Apparently I have been blacklisted. What does this mean?

When there is a problem in Taiwan we need to find out where the money goes. Let me guess that there is a big, and possibly unofficial, buxiban association. Let me suggest that it follows the traditional principle of screwing as much as it can out of its workers. In the English teaching part, the expensive workers are foreigners, and very easy to screw with becuase they have no rights. The principle we need to look here is known on Earth as “natural justice”, broadly meaning that when there is a dispute, an impartial person reviews both sides of the case and makes a decision. It’s pretty universal, and indeed almost every bunch of people on the globe at least pay lip service to it. It would apply if the person was Taiwanese, for example.

Let us also conjecture that the English teaching buxiban industry makes a shitload of money. If it does, and the Triads aren’t into it up to their elbows, then it is the only money-making industry in Taiwan which they have left alone, and worthy of wonder.

Now let’s add in a government department which, in its dealings with foreigners, is accountable to absolutely no-one whatsoever. See where this is going? As an English teacher you have absolutely no-one on your side. The CLA doesn’t give a shit about you, because if you rely on your job for your ARC, and therefore your “right” to live in Taiwan, there is no-one batting on your side. No wifey with possibly heavy duty civil-service-career-terminating guanxi. Why would they bother to go to the extreme trouble of disbelieving the buxiban’s side of the story? Who wants to stick his little civil service neck above the parapet and risk pissing off God-knows-whose buxiban? For all Polly Penpusher knows her boss could know a guy who knows a guy who owns that buxiban!

If you are expecting the CLA to “do the right thing” you’re dreaming. In Taiwan you’re either “connected” or you’re not. The money is all in the buxibans, the owners, the payments to the fire brigade, the police, the FAP, whoever. They have the say on what goes on your employment record.

I should think then that the school should also owe him 20000 NT for breaking the frigging contract by not giving him the agreed upon hours.

“Free and democractic” my ass. Not if you have a big nose.
But, I guess I just don’t understand Chinese culture. And as big noses, we have no rights anyway.

Just for clarification, they do not really compile and maintain a list as such, but merely put a record against your name.

I believe that preventing foreign teachers from receiving future work permits does have a basis in Taiwan Law, and for this reason I encourage teachers to avoid putting themselves in a situation whereby blacklisting could become an issue.

This does not come from the CLA but is my own view on things and I am no lawyer so don

No. But admittedly I didn’t ask.

As stated in my earlier posting, blacklisting is based upon being absent without notice for three consecutive days or more. It seems to me that ‘without notice’ would include ‘without permission’ so I recommend that teachers not just hand in notice and then do a runner. You need to give notice and work through that notice period unless you receive alternative advice from your employer (preferrably in writing).

So in order to appeal a blacklisting you would need to be able to show that you did give notice and that you complied with the legal requirement of the notice period. If you could show this then it seems clear to me that your blacklisting would be overturned. How can you show this? Well I would recommend that you give your notice in writing and state the date of giving the notice as well as your final date of work. Get the school to sign acceptance if possible or email them a copy on the date of serving it so that you can show that they were sent this.

If you can’t show that you gave an appropriate level of notice then you are unlikely to have your blacklisting overturned. I did get a sense both from the CLA and the teacher who appealed his blacklisting with the CLA that the CLA are helpful in their attempts to resolve the situation. Their hands are however tied if you have not given an appropriate amount of notice.

I think that this is true back home to some degree also. If you committ a crime back home and get yourself a criminal record then that can really stuff up your life. Breaking a contract without notice and doing a runner is effectively a crime as it is against the law here in Taiwan. Fortunately the blacklisting does not affect you in other countries.

In most cases teachers who break their contracts and do runners do so with prior planning and with the intention to avoid payment of breach penalties that they agreed to. We are not talking about people who make a legitimate mistake, we are talking about people who entered into an agreement and then decided that they no longer want to honor their part of the agreement. Fair enough, we all change, but they need to give notice, and 30 days is not such a huge burden in my opinion.

I am not a fan of the fact that blacklisting is permanent, but I do believe that if someone does the wrong thing to the detriment of someone else then there should be repercussions for this.

In the case of teacher blacklisting - what money are you talking about?

Maybe an online community where school owners can get online and bitch about teachers?! Maybe there is, but why should that not be allowed? Foreign teachers are allowed to get online and bitch about schools so why shouldn’t school owners do the same?

I am not following your argument. You are suggesting that there is a ‘buxiban association’ that is srewing us because we make more money than the average worker?! Can you explain this?

There is such mediation available here in Taiwan. If you are not aware of this then that is unfortunate but it certainly does not justify your suggestion that this service is lacking. As far as teacher blacklisting well I am sure that much of the decision making is pretty black and white:

Mediator: Did you give notice?

Teacher: Yes, here is a copy of an email that shows the date and time that I sent my notice to the school / here is a copy of my resignation letter signed and dated by the manager of the school.

Mediator: Fine. Your blacklisting will be repealed.

Any third party, be they a court appointed judge or a mediator, will work off the evidence at hand and this is why it is so important for teachers to get stuff in writing.

:loco: This doesn’t even warrant a reply!!!

This is not true. If you want to cry victim then off you go, but it does not validate your suggestion. There is help here in Taiwan the only difference with back home is that you actively need to seek this help here.

What personal dealings with the CLA have you had that lead you to believe this?

In my personal dealings with the CLA I have found them to be very helpful and responsive. The reports that I have received from other foreign teachers also seem to confirm this.

In my experience the people who complain the most about the CLA are the people who have had the least involvement with them.

Why would they automatically believe the buxiban? Because they are Taiwanese?! It comes down to evidence not nationality.

Government departments all around the world are renowned for this. This is why it is important for teachers in Taiwan to know their rights so that they can pursue these, and comments such as yours are counterproductive and nothing more than a gripe.

I ask again.

What personal dealings with the CLA have you had that lead you to believe this?

In my personal dealings with the CLA I have found them to be very helpful and responsive. The reports that I have received from other foreign teachers also seem to confirm this.

And he may well have been entitled to such had he brought the matter to the attention of the CLA rather than taking matters into his own hands. In fact if you take a look at Article 14 of the Labor Standards Act you will see that there would have been grounds for him to argue his case on exactly these grounds.

I understand his frustration and the reason for doing what he did. He wasn’t the first to do this, and he was extremely unlucky to be the first one to be caught out with blacklisting. In this regard I do have sympathey for him. But in hindsight we can all learn from his case and anyone who finds themselves in such a situation in the future would be well advised to contact the CLA with contract disputes and for assistance in this regard.

In walking away from the contract in the way that he did he was effectively throwing the contract away, and in turn throwing away any chance he had to dispute the contract.

So let me ask you Bob, which rights of yours have been impinged upon and what have you done to recitify this?

Does it make a difference if you change your mind about a job really early - only a few days after signing the contract, and before the school have even started applying for an ARC?

I stupidly agreed to take a kindy job when I was in an emotionally and financially stressed out state, and the school kind of misled me about the conditions and press-ganged me into it because they were desperate for a female teacher. They led me to believe that there was a lot more support available than there really is. I was having a lot of doubts from the start but the salary was pretty good and I thought maybe if I tried teaching little kids I would enjoy it. I was worried about the contract which says you forfeit a month and a half of your salary if you leave early, but other teachers at the school told me that they actually have quite a high turnover of teachers, and that those penalties are not really legal and can’t be enforced. I had never even heard of a blacklist until I told them I’d changed my mind.

I’m not willing to stay until they find another permanent teacher (which could be quite a while) if I’m not 100% sure that they’re going to pay me for the work, and I think it’s better for the kids if I go straight away. I’ve only been with them for 4 mornings, and I’m not good at it (I usually teach adults and teenagers) which is why I’m going. There was a substitute with them for over 2 weeks before that, and the kids know him and respond better to him than they do to me, so I think it’s better for everyone if he takes over again while they look for a permanent teacher. If I stay longer they will just get used to me and be more confused when I go, and they’ll also be stuck with a miserable teacher who is not suited to the job. I don’t even understand why the school would WANT to force me to stay.

I wasn’t really expecting such a hostile reaction - I’ve been totally honest about my doubts and my lack of experience teaching little kids, so it can’t be a total shock to them. I was trying to be honest and do the right thing (for me and for them) by saying something sooner rather than later. Because it’s so early, I was expecting it to be more of an annulment than a messy divorce. As I understand it, the school are breaking the law too by employing foreigners to teach kindy, and they also fiddle the taxes by paying partly in cash - so surely if they want to threaten me, I could threaten to report them too? Not that I want it to get to that stage, of course.

[quote=“Katesby”]Does it make a difference if you change your mind about a job really early - only a few days after signing the contract, and before the school have even started applying for an ARC?

I stupidly agreed to take a kindy job when I was in an emotionally and financially stressed out state, and the school kind of misled me about the conditions and press-ganged me into it because they were desperate for a female teacher. They led me to believe that there was a lot more support available than there really is. I was having a lot of doubts from the start but the salary was pretty good and I thought maybe if I tried teaching little kids I would enjoy it. I was worried about the contract which says you forfeit a month and a half of your salary if you leave early, but other teachers at the school told me that they actually have quite a high turnover of teachers, and that those penalties are not really legal and can’t be enforced. I had never even heard of a blacklist until I told them I’d changed my mind.

I’m not willing to stay until they find another permanent teacher (which could be quite a while) if I’m not 100% sure that they’re going to pay me for the work, and I think it’s better for the kids if I go straight away. I’ve only been with them for 4 mornings, and I’m not good at it (I usually teach adults and teenagers) which is why I’m going. There was a substitute with them for over 2 weeks before that, and the kids know him and respond better to him than they do to me, so I think it’s better for everyone if he takes over again while they look for a permanent teacher. If I stay longer they will just get used to me and be more confused when I go, and they’ll also be stuck with a miserable teacher who is not suited to the job. I don’t even understand why the school would WANT to force me to stay.

I wasn’t really expecting such a hostile reaction - I’ve been totally honest about my doubts and my lack of experience teaching little kids, so it can’t be a total shock to them. I was trying to be honest and do the right thing (for me and for them) by saying something sooner rather than later. Because it’s so early, I was expecting it to be more of an annulment than a messy divorce. As I understand it, the school are breaking the law too by employing foreigners to teach kindy, and they also fiddle the taxes by paying partly in cash - so surely if they want to threaten me, I could threaten to report them too? Not that I want it to get to that stage, of course.[/quote]

Get the number for your closest CLA office and tell them that you think what they are doing is illegal and you are going ask what your legal options are. Be prepared to actually go to the CLA rep because things will go from ugly to worse OR the school will back off. As a reminder be sure sign (and get a copy) of the contract termination paperwork otherwise the school can say that you just didn’t show up and that is how you get blacklisted. It’s perfectly legal to break a contract before the end of the contract.

I would suggest you don’t start with a threat off the bat. Try to work with them and explain you understand their difficulty in finding a new teacher, but they need to understand your inability to work there. Leave no room for negotiation while maintaining civil, and give them a final date that you will work before you leave – do not ask them how long it will take to find a replacement, tell them how long it should take. I would say give them a week, tops, before you bolt, but make no secret of it.

Only if they prove 100% unwilling to bend to what you want should you bring out the threats. As most people are aware, Taiwan’s entire social system is built on guanxi, and guanxi works in favor much more when you come off as committed and uncompromising but without offending the other person. More flies with honey and what not.