my 640NTD/hour plus i’m able save a bit every month…I think you should get a smaller apartment maybe, use a fan instead of the AC, and consider eating a lunch box every other meal…550/hour is pretty standard and IMO fair…Locals working at Starbucks, 7-11, Family Mart, only get 80-90NTD/Hour. now that is something to bitch about.
I think certificates and graduate degrees are all over-rated, especially here. Of the people I’ve come across over the past 3 years teaching ESL, what made the difference in their performance was their character not their paperwork. I’ve seen many people with certificates and advanced degrees who were terrible teachers. The best ESL teachers I’ve worked with have been those who are outgoing, enthusiastic, positive and experienced, even though they may have only a BA. Employers are still dazzled by the diplomas, though.
I’m not interested in getting another degree. If that limits my employment options or earnings potential, so be it.
Why would you think that “certificates and graduate degrees are all over-rated”? Is it because you don’t possess them? Are you saying that we should put any old Joe blow into the classroom? There are standards in other professions, so why not in ours? Would you allow an unqualified surgeon to operate on you or an untrained pilot to fly you to Bangkok? Of course not so why insist on such absurd nonsense? Sure, the qualities that you mention are important - outgoing, enthusiastic, positive - but these qualities have to be matched with professional training that ensure standards are met. God forbid what kind of English teacher I’d be if I hadn’t gone to school and got both my CELTA and DELTA.
Hmmmm - whiney and easily offended?
I read the newspapers and my job involves “keeping my ear to the ground and paying attention to what’s going on.” And I’ve been doing it here for two decades. I see very little hardship in the lives of white collar foreign workers here. Very little, unless you consider the difficulty in obtaining sour cream as a hardship. You’re just being whiny. Nothing wrong with that, of course – do carry on, in fact, as its quite entertaining for the rest of us.
Nope, I’m not being “whiny” . . . I’m dead serious. And I wasn’t necessarily talking about “white-collar foreign workers” - are you talking about English teachers here? - but those who are on minimum wages, particularily the OFWs! My situation is quite priviledged compared to theirs, but needs don’t necessarily decline the more you move up the salary ladder. I don’t have figures for Taiwan, but according to Juliet B. Schor in her book The Overspent American: “27% of all households making more than $US100,000 a year say they cannot afford to buy everything they really need. Nearly 20% say they ‘spend all their income on the basic necessities of life.’ In the $50,000 - $100,000 range, 39% and one-third feel this way, respectively. Overall, half of the population of the richest country in the world say they cannot afford everything they really need. And that’s not just the poorer half.” This is rather sad, but it’s a fact: The more you earn, the more you need.
I hope, Sandman, that in the future you’ll “entertain” me with facts and not emotions!
Certificates. Yes. Taiwan does brilliantly with a bunch of unqualified fob self proclaimed teachers, doesn’t it! Best results in standardised English tests in Asia!
However, lb, your post is pompous and silly. Language awareness=nilpoint!
Yes, you’re right. Taiwan is right at the bottom of the IELTs and TOEFL league tables, with even Thailand, Vietnam and Parkistan surpassing it! I don’t want to go into details here because I’ll open a new thread later, but I’m convinced that “unqualified English teachers”, along with Taiwanese English teachers, are one of the main causes of this poor performance. And the ironic thing is that Taiwanese parents spend BILLIONS of DOLLARS sending their kids to buxibans that do more damage than good!
Yes, lotus blossom. In “white collar foreign workers” I was including EFL teachers. I felt it was a bit kinder than “backpacker English teachers slumming it in Taiwan while saving a wad to blow on blow on Koh Phanang.” 
Because I don’t see what your OP has to do with Filipinia nannies.
However, go ahead and change the goalposts if you want – all the merrier for us.
So now we’re on “nobody except the bosses in Taiwan get paid enough” are we? Ohhhh-Kaaaay. :bravo:
The connection is that EFL teachers get screwed when it comes to salaries as my original posting concluded, so those poor OFWs get REALLY screwed. And, yes, the research finds that most people, even “bosses in Taiwan”, would probably be unhappy with their salaries if asked. I suppose the point is that I just want to be remunerated fairly. Actually, I want all those that work hard to be rumunerated fairly. Getting back to English teaching: Both buxibans and universities pack their classrooms to the rim with students and pay the teachers $550. Do you want me to believe that the bosses aren’t taking a huge cut in the form of profit? Likewise, OFWs, who break their backs helping out, should get more for their amazing sacrifices. What I’m asking for is a little more charity and generosity from bosses so that workers feel adequately rewarded for their labour. So, no the goalposts haven’t moved, unless you moved them?
Please, give me more than just smileys!
I’d be happy to give you more than smileys if only you’d post something with a bit more meat than “Boo hoo! Nobody gets paid enough! It’s an injustice!” Because that’s all you’ve done so far.
I’m envisaging a few posts from now you’ll be exhorting us to “Stand UP, brothers! Fight the machine! Down with the ruling classes!” 
Well, I guess it is a hardship posting for women! 
Good thread lotusblossom. You have touched on a real problem.
Don’t worry about old hands like Sandman - they are in for life.[/quote]
I leave you, Sandman, with a quote from almas john, who had the decency to admit that I’d started a “good thread” and “touched on a real problem”.
Let me just fetch my pitchfork and fiery brand. Together we can right these wrongs.
I made a conscious decision not to bother with any TESL certificates or graduate degrees and am quite content with that decision. Your “sour grapes” assertion is childish. I’m quite confident in my qualifications. I’ve learned French, Japanese, Spanish, a little Portuguese and now some Chinese. I also took undergrad courses in first and second language acquisition. I’ve got experience teaching ESL to kids, teenagers and adults. I know what it takes to learn a second language and do a pretty darn good job helping others do it.
I’ve met far too many teachers with such certificates and degrees who had the personalities of a door knob and were totally ineffective in the classroom. They often trip over their own pomposity. There are other qualifications that have shown to be more effective than a piece of paper.
Additionally, the ROI was simply not worth it.
Teaching ESL isn’t brain surgery or piloting a 747. The comparison is nonsense.
Moving away from the silly tit-for-tat arguments that some folks want to turn this thread into, I’d like to move on to more fruitful matters. In today’s Taipei Times, there’s a story entitled: ‘Massive walkout affects 1 million students in Britain.’ This story can be found here: taipeitimes.com/News/world/a … 2003410229
What’s interesting about this and what is relevant to this thread is this: ‘The average salary is now ￡34,000 and has gone up by 19 percent in real terms in the past 10 years.’ 34,000 quid at the current exchange rate translates into $NT2,044587, which equals a monthly salary of 2,833 pounds or NT$170,362! Can this be right? And how did they get this average? Of course prices/taxes in the UK are higher than Taiwan, but the amount still sounds staggeringly high . . . and 30,000 college lecturers are striking because they think that a 2.45% pay rise is not enough!
[quote=“lotusblossom”]Getting back to English teaching: Both buxibans and universities pack their classrooms to the rim with students and pay the teachers $550. Do you want me to believe that the bosses aren’t taking a huge cut in the form of profit?[/quote]Depends what kind of buxiban you’re talking about. If you’re talking about a big test prep school with 30 or more students per class, yes they do seem to do ok. But teachers there get paid a lot more than $550.
As for most of the places where teachers do get paid $550, you should try working out the economics sometime. There just isn’t easy money in teaching kids any more. Yes, some organisations are doing very well, but the buxiban owners I know work pretty hard for a respectable but not spectacular income.
I think this was brought up in another discussion, but there are a lot of crappy “teachers” in Taiwan. A LOT. How do they get jobs? Schools are willing to pay them less money than other countries because fewer parents are willing to part with their hard-earned cash for a decent English education for their kids. You get what you pay for, and unfortunately for “real teachers,” this often means degrading and low-paying jobs with little job satisfaction.
Some of us have found okay jobs where we are treated as educators rather than dancing monkeys expected to impart English knowledge through games and osmosis. Most of us hold onto our jobs for quite awhile once we’ve found a good one.
For people with a basic degree, looking for decent money, Taiwan is a good gig. For teachers wishing to avoid a lot of bs, it can be good if you’re not too result-oriented. For real teachers, unless you can find a good job in a good school, stick to a country with higher standards.
[/two cents]
lotusblossum, what about leaving Taiwan?
So do Pakistani, Thai and Vietnamese parents. T’aint entirely connected. I have another theory.