I am a Taiwanese. But sometimes i found myself react completely different than other Taiwanese here.
One day i was in a queue waiting for the MRT. When the train approached,a 50 something man cut into my queue and stepped into the train right after the door open. I was totally pissed off. So i said to him seriously “Sir,i think it’s wrong to cut in.” and guess what,he called me a bitch. Of course I fought back by trying to “educate” him. But all I got was more curses. All of a sudden i was surprised that I’d been fighting alone. No one reaches out their hand offering me a help. People were just watching everything and being cold…very,very cold.
Here is another story. Every night outside my apartment at around 12 am,there are always some f*** teenagers who make a lot of noise by their scooter and shouting,yelling and it’s definitely not acceptable. But no one complain. After about 3 days,i couldn’t hold it anymore and complain to our security guard. I mean,I can’t believe it that Taiwanese just take everything even it’s not right,not acceptable. Anyone feel the same way?
Welcome to Taiwan!! Wait, you were born here so you this is nothing new to you, right?!
Trust me, I am exactly the same. I would tell people not to cut me off in MRT, buses, waiting in line for bathrooms…etc and you know what, no one ever said anything except for the fact that I look like a total bitch. (which i don’t mind at all) I don’t take shit from anyone and I hated the fact that no one ever back me up with anything in public. Oh well, something I have to get used to it, right?!
Hmmm… I know some Taiwanese who can be very aggressive about standing up for what they think is right in public. And I know others who back down whenever they are in a confrontation.
I wonder if your real problem is not being Taiwanese, but being a woman. I’ve noticed in the past that women seem to be taken less seriously when they complain to (male) police, secutity guards, and government agencies.
Also, I don’t think people in Taiwan are especially ‘cold’. Taipei is a big city. If you confronted someone on the subway in New York over say smoking or radio-playing, I don’t think anyone would back you up either. Why should it be any different in Taipei?
I don’t think it’s a typical Taiwanese trait, very often the public doesn’t care or come to your help. There are known cases in Western countries where women have been raped in broad daylight, witnessed by people - but nobody dared to intervene (though someone called the police finally). So I would not expect that you get too much help if someone is jumping queue.
I nearly got pick-pocketed once in Paris while boarding the MRT there and put up a struggle with the 3 guys who tried to rob me - nobody came to my help and it ended without any casualties (they jumped out when the doors were about to close). People looked - but that’s all the “help” you get. I kept my wallet btw.
Civil courage is declining, and given that lot’s of people become ruthless, you have to be carefull - they might just draw a knife on you, even it’s for telling them off because they jumped queue.
This cowardice may also stem from a long history of defeats, surrendering, and retreats… from the Japanese, from the CCP, from warlords all the way to this island. there is also safety in numbers, as long as you are in the back. of course, there are remarkable similarities with the French and the Italians.
but seriously, it’s definitely harder to stick up for yourself if you’re a woman in asia. you’re either deemed a bitch or a ‘dragonlady’. i think the only woman ever who didnt get a bad rap was the only empress of china (tang).
and it appears that asking help from ‘authority’ will only be met with condescension and skepticism in many cases.
there’s really no place for women in taiwan. they should all emigrate and leave these bastards behind. or just all marry foreigners.
Keep fighting, girls. You will make a difference, even if it’s only a tiny drop in the ocean of rudeness, indifference, and lack of consideration for others.
I bet that old fart who pushed in front of you to get on the train will think twice before he does the same thing again, and most of those who witnessed the altercation will have learnt something positive from seeing you asserting yourself in the face of his oafish behaviour. Well done, and don’t be discouraged.
Depends what you mean by a “pussy.” Compared to the Vietnamese, absolutely. Compared to the Japanese, maybe, maybe not.
Many instances are available in the US where someone is beaten or killed or just plain hassled while people who could have intervened stood by and did nothing.
I don’t think this is a Taiwan issue.
[quote=“Jack Burton”]it’s definitely harder to stick up for yourself if you’re a woman in Asia. you’re either deemed a bitch or a ‘dragonlady’. I think the only woman ever who didnt get a bad rap was the only empress of China (tang).
and it appears that asking help from ‘authority’ will only be met with condescension and skepticism in many cases.
there’s really no place for women in Taiwan. they should all emigrate and leave these bastards behind. or just all marry foreigners.[/quote]
The other day I was standing in line with a bunch of elderly men at Taipei Main Station. When the train came, a group of three young women ran right by the line and tried to get on the train before anyone else. In fact, I find that when I am trying to get off an MRT train, 9 times out of 10 it’s a woman trying to push her way in before anyone else gets off instead of a man.
There’s a reason why the term “pussy” got its meaning. Cats are one of the most cowardly species in the animal kingdom. When you walk down the streets, the wild dogs here don’t move a muscle, they just keep on sleeping. Maybe they’ll bark at you if you stare at them. The cats, on the other hand, flee like lightning if you get within 3 feet of them. Why are cats always so deathly afraid of people? Pussies.
[quote=“wolf_reinhold”]Depends what you mean by a “pussy.” Compared to the Vietnamese, absolutely. Compared to the Japanese, maybe, maybe not.
Many instances are available in the US where someone is beaten or killed or just plain hassled while people who could have intervened stood by and did nothing.
I don’t think this is a Taiwan issue.[/quote]
I completely agree with Wolf that this is not an issue only in Taiwan. When I was living in the US, the news reported a case in which a pregnant woman was pushed down the stairs by people who were running to catch a bus. Nobody stopped to help her get up and later in the day she had such pain that she went to the hospital and lost her baby. Sometimes one has to really wonder if there is any humanity left in the world.
Its a universal problem right? Would you get involved in a strangers fight? Not bloody likely. Its called apathy.
The Japanese take it in the arse every day of their lives, so its not just the taiwanese in asia who do it.
Also, queueing is a cultural concept. Its different in germany, the uk and france, and they are all pretty close historically.
Just accept that other people are rude arseholes at times.
Rudeness… I hate riding the subway on Sundays, when all the hillbillies come to town and push and shove when getting on and off the subway.
I used to just stand by and do nothing.
Now I just shove, too. Unfortunately, the point is always lost when you do that!
Mmm… Still managed to give a few people bigger than myself an appropriate ‘nudge’… when I couldn’t get off the train while they were getting on. You’re supposed to let people off first.
Actually, someone from HK said our system was pretty gentle, compared to theirs.
In singapore, no one seemed in a hurry on their system.
[quote=“patterson”]Its a universal problem right? Would you get involved in a strangers fight? Not bloody likely. Its called apathy.
[/quote]
It’s a universal urban problem. All those people crowded in a tiny rats’ cage, you instinctively develop a protective bubble of oblivious apathy. You see several thousand people a day milling about, you’d go crazy being bothered about the problems of every one of them. The case of Kitty Genovese mentioned above, the woman raped and killed by her ex-boyfriend in NYC and no one stopped him, was pretty shocking to most people back in 1964. Today it’s commonplace, because a lot more people live in the cities than they did back then. Migrating from the rural to urban areas was one of the major changes in human life in the 20th century, causing all sorts of social problems that our species (designed originally for a semi-nomadic life on the African savannah amongst bands of small tribes of 100-200 homo sapiens) hasn’t been able to fully adjust to yet.
(And thus endeth the layman’s sociology rant.)
For those of us lucky enough to have been raised in small towns and the countryside, that kind of attitude is definitely not normal. In fact, it’s the opposite problem - everybody and their cousin trying to stick their nose in your business if you walk down the street funny. Believe it or not, some of us come from places where it’s considered rude to not smile or at least nod your head at every stranger that passes by. If I saw some stranger slapping his kids or girlfriend around in public, I’d definitely at least throw a few sharp words or dagger glances at him. That’s just the way people are brought up in small towns where everybody knows everybody else. So the lesson here kids is that if you’re going to be an asshole in public, the city mouse can get away with it much more easily than the country mouse.
[quote=“patterson”]Also, queueing is a cultural concept. Its different in Germany, the UK and France, and they are all pretty close historically.
Just accept that other people are rude arseholes at times.[/quote]
i agree with you here. And I know that it’s not only happens in Taiwan.
I wasn’t posting this subject against Taiwanese cuz i am a Taiwanese myself. Thanks to all those people who share their opinions with me. It does help me to think from different angles. Maybe it’s just me. I’m not this kinda person that takes everything quietly…I just have to say something when someone’s being unreasonble.
our species (designed originally for a semi-nomadic life on the African savannah amongst bands of small tribes of 100-200 homo sapiens) [/quote]
Well, Im not sure I agree with that. Did you have a quick chat with God about our design purpose? I thought animals adapted to their surroundings, or became extinct, rather than being “built for a purpose”. Not that Im a scientist or even a religious man.
Then be proud of this positive aspect of your personality, and continue to say your something when it’s called for, because you’re absolutely right to do so and will be setting a good example for others.
The best way to modify bad behaviour is through social pressure: if enough people openly display disapproval of what someone is doing, there’s a very good chance that person will cease to do it, or at least will do it less often and less flagrantly. A society where everybody minds his own business, looks the other way when other people act outrageously, and avoids confronting wrongdoers at all costs, is only going to encourage the worst of its members to make life more and more unpleasant for everyone else.
I think that most people would not get involved in a strangers fight for several reasons, one reason being that a person might simple afraid of getting hurt. This is instinct behaviour. Also in the study of primates, if one primate is being harrassed by another primate, for what ever reason, the other primates in the troop will simply watch while they chew their favorite snack. This is more instinct behaviour.
Standing up for a person, especially one that might be viewed as an outsider, goes against instinct behaviour. I think people are only truely being human when they are striving to go beyond their instinctual desires for pure self preservation.
HYPOCRISY ALERT: Last time I saw a fight I think I just kept walking too.
[quote=“Poagao”][quote=“Jack Burton”]it’s definitely harder to stick up for yourself if you’re a woman in Asia. you’re either deemed a bitch or a ‘dragonlady’. I think the only woman ever who didnt get a bad rap was the only empress of China (tang).
and it appears that asking help from ‘authority’ will only be met with condescension and skepticism in many cases.
there’s really no place for women in Taiwan. they should all emigrate and leave these bastards behind. or just all marry foreigners.[/quote]
The other day I was standing in line with a bunch of elderly men at Taipei Main Station. When the train came, a group of three young women ran right by the line and tried to get on the train before anyone else. In fact, I find that when I am trying to get off an MRT train, 9 times out of 10 it’s a woman trying to push her way in before anyone else gets off instead of a man.[/quote]
actually in my experience, it’s been the little old ladies, sometimes holding umbrellas. they may be old and little, but they’re built tough. Ford tough. and they’ll shouldercheck you like some hockey player and scramble for any seating.
