Call for comments on romanization

Arts & Sciences Culture & History
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quote:
Originally posted by Bu Lai En: OK Hobart, why is a standardised system necessary. Basically it's becasue if a number of different systems are used, then you really don't know how to pronounce that word. Even if you memorise how to use all the different systems, there may be no indication whoich system is being used. This is especially true of Chinese which has so many more homonyms than English.

Again there should be one system in Taiwan. I totally agree and it is laughable when you drive down a Taipei street and see many different names for the same road.

 <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, Geneva">quote[quote]<STRONG>Now, I think it would be good for Taiwanese to have the same system (Taiwanese kids are ggoing to use it too),</STRONG>[/quote]

I know that Taiwanese are biased, but they swear that bopomofo is superior for learning Chinese. I say let them keep it. It is not about what system Taiwanese people will use it is for foreigners right? Taiwanese can continue to use bopomofo. By the way, Tongyong might also be easier for Taiwanese to pronouce as well as they have all studied English and can easily decipher Tongyong. Unlike Hanyu’s nasty “X” among others.

  <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, Geneva">quote[quote]<STRONG>but sure, it's mostly for foreign students of Chinese and academics.  It's not jsut street signs.  When you're reading a newspaper, a magazine or a book, you'll often read Chinese words written in some form of romanisation, but won't know how to pronounce it because it won't tell you what system is being used.</STRONG>[/quote]

However, wouldn’t it be best if the system used was intuitive? Can’t Tongyong be improved to make it even easier. I am sure the creator of Tongyong would love your input and I see that he has already someone’s advice and made some changes. Try changing Hanyu Pinyin for the better. But again, there is no need for Hanyu pinyin to change, as I feel it is fine for the academics. I like Hanyu pinyin very much. It is what I have grown accustomed to from my University days. However, it is simply a fact that one must spend a little time to learn it. That is no good for my parents when they visit me in a few months or the numerous business persons that land in Taiwan every day for the first time. Tongyong is the better of the two systems for these first timers. Do not expect someon reading a New York Times article to be able to read Pin Yin’s “X” or “C” or “ZH” for example.

quote:

Not having tones is a downer, but not useles. Someone who doesn’t know Chinese won’t be able to say it, but someone who does will be able to experiment with different tones until the person she’s talking to clicks.

As I said above however, they will NOT be able to experiment with how to say Zhong or Xin. Regarding the Tong Yong “C” I feel it needs to be changed immediately to gain acceptance and my approval. However, given a choice between Hanyu and TongYong for first timers to Taiwan or those reading a New York Times article about a parade down Zhong Xiao East Rd. Tong Yong wins.

quote:

Finally, although I realise the main reason people don’t want to choose Mainland Pinyin is politics, but I just don’t by the argument that chosing that system will adversely affect Taiwan’s ‘China situation’.

I disagree. The CCP reaches for anything that holds up their facade that Taiwan is a part of the PRC. Any way in which Taiwan can differentiate itself, and moreover, be superior to the PRC is of great benefit to the way the uninformed percieve Taiwan.

quote:

Instead consider this quote from a zhongwen.com discussion on where to go to study Chinese “Taiwan sounds OK, but I don’t want to study there becuase I’m alreasdy used to Pinyin and I don’t want to learn bopomofo”. All foreign students of Chinese are taught using pinyin. I think some of Taiwan’s best friends overseas are going to be people who studied Chinese in Taiwan. We should really be encouraging people to come here and be brainwashed by Taiwan rather than China.

Bri

This is not a good point as the serious students of Chinese know that it is best to learn the Complex Chinese Characters before learning the Simplified ones which is much easier than the other way around. Finally it is easy to find schools in Taiwan using HanYu Pinyin texts. Romanizations are simply an aid to learn Chinese characters. If you are a Chinese student then it makes more sense to be in a place surrounded by Complex Chinese Characters than it does in a place that uses the Simplified ones. Again you can find many schools in Taiwan using HanYu Pinyin text books and the serious student would not want to study simplified Chinese characters found in the PRC.

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quote[quote]I know that Taiwanese are biased, but they swear that bopomofo is superior for learning Chinese... ...Do not expect someone reading a New York Times article to be able to read Pin Yin's "X" or "C" or "ZH" for example.[/quote]

And if you are a student of Chinese then you’d know they are right, bopomofo is superior. For starters, the locals know it, so if you aren’t sure on the pronunciation of a new word, you can always ask a local. The other is, you start learning how to pronounce words correctly. The next best system is the hanyu pinyin as that is what all students, not studying in Taiwan, learn. It is also what the majority of Chinese speaking people learn as well.

When you learn a new language, the first thing you learn is the pronunciation of their alphabet, which may have more or less characters than the English. You can consider bopomofo as the Chinese alphabet.

And who gives a rat’s ass about making it easier for the English speaking population, and, yes, English is my mother tongue. I’m sure any form of “English” romanization doesn’t make it any easier for a European or a Muslim, especially if their English is worse than the average Taiwanese.

What? Do you expect Germany to place English spelling on all their road signs, replacing most of the "W"s with "V"s, just to make it easier for the English speaker? I think not!

And what about Sm

43

I agree with both of you that Bopomofo is a better system of phoneticisation, but a system of romanisation (ie abcs) is also needed. If you are reading books about China, they’re fnalyl getting to the point wher noone uses Wade Gilese anymore. There’s a standard, and it’s Dalu Pinyin. Now Taiwan wants to fuck it all up (oops can’t control my language) by intorducing a new standard. Like if I’m reading the paper in Taiwan, or an article in a magazine, how am I to know what system they’re using. They often don’t write the chracters next to it, so if I want to discuss it with someone it’s difficult.

I agree that Tawian is a better place to study Chinese, but a lot of people think differently, and they might be being a bit shortsighted, but the use of the pinyin that they’re used to in the mainland is a factor for them. Almost every institution in Taiwan uses bopomo - Shida for instance which is the most popular school. I think it would be nice if Taiwan and China were both to adopt an improved bopomo, but it’s just not gong to happen. Pinyn is the new standard. If Taiwan adopts something else it’s just isolatng itself.

Bri

44

Beijing will host the 2008 Olympic Games. This could be both a bad news and good news to tongyong pinyin.

Bad news: I don’t think Beijing would change its romanization system for the Olympic Games. (South Korea has done this for the 2002 World Cup finals by changing Inchon to Incheon, but I’d be very, very surprised if Beijing should decide to do so.) So in the next seven years the world will be happily learning the Chinese pronunciations of those X’s and Q’S.

Good news: Tongyong pinyin fundamentalists will get a chance to sell their romanization product to Beijing, as they believe that tongyong pinyin is a much superior system that doesn’t harass innocent foreigners with those X’s and Q’S.

45
quote:
Originally posted by Bu Lai En: I agree with both of you that Bopomofo is a better system of phoneticisation, but a system of romanisation (ie abcs) is also needed. If you are reading books about China, they're fnalyl getting to the point wher noone uses Wade Gilese anymore. There's a standard, and it's Dalu Pinyin. Now Taiwan wants to fuck it all up (oops can't control my language) by intorducing a new standard. Like if I'm reading the paper in Taiwan, or an article in a magazine, how am I to know what system they're using. They often don't write the chracters next to it, so if I want to discuss it with someone it's difficult.

If Taiwan adopted the TongYong System, then you would easily know how to pronouce the romanized characters that you saw. You would pronouce it the TongYong Way.

quote:
I agree that Tawian is a better place to study Chinese, but a lot of people think differently, and they might be being a bit shortsighted, but the use of the pinyin that they're used to in the mainland is a factor for them. Almost every institution in Taiwan uses bopomo - Shida for instance which is the most popular school. I think it would be nice if Taiwan and China were both to adopt an improved bopomo, but it's just not gong to happen. Pinyn is the new standard. If Taiwan adopts something else it's just isolatng itself.

Bri

Isolate itself from where? The Communist PRC? Not such a bad thing actually.

46
quote:
On this note, I wonder why the Taiwan News chose to describe Hanyu Pinyin as "the People's Republic of China system" (see Cranky's post above) rather than the (to me) more accurate "the Romanization system recognized and used exclusively throughout the entire international community around the world, apart from Taiwan... but sometimes used in Taiwan also."

The answer to this is that the Taiwan News, now owned and operated by I-mei, i.e. the DPP(and soon to actually move to the I-mei building) wants to promote glorious, wonderful Tongyong, promoted by our diligent, very un-Chinese Taiwanese scholars, while the other system, the (evil) pinyin is just a plot foisted on unsuspecting Taiwanese by the mainland to assimilate Taiwan!
You see, the News hasn’t exactly been the most objective paper lately. I admit the other papers aren’t that great, either, but the Taiwan News lately is just a DPP political tool. I suspect this ‘forum’ is not aimed at gauging real opinions, but at gathering DPP support.
Don’t let that stop you from contributing, though.

47
quote:
Originally posted by Poagao: I suspect this 'forum' is not aimed at gauging real opinions, but at gathering DPP support.

In case there is any misunderstanding of that last part, I was talking about the Taiwan News forum, not this forum here.

As far as romanization goes, it seems to me that the world has already decided on a standard, which is Pinyin. Taiwan could choose Tongyong, just as it has chosen various other systems over the years and no doubt could continue choosing the various ‘native’ romanization systems that crop up from time to time, or it can join the rest of the world in this respect. The fact is that what almost all of us speak is mandarin Chinese, and there is already a standard romanization for it, and that is Pinyin. Whether Pinyin is good or not seems rather useless to debate at this point. If we listen to the arguments for using Tongyong, then we should stop using inches or meters or kilograms or pounds and go back to the original traditional measurements, back to the lunar calendar, back to the original periods of the day, and tell the rest of the world, with its calendar, its hours, measurements, etc. to go screw itself.
Oh, but wait! All of our traditional measurements, language, calendar, etc., came from China. Can’t have that. I guess we’ll just have to come up with new ones, then.

48
quote:
Originally posted by Poagao:

As far as romanization goes, it seems to me that the world has already decided on a standard, which is Pinyin. [/QB]

The Communist PRC decided on that standard not the world!? You want to blindly follow what is thrust upon you? You would do good in the PRC accepting easily what is forced upon you.

quote:

Taiwan could choose Tongyong, just as it has chosen various other systems over the years and no doubt could continue choosing the various ‘native’ romanization systems that crop up from time to time, or it can join the rest of the world in this respect.

What rest of the world? You mean students of Chinese? They are the only ones that really use Hanyu PinYin. If you are referring to how newspapers write such things as Zhong Xiao East Rd. Well, I don’t know anyone back home where I am from that could read that properly. Tong Yong solves this problem of how to pronouce “X” or “Q” in Hanyu Pinyin.

quote:

The fact is that what almost all of us speak is mandarin Chinese, and there is already a standard romanization for it, and that is Pinyin. Whether Pinyin is good or not seems rather useless to debate at this point.

That seems ridiculous. First off, 85% of the population perhaps more, also speaks MinNan Hua, TaiYu, Taiwanese or whatever you want to call it. Furthermore, it is precisely my point that if Hanyu Pinyin is flawed it should be improved. Rather than improve something you are advocating to just accept its faults, because you say, well that what the PRC is using, it is the standard. I should use it. You sound like you were raised in Communist China. What a sheep you are.

quote:

If we listen to the arguments for using Tongyong,

You mean arguments like Tongyong is more intuitive? Easier for people to read? Excellent for newbie tourists and other English speakers. Arguments like there is no need to take a short course to learn how to prounounce Tongyong, unlike Hanyu!

quote:

then we should stop using inches or meters or kilograms or pounds and go back to the original traditional measurements, back to the lunar calendar, back to the original periods of the day, and tell the rest of the world, with its calendar, its hours, measurements, etc. to go screw itself.
Oh, but wait! All of our traditional measurements, language, calendar, etc., came from China. Can’t have that. I guess we’ll just have to come up with new ones, then.

I think you and many others are confused. Tongyong is not the system widely implemented in Taiwan today. As far as I know there is no system now. They tried to implement Tongyong on the streets but as far as I see it is a mess. Perhaps Mayor Ma, screwed it up on purpose. He is such a loser. How could he have 3 or 4 different spellings for the same street name as you travel across Taipei. That is not TongYong, that is KMT Mayor Ma’s stupid mistake. It is a mess. Also, Tongyong is not the tradition. It is a NEW system. Traditionalists and sheep like you would have us using Hanyu Pinyin. Tongyong builds upon and improves HanYu to make it easier for tourists and casual readers to pick up the first time they see it.

I feel that Hanyu Pinyin should be used for Academics and students as a tool for learning Chinese and that Tongyong should be used by Taiwan and the world as a laymans tool for help in sounding out Chinese while say on a trip to Taiwan.

Here is quote from a mouthpiece of the Chinese Communist Party regarding Tongyong being used in Taiwan. “The irreversible fact, that seems to have been overlooked, is that Chinese is the lingua franca of Taiwan. No matter how hard the Taiwan authorities try to avoid Chinese, Taiwan and its people remain an inseparable part of China.” People’s Daily Article About Taiwan Implementing TongYong

You are in bad company advocating HanYu PinYin for Taiwan. Politics is a major factor for NOT choosing HanYu Pinyin as the above quote illustrates the potential CCP propaganda if Taiwan accepts the standard of the Communist PRC. It is not necessary especially when TongYong seeks to improve the faults of Hanyu Pinyin and make it easier for first timers to read without a primer.

Finally, I was taught Hanyu Pinyin while at University. I like it. However, it is not easy for other foreigners, in Taiwan (that never studied Chinese) to read Hanyu Pinyin street signs. I feel that many of the Hanyu Pinyin advocates have already studied Chinese and are selfishly advocating what they already know, to the detriment of those that have never studied HanYu Pinyin and just landed in Taiwan for tourism or business. Furthermore, if they have studied Chinese, then they should just read the Chinese Characters. For the layman TongYong is easier and is striving to be better. Keep HanYu Pinyin for the academics and let Taiwan implement TongYong for the tourists and business expats.

49
quote:
Originally posted by Hobart:

Perhaps Mayor Ma, screwed it up on purpose. He is such a loser. How could he have 3 or 4 different spellings for the same street name as you travel across Taipei. That is not TongYong, that is KMT Mayor Ma’s stupid mistake. Traditionalists and sheep like you would have us using Hanyu Pinyin. Tongyong builds upon and improves HanYu to make it easier for tourists and casual readers to pick up the first time they see it.

You are in bad company advocating HanYu PinYin for Taiwan. Politics is a major factor for NOT choosing HanYu Pinyin as the above quote illustrates the potential CCP propaganda if Taiwan accepts the standard of the Communist PRC. It is not necessary especially when TongYong seeks to improve the faults of Hanyu Pinyin and make it easier for first timers to read without a primer.

I feel that many of the Hanyu Pinyin advocates have already studied Chinese and are selfishly advocating what they already know, to the detriment of those that have never studied HanYu Pinyin and just landed in Taiwan for tourism or business.

Confusing spellings on street signs have been around here a lot longer than Mayor Ma.

Why do I claim that Hanyu Pinyin is an international standard? Because the United Nations has set it as such, because it is the most widely used internationally for the official romanization of Chinese, and Tongyong, simply put, isn’t. The operative word here is standard, and Tongyong, which some claim is more intuitive, even though that is a purely subjective judgement, cannot meet the requirements to be a standard.

Foreigners coming here would presumably be coming from someplace, and it is almost certain that the romanization they encountered there would be Hanyu Pinyin. To introduce yet another system, just to use while they are in Taiwan, would serve no purpose and just be confusing. In any case, no one just visiting or doing business is going to be able to pronounce Chinese words correctly anyway, no matter what system you use, and I doubt most of them are even interested in ‘picking up’ Chinese right away anyway. The important thing is that the spellings are the same everywhere, i.e. standard.

I am aware that most people speak Hokkien as well as Mandarin. That doesn’t change the fact that pretty much everyone here speaks Mandarin.

The situation is more complex than saying “Anything related to PRC=evil”. Both sides of the strait share a lot of culture, language and traditions. I don’t see why sharing a romanization would be such a horrible thing. It wouldn’t symbolize the ROC’s capitulation to the PRC, it wouldn’t be an invitation for Beijing to come over and start shooting people. All it would do is send a signal that Taiwan is ready to join the international community by adopting the UN standard for the romanization of Chinese and make Chinese words standard and similar worldwide.

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“The situation is more complex than saying “Anything related to PRC=evil”. Both sides of the strait share a lot of culture, language and traditions. I don’t see why sharing a romanization would be such a horrible thing. It wouldn’t symbolize the ROC’s capitulation to the PRC, it wouldn’t be an invitation for Beijing to come over and start shooting people. All it would do is send a signal that Taiwan is ready to join the international community by adopting the UN standard for the romanization of Chinese and make Chinese words standard and similar worldwide.”

Thank you, Poagao, for hitting the nail on the head so admirably. Thank you also for declining to rise to Hobart’s childish flame-baiting (loser, sheep, etc.).

Hobart, you are really shooting your arguments in the foot with your recent posts. How are we supposed to take you seriously when you revert to playground histrionics instead of rational argument. Grow up a little if you want to play with the big boys.

51

Dear Paogoa and Sandman,

I do not feel that anything related to the PRC is evil. I love traveling in China and I love the people of China. What I do not like is the CCP. You know the ones pointing missles at you now threatening you should Taiwanese dare stand up and ask for some respect.

Please respond to the following critique from the Chinese Communist Party mouthpiece the People’s Daily.

“The irreversible fact, that seems to have been overlooked, is that Chinese is the lingua franca of Taiwan. No matter how hard the Taiwan authorities try to avoid Chinese, Taiwan and its people remain an inseparable part of China.”
http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200010/14/print20001014_52623.html

Here is exactly what I am talking about. It would be too dangerous and totally unnecessary for Taiwan to join the PRC in using the same Romanization. Would people in Taiwan surnamed Chang have to change their English spelling to Zhang? Or Chou to Zhou?

Countries need individuality. The unique spellings that Taiwan uses is one way to maintain its individuality.

I think this argument has been brought up before, but would you advocate that the US and the UK have uniformity in their spellings? Which version should they decide on? I think the British enjoy being different or should I say superior?

A world standard is not necessary, however, a Taiwanese standard is necessary. By the way, do you also advocate Simplified Chinese characters for use in Taiwan like in China?

I agree with the Big Dork, it is too chaotic here. There needs to be one standard used in Taiwan. Tongyong would be easier to try to pronouce so no one would have any trouble with the way Chinese is romanized here.

If Pro-Communist China Unificationists like Ma, Lien and Soong don’t like it. So be it. Ask someone fresh off the boat which they prefer. They would say Tongyong. Ask them if they care if it is different standard from China, I doubt they would care, especially when they find out that Hanyu Pinyin is flawed and not so easy to figure out for first timers. They might say why doesn’t the PRC adopt TongYong too?

Sandman, stop pushing a flawed romanization on Taiwan and let them evolve and improve things. They are free soveriegn nation and they can choose whichever Romanization they feel like choosing. Allow them this freedom and learn to live with Tongyong. By the way, why do you really care so much? By accepting Hanyu Pinyin Taiwan is not joining the International community, they are joining the PRC. The PRC is the one pushing and using Hanyu Pinyin. They created it. Adopting HanYu Pinyin does not make Taiwan more internationalized, however, joining the UN would. Why don’t you instead advocate this for Taiwan?

52
quote:
Originally posted by Hobart: Dear Poagao and Sandman,

Please respond to the following critique from the Chinese Communist Party mouthpiece the People’s Daily…

…Here is exactly what I am talking about. It would be too dangerous and totally unnecessary for Taiwan to join the PRC in using the same Romanization. Would people in Taiwan surnamed Chang have to change their English spelling to Zhang? Or Chou to Zhou?

I think this argument has been brought up before, but would you advocate that the US and the UK have uniformity in their spellings?

A world standard is not necessary, however, a Taiwanese standard is necessary.

Tongyong would be easier to try to pronouce so no one would have any trouble with the way Chinese is romanized here.

Ask someone fresh off the boat which they prefer. They would say Tongyong. Ask them if they care if it is different standard from China, I doubt they would care, especially when they find out that Hanyu Pinyin is flawed and not so easy to figure out for first timers. They might say why doesn’t the PRC adopt TongYong too?

Sandman, stop pushing a flawed romanization on Taiwan and let them evolve and improve things. They are free soveriegn nation and they can choose whichever Romanization they feel like choosing. Allow them this freedom and learn to live with Tongyong. By the way, why do you really care so much? By accepting Hanyu Pinyin Taiwan is not joining the International community, they are joining the PRC. The PRC is the one pushing and using Hanyu Pinyin. They created it. Adopting HanYu Pinyin does not make Taiwan more internationalized, however, joining the UN would. Why don’t you instead advocate this for Taiwan?

I don’t see why I should have to reply to a quote by the People’s Daily. As you state so eloquently, Taiwan is free to choose whichever romanization it deems best. If that weren’t the case, we wouldn’t be arguing about it here. This does not, however, mean that Taiwan should choose another system just to spite the CCP. The fact is that Hanyu Pinyin is recognized by the United Nations as the official method of romanzation for Chinese. I would find it peculiar that Taiwan would strive so ardently to enter the UN while at the same time spurning UN standards such as Pinyin.

British English and American English are far more similar to each other than Pinyin and Tongyong. The difference which bars any such analogy is mutual intelligability.

As for your assumption that you know what ‘someone just off the boat’ would say, I would think they would wonder why the romanizations in Taiwan for the same Chinese words are different from every other country they have visited. I would say a world standard is actually necessary.

I still don’t see what danger exists for Taiwan by adopting Pinyin, apart from your mysterious quote from a newspaper.

As for spelling names differently, I doubt that adopting pinyin would affect most Taiwanese. 張先生 would still be 張先生, no matter whether it said Chang or Zhang under the “English” part of his passport. English romanization is a relatively trivial matter for most Taiwanese; people change ‘English’ names on almost a daily basis, as I’m sure you’ve all noticed.

In short, Hanyu Pinyin is not perfect, but neither is Tongyong. Some may claim one or the other is more ‘intuitive’ but that really depends on the individual. Pinyin does have the advantage of being the official UN method of Chinese romanization, and is used worldwide, not just in the PRC, and that identity as a global standard is something that Tongyong cannot compete with.

53

Aside from the confusion created by Hanyu Pinyin vs Tongyong and the other romanisations in use, which ONLY Tongyong supporters seem to gloss over:

There is more than one way you can type traditional chinese on your computer in Hanyu Pinyin (even if Microsoft has not yet joined that party). How long would we need to wait for Tongyong input method???

If Taiwan adopted Hanyu Pinyin I am sure it would quickly become one of the available IME when you selected Taiwan as your home in Windows. Adopt Tongyong and wait a long time.

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There is already a tongyong IME. I don’t know if it corresponds to what is now being called tongyong. One of tongyong’s creators has declared that the input method is tongyong’s greatest strength. This, of course, only shows how astonishingly weak the arguments for tongyong are.

Chih-Hao Tsai, who posted earlier in this thread, has made a hanyu pinyin input method for Big5 (traditional Chinese) Windows 95/98. It’s very useful. I also encourage everyone to look through the rest of his excellent website.

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I just got my sons ROC passport. When we had to fill in the details for the personal information page we were given a sheet of paper with telling use how to spell his Chinese name using PinYin. Yes we had to write his name in PinYin for his ROC passport. The same, my wife’s passport has her Chinese name spelt in PinYin. Mine doesn’t though, mine isn’t an ROC passport.

PS: I find I can read and pronounce Chinese better when I am reading B P M F. I just bought the kiddies books from the book shop, got my wife to help a little and there you go, it wasn’t too hard.

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quote[quote]I just got my sons ROC passport. When we had to fill in the details for the personal information page we were given a sheet of paper with telling use how to spell his Chinese name using PinYin. Yes we had to write his name in PinYin for his ROC passport. The same, my wife's passport has her Chinese name spelt in PinYin. [/quote]

Really? I just want to be sure that when you say “pinyin” you mean “hanyu pinyin” (i.e. the system used everywhere in the world but Taiwan). Are there X’s and Q’s and ZH’s on the page you were given and instructed to use? Or does the system look like www.romanization.com/tongyong/mps2.html ? Technically speaking, all romanization systems (hanyu, tongyong, Wade-Giles, Yale, etc.) are pinyin.

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Please send all informed opinions on pinyin debate to editor@etwaiwannews.com for publication in Taiwan News. We are interested in public discourse on this matter.

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Dear Quirky,

I would, but frankly, I’m a little hesitant. You see, the last time I wrote a letter to the editor, it was rebutted by one Mr. Liang Rong-Mao, who identified himself as the President of the Association of Taiwan Languages. He is also the newly-installed head of the Bureau of Investigation, is he not? In his letter, he basically told foreigners that they should not involve themselves “too readily in issues closely related to political ideology, such as language policy”. This is at the same time that the Taiwan News is asking for comments!!! And then Poagoa, who appears to be quite well informed on the subject, tells us that Mr. Liang does a lot of the backroom editorializing there. The whole thing makes me nervous. I mean on the one hand, they’re asking you for opinions, and on the other hand they’re warning you against giving any which might be critical.

Will the Taiwan News publish letters to the editor anonymously? Will they come clean as to who Mr. Liang really is? I think that this is relevant considering that because of his office, he could be in a position to make trouble for anyone who disagreed with him too loudly. Why would he warn foreign residents & taxpayers about involving themselves in civic issues? Isn’t that what a democracy is all about? In western nations, we encourage civic participation and responsibility. We believe it makes good citizens. Here, we’re basically being told to shut up.

Anyway, I think it’s obvious that the Taiwan News is on its last legs. I think that if one really wants to get one’s opinion publicized, one would reach a much greater audience through the Taipei Times or the China Post.