Brexit


#821


#822

Yes the British are loving the GDP growth with -15 to -20% % in their back pocket.

That said, the rapid deflation of the currency has helped businesses no end to deal with the immediate crisis and prevented mass layoffs. Fortunately the U.K. economy was already approaching full employment at the time so has been in relatively good shape.

We will see what happens when Brexit actually occurs though.

By the way Germany trashes the U.K. In terms of economic power by almost any metric. According to this way of thinking the U.K. economy has shrunk 20%.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-37763913


#823

#824

I saw this elsewhere. It’s awesome. Exposing the unelected judicial system (just look into the background of the judges) and double daring all major parties to screw the populace out of this. Of course, this is also why a populace should not allow itself to be disarmed, but we may yet live in very interesting times. The traitors in our midst are really overplaying their hands here.


#825

More raving.
Of course judges are unelected! Do you think judges should be elected?!?

May wasn’t elected as prime minister either! Nor was Elizabeth elected as their Queen! Nor is the House of Lords! Oh but the people have spoken…Lols all round.

So you don’t Know much about U.K. History then?

The parliament almost always gets a say in the end. In fact they had a civil war about this very fact.


#826

Rowland having a spasm in the corner couldn’t even bring himself to comment :joy:


#827

I think most judges should be taken out and publicly flogged for being traitors along with almost that entire class of people. It’s great though that they’re exposing themselves as having complete contempt for the people of Britain because they will hasten their own demise. Again though, this is why people should not allow themselves to be disarmed.


#828

Judges are an important barrier for halting potentially dangerous extremist policy, whether it comes from the right or the left. They determine whether laws pass constitutional muster.


#829

So you don’t believe in democracy? You think that when people vote “the wrong way”, they should be overruled? When, other than at times when they agree with you, should democratic decisions actually be honoured then? I wonder what democracy actually is. All of this seems to be bringing out this fundamental contradiction.


#830

Surely a key function of the judiciary is preventing the executive from overstepping the mark in what they can do? In this case, all that’s happened is that they’ve said the government can’t unilaterally invoke article 50 without approval by parliament, the elected representatives of the people, which is in accordance with Britain’s requirements.

I’m not sure what’s undemocratic about that. Nobody is being overruled, it’s a check on the process, not a “block” or a forced change in the outcome. I was a remain voter myself, but don’t expect this to really make any difference.

What I find more dangerous is the idea that people should be armed to resist these decisions because they’ve read some headline about how the judges are stopping Brexit, without any actual understanding of what’s happening.


#831

I don’t believe in tyranny of the majority. Imagine if 50.001% of voters decided that left-handed people should be summarily imprisoned?

I believe in representative democracy. Simple-majority referenda held on issues of great consequence can result in disastrous courses of action being taken because too many people are easily deceived. Half of the population is of below average intelligence, after all.

Representative democracy backed by a robust constitution to protect human rights and establish a framework for governmental procedures is the way to go. It tempers the wild mood swings of the populace while still enabling the people to have a voice in government.

Judges have a very important role in this, too.

Consider California. In 2008, same-sex marriage became legal, but a referendum (Proposition 8) later that year stopped it, stripping away hard-won rights. After years of legal fights, the referendum was overturned, having been found unconstitutional, as it violated the Equal Protection clause, which guarantees equal rights for all.


#832

No one is arguing for left-handed people to be imprisoned. Nice try in conflating Brexit with bad people doing scary stuff.

I don’t believe in the tyranny of the minority, especially the elite. See how this works?

After years of legal fights where people tried to backdoor the will of the people, the referendum was overturned by a small group of the unelected. Another question for you though: if Trump wins, the Republicans control Congress and appointees to the Supreme Court overturn Roe vs Wade, what would your thoughts be about the judiciary then? Also, what are your thoughts on forcing people to bake cakes for people? What are your thoughts upon taking away people’s hard-won right to bear arms?

I think you pick and choose all of this and conveniently believe in the Constitution when and where it suits you. At other times, when it is convenient, you see it all as a living document.


#833

The U.K. Doesn’t have a constitution, hence this mess.

Just thought I’d point that out that along with the fact that head of state is unelected and Hereditary.

Nor can you go around threatening to take up arms against the government or the judges because they will investigate you, put you on a blacklist and/or put you in jail. Even owning a gun in the U.K. Is very difficult so yeah…more useless irrelevant raving.

For all the bleating about the rights of the 'common voters ’ landlords and families can be born into great wealth for hundreds of years and nobody bats an eyelid.

Why should somebody just own something because they
Inherited it? Was there a vote that that person could own the land or that share? What makes this more acceptable than a judge being unelected?

B-b-but Brexit is our wight. The e-wil EU is taking away our wights.

No
Your right is to be governed by the House of Lords abd the parliament and the monarchy and all those rich bastards who own all the land and property and shares.

It’s just a social construct that’s accepted.


#834

You seem to think that I think that this development is a bad thing. I think it is a very good thing. It is really going to wake a lot of people up.


#835

The idea of Parliament reversing the Brexit decision is madness. Honestly could be disastrous


#836

Lots of people think the Brexit decision is disastrous too. That’s why it was 52:48 for something they weren’t even sure what they were voting for.

For all the waffling this is a VERY good thing for the U.K…giving it time to take stock and debate the substance of the issue…what Brexit really means.
That’s democracy at work, checks and balances, debate, move forward.

Instead of that kindergarten shite…‘der takin r potato pickin jabs’…350 million a week from the magic red bus for yer poor people’s hospitals…Brexit means Brexit …lol.

Ps In many countries referendums get rerun all the time, just like elections, it seems British people are not really used to what referendums mean as if they are supposed to be one off events.


#837

I don’t know what you are taking about you seem to be talking about trump and guns or sumfing.


#838

Why shouldn’t judges be elected? It’s done lots of places.

It would be nice to resolve differences without resorting to civil war. England’s civil wars are more constructive than those of most countries, but still…


#839

Could lead to some interesting elections.


#840

[quote]Why should somebody just own something because they
Inherited it?
[/quote]
Wait, what? So if my old mum wills her bungalow to me when she kicks the bucket, the State (or the great unwashed) should decide whether I’m actually allowed to keep it?

Or perhaps you’re suggesting that, as in the US, inheritance taxes should be so crippling that ownership of virtually everything gradually transfers to the State?

Sure, large land holdings were originally obtained by violence. Somebody’s great-great-grandcester put a fence around it and threatened everyone thereabouts with a good kicking if they trespassed. “This is mine now” was all they had before land titling systems.

That was a long time ago. Give it a couple of centuries and the natural ebb and flow of things will see big estates sold off piecemeal; it happens all the time. If they’re not sold, they’re leased out to people who can use them. Yes, a tiny percentage of people get filthy rich by doing nothing. But is there any better solution?

As for un-democracy: Teresa May, WTF? That’s all I’m saying.