[quote=“Huang Guang Chen”]And speaking of songs, watched at slow speed with a nice Barry White backing track, it’s pretty homo-erotic.
HG[/quote]
Yup. Always reminds me of that film that had Olly Reed and Alan Bates doing the nude wrestling scene in front of the fire. That film of a DH Lawrence book. All that straining and looking hungrily into each others’ eyes.
Not that there’s anything wrong with that, of course.
It’s downright confusing.
Especially when they do it in the bathrooms:
Now imagine it all in slow mo’ with Barry purring . .
Feels so good you lying here next to me
Oh what a groove
You have no idea how it feels
My hands just won’t keep still
I love you babe, I love you, I love you
Just wanna run my fingers through your hair
Out o’sight right there
You like it right there closer, closer oh baby. . . .
And what’s with Pride? I know what a Pride event is and its positively gay!
Erh back to your men’s business.
HG
So anyway… back to Ali, I was fortunate to meet him once. I’ve got a photo of me and him somewhere, and a book signed by him.
He seemed to have little idea what was going on around him unfortunately (about 10 or 11 years ago). It was quite sad to see.
That may just have been the external signs of the Parkinsons.
I think for anyone looking to get their head around Ali the best film has to be When we were kings.
Superb!
HG
I think it was also what he was taking to stop the shaking. It was kind of making him “dopey” (I use that word in the most factual way possible).
And yeah, “When We Were Kings” is superb.
[quote=“irishstu”]
And yeah, “When We Were Kings” is superb.[/quote]
thrid that. One of my top 20 movies.
[quote=“Mer”]Very nice summation MotherTheresa. 
I certainly won’t dispute Ali’s greatness, and celebrity status. I do however think it would be interesting to see how Ali would have done against some of the next generation of boxers after his time as the sport of boxing grew, as well as with the increased focus on and money put into pro sports in general. How would Ali have faired against Evander Holyfield, Lennox Lewis, Riddick Bowe, or ever Mike Tyson - all notable heavyweight champs of the next era.
witz.org/archives/muhammad_a … eries.html
[/quote]
Good point.
Would not of done as well today. Lennox Lewis would of stopped him fairly easily. IF Ali were alive today he would of not of had the same upbringing etc. So impossible question to answer. I guess he would of done well in the light heavyweight division but not the heavyweight. Ali’s record for his time was also not fantastic (good as he was champion but not in the greats). He hardly made many defenses of his title for reasons not his fault.
Now joe Lewis on the other hand. Ali as a boxer was never even a shadow of Joe Lewis. Joe Lewis is regarded by nearly everyone in the sport as the greatest boxer there has ever been (followed by the real Rocky and Ali coming in about 5th or 6th). Ali was a greater man for sure but Lewis was easily and far away the best boxer ever. That statement is backed up by 99% of the boxing esablishement and fans.
here is the official web site of Joe Lewis
cmgww.com/sports/louis/quotes.htm
[quote=“fenlander”][quote=“Mer”]Very nice summation MotherTheresa.
I certainly won’t dispute Ali’s greatness, and celebrity status. I do however think it would be interesting to see how Ali would have done against some of the next generation of boxers after his time as the sport of boxing grew, as well as with the increased focus on and money put into pro sports in general. How would Ali have faired against Evander Holyfield, Lennox Lewis, Riddick Bowe, or ever Mike Tyson - all notable heavyweight champs of the next era.
witz.org/archives/muhammad_a … eries.html
[/quote]
Good point.
Would not of done as well today. Lennox Lewis would of stopped him fairly easily. IF Ali were alive today he would of not of had the same upbringing etc. So impossible question to answer. I guess he would of done well in the light heavyweight division but not the heavyweight. Ali’s record for his time was also not fantastic (good as he was champion but not in the greats). He hardly made many defenses of his title for reasons not his fault.
Now joe Lewis on the other hand. Ali as a boxer was never even a shadow of Joe Lewis. Joe Lewis is regarded by nearly everyone in the sport as the greatest boxer there has ever been (followed by the real Rocky and Ali coming in about 5th or 6th). Ali was a greater man for sure but Lewis was easily and far away the best boxer ever. That statement is backed up by 99% of the boxing esablishement and fans.
here is the official web site of Joe Lewis
cmgww.com/sports/louis/quotes.htm[/quote]
Um, I think you mean Joe Louis… not Joe Lewis.
Joe Louis was a… er, coloured fella, and heavyweight boxing champion of the world. This is the man considered by the majority of experts to have been the greatest heavyweight boxer of all time. Some would argue that Sugar Ray Robinson was actually a better boxer (“Pound for pound the best boxer who ever lived,” to quote his obits).
Joe Lewis is a… er, whitey, who was (in the 1970s) heavyweight full-contact karate champion. He was a friend of Bruce Lee, and the one that a) helped Bruce Lee test/prove his theories about Jeet Kun Do b) pioneered the combat/sport of what became known as kickboxing or full-contact karate in North America.
(Please back me up on this Mr. Kennedy)
But back to Ali…
Your main point is that Joe Louis and Rocky et al were better boxers.
Then why is Ali thought of as “The Greatest of All Time” and “Athlete of the Century” ?
Why is it that we care about Ali and couldn’t care less about Lennox Lewis?
Why is it that Ali continues to draw admiration and give inspiration, even though his last few years were dismal (he lost to Leonard Spinx!) and no one even remembers his last fight?
Two reasons, I think.
The first is that Ali stood for something and stood up for something.
The second is that Ali looked better on television and still gets much better press.
I mean, even George Foreman calls him “champ.”
And who else would get away with calling himself “The Greatest Of All Time”?
I’ll end with my favourite (UK spelling / US pronuniciation) Ali quote
[b][i]Howard Cosell: “Muhammad, you’re being extremely truculent.”
Muhammad Ali: “Whatever truculent means, if that’s good, I’m that.[/i]”[/b]
[quote=“Steve Zodiac”][quote=“fenlander”][quote=“Mer”]Very nice summation MotherTheresa.
I certainly won’t dispute Ali’s greatness, and celebrity status. I do however think it would be interesting to see how Ali would have done against some of the next generation of boxers after his time as the sport of boxing grew, as well as with the increased focus on and money put into pro sports in general. How would Ali have faired against Evander Holyfield, Lennox Lewis, Riddick Bowe, or ever Mike Tyson - all notable heavyweight champs of the next era.
witz.org/archives/muhammad_a … eries.html
[/quote]
Good point.
Would not of done as well today. Lennox Lewis would of stopped him fairly easily. IF Ali were alive today he would of not of had the same upbringing etc. So impossible question to answer. I guess he would of done well in the light heavyweight division but not the heavyweight. Ali’s record for his time was also not fantastic (good as he was champion but not in the greats). He hardly made many defenses of his title for reasons not his fault.
Now joe Lewis on the other hand. Ali as a boxer was never even a shadow of Joe Lewis. Joe Lewis is regarded by nearly everyone in the sport as the greatest boxer there has ever been (followed by the real Rocky and Ali coming in about 5th or 6th). Ali was a greater man for sure but Lewis was easily and far away the best boxer ever. That statement is backed up by 99% of the boxing esablishement and fans.
here is the official web site of Joe Lewis
cmgww.com/sports/louis/quotes.htm[/quote]
Um, I think you mean Joe Louis… not Joe Lewis.
Joe Louis was a… er, coloured fella, and heavyweight boxing champion of the world. This is the man considered by the majority of experts to have been the greatest heavyweight boxer of all time. Some would argue that Sugar Ray Robinson was actually a better boxer (“Pound for pound the best boxer who ever lived,” to quote his obits).
Joe Lewis is a… er, whitey, who was (in the 1970s) heavyweight full-contact karate champion. He was a friend of Bruce Lee, and the one that a) helped Bruce Lee test/prove his theories about Jeet Kun Do b) pioneered the combat/sport of what became known as kickboxing or full-contact karate in North America.
(Please back me up on this Mr. Kennedy)
But back to Ali…
Your main point is that Joe Louis and Rocky et al were better boxers.
Then why is Ali thought of as “The Greatest of All Time” and “Athlete of the Century” ?
Why is it that we care about Ali and couldn’t care less about Lennox Lewis?
Why is it that Ali continues to draw admiration and give inspiration, even though his last few years were dismal (he lost to Leonard Spinx!) and no one even remembers his last fight?
Two reasons, I think.
The first is that Ali stood for something and stood up for something.
The second is that Ali looked better on television and still gets much better press.
I mean, even George Foreman calls him “champ.”
And who else would get away with calling himself “The Greatest Of All Time”?
I’ll end with my favourite (UK spelling / US pronuniciation) Ali quote
[b][i]Howard Cosell: “Muhammad, you’re being extremely truculent.”
Muhammad Ali: “Whatever truculent means, if that’s good, I’m that.[/i]”[/b]
[/quote]
Yes correct I meant Joe Louis (spelling mistake as didn’t even know about the other one but I looked it up). Not the karate champion. No need for backing up you are corrrect.
Louis was thought of as the best by most “boxing” experts not the general public. Ask George Foreman who was the best boxer ever. He says that Ali was the greatest man but Joe Louis and Rocky Marcioni were the greatest boxers ever. By “we” you mean the general public. Yes of course Ali was the greatest man in boxing, but no way was the best boxer ever. Not even close. Ask the experts. Go onto George Foreman’s site or any other major boxer. George Foreman DOES NOT RATE ALI AS THE BEST BOXER HE RATES JOE LOUIS AS THE BEST BOXER. Nearly all boxing forums and polls done for serious boxing enthusiasts do not rate ALI as the best boxer. You will find a few that rate him high as a heavyweight but in general Joe Lois and Rocky Marcioni come out above him. That is just for heavyweights. If you ask who is the best pound for pound then he usually comes even lower. However I agree for the general public or general “sports” commentators he comes out very high or as number one, for the reasons you quoted above, but not for serious boxing fans and ex-boxers including Foreman.
Rocky Marcioni undoubtetly the best boxer ever.
Ali was a great showman and a very good boxer, but surely not The Best.
I agree with fenlander.
[quote=“igorveni”]Rocky Marcioni undoubtetly the best boxer ever.
[/quote]
Rocky Marciano could kick Rocky Marcioni’s arse!
[quote=“irishstu”][quote=“igorveni”]Rocky Marcioni undoubtetly the best boxer ever.
[/quote]
Rocky Marciano could kick Rocky Marcioni’s arse![/quote]
Yeah, I meant Marciano of course. 
[quote=“igorveni”][quote=“irishstu”][quote=“igorveni”]Rocky Marcioni undoubtetly the best boxer ever.
[/quote]
Rocky Marciano could kick Rocky Marcioni’s arse![/quote]
Yeah, I meant Marciano of course. [/quote]
Yeah Marciano was never ever defeated in a long careeer. Had a fantastic punch and a fantastic chin.
Wasn’t a pretty dancer though lol
Some people said he never fought high quality and that Joe Louis was over the hill when they fought. Well ALi didn’t have a fantastic record in terms of quantity. If he hadn’t ko’ed Foreman he would never of been where he was in terms of fame. Some say he was on drugs for that fight lol Of course that is riddiculous.
Maciano fought all the world had to offer, so it is a close call between him and Louis.
Yeah, what does George Foreman’s opinion of Joe Louis really mean, given that:
?
I would bet a large sum that Foreman’s opinion of Louis has far more to do with his verbal beating by Ali all through the summer of 1974, followed by a very public physical beating that October. In other words, if you ask George 100 times who between Louis and Ali is the greater fighter, don’t count on the answer ever being Ali.
Don’t get me wrong, I think Louis was a great fighter. Only weighed 195-200lbs in the ring, but what a punch. I remember seeing a film where the filmmaker had slowed each of Louis’s KO’s down enough to measure the forward distance of his fist. His KO punches routinely travelled less than 18 inches. If you watch his fight films carefully, you can see that Louis generated tremendous punching power mainly through his quick feet; his feet always moved and planted in such a way that his entire torso was wound like a spring against his hips. Not unlike a world-class golfer winds his torso against his hips, anchored by his feet, and from there generates great club head speed. There’s absolutely no doubt that Louis was a great, great puncher.
Ali had tremendous courage and great physical skills plus megawatt personal charm. That’s a hard combination to beat.
I was happy to lose that ten dollars.