Chen Found not guilty of Embezzling Diplomatic Funds

[ul]Former Taiwan president cleared of embezzling diplomatic funds+
TAIPEI, June 8 Kyodo - (EDS: WILL BE LED)
Former Taiwan president Chen Shui-bian was found not guilty Tuesday of embezzling diplomatic funds, though he remains in detention ahead of Fridayappeal court rulings in four other cases.
A Taipei District Court spokesman said the court found there was no
evidence that Chen diverted money from diplomatic expenses to his son, Chen Chih-chung, who was studying in the United States at the time.[/ul]

More cases still to come~! But the Chen camp now has some serious ammo.

Not guilty in a court of law. Guilty as sin in the court of public opinion. Sorry, DPP. I support and admire your goals, but Chen is a crook.

etaiwannews.com/etn/news_con … TAIWAN_eng

Rule of law not good enough for you? Well, I guess that Ma is guilty as sin of embezzlement and fraud then too.

Works both ways, bucko.

So he’s guilty of taking the other millions and of money laundering and of bribe-taking and corruption, but he’s not guilty of diverting diplomatic funds. Phew! Well, THAT’S a relief! But wait! Isn’t this supposed to be a kangaroo court hell-bent on crucifying Chen come what may?
My goodness! And they found him NOT guilty? My goodness! What kind of fit-up is it when … gasp … the sap ISN’T fitted up?
Could it…? Is it possible that…? NAAAAAH! No WAY are those dirty Blues playing a fair clean game! :laughing:

[quote=“sandman”]So he’s guilty of taking the other millions and of money laundering and of bribe-taking and corruption, but he’s not guilty of diverting diplomatic funds. Phew! Well, THAT’S a relief! But wait! Isn’t this supposed to be a kangaroo court hell-bent on crucifying Chen come what may?
My goodness! And they found him NOT guilty? My goodness! What kind of fit-up is it when … gasp … the sap ISN’T fitted up?
Could it…? Is it possible that…? NAAAAAH! No WAY are those dirty Blues playing a fair clean game! :laughing:[/quote]

Ah, Sandy, I knew I could count on you. It IS supposed to be a kangaroo court, that’s why the judge was handpicked. But way back in 2006 or so, the original prosecutor Eric Chen had said there was no evidence that any gov’t money had found its way into Chen’s accounts – unlike Ma Ying-jeou, whom no one disputed had downloaded buckets of gov’t money into his private accounts. I think this will have an effect on some of the other cases involving the people around Chen.

So the dispute is really over whether you regard businessmens’ payments to the Chen family as bribes or as political contributions. I always thought they were two words for the same thing…

Yes and no. The KMT has stacked the cards heavily against Chen, but that doesn’t mean the least credible charges were always going to stick. The KMT can influence the courts, but they don’t hand the verdicts down for the judges to read.

If it were the case that the KMT could decide the outcome of every trial, no matter how ludicrously hollow the case for the prosecution, every member of the DPP leadership would be in jail due to “corruption”. As it is the power they have is more limited. Doesn’t mean that Chen is getting a fair trial in any way.

[quote]Doesn’t mean that Chen is getting a fair trial in any way.
[/quote]
No more than he deserves, that dirty no-good Green.

Imagine that: let a man prepare a reasonably proper defense and some of the original charges start to drop like flies. Imagine that.

The man is innocent! Innocent, I tell you!

Of course he’s not innocent, but if much of the original trial’s verdicts are overturned then it really gives a lot mroe credence to the notion that it was a farce.

I’m not of the opinion that the entire legal system is in bed with the KMT, but it was hard to watch the first trial and not conclude that Chen was not given a fair trial.

As I’ve said all along, I want to know what he really did, so he can be judged on that, and not on the speculation and slander of his enemies.

They did convict him of embezzling the special funds (I think it was that), as AP pointed out in its short article on it. But the “You should have known” conviction for money laundering was completely ridiculous, as the prosecutors apparently had no solid evidence he had been involved. Sadly, now some of the current crop of people from his administration now facing indictments, are facing indictments that read “you should have known…”

Who was the judge in the case? I haven’t able to find out.

Time for a protest, about something. I sense there is a protest or two in here somewhere.

[quote=“sandman”][quote]Doesn’t mean that Chen is getting a fair trial in any way.
[/quote]
No more than he deserves[/quote]

And who decides who deserves fair trials and who doesn’t? The government? The KMT? The media?

If fair trials are rationed out according to people’s prejudices then eventually good people will be caught up too.

He is certainly “innocent” of banking over 30 million US dollars in foreign bank accounts. All on his Presidential salary too. He is so innocent he has only repatriated about 2 mil of it back to Taiwan so far, because , well he is innocent of course.

Tommy, Chen never claimed that the millions came from his presidential salary, but were political donations dating back many years.

Until a few years ago, politicians could accept unlimited donations, and only had to report what they spent, and could keep whatever was left over. Hence Chen having millions was not only legal but not particularly noteworthy. Millions are normal in Taiwan politics, where irrigation board chief or ag coop elections used to be more expensive than US Senate elections. Remember that in the 1990s Chu An-hsiung bought the Kaohsiung City Council for US$10 million just to be speaker, meaning that he expected to recoup much more than that in bribes and payoffs and kickbacks.

BTW, the judge in the case was not the person who was handpicked to convict after the judge who let him out of detention was pressured to step down.

Four more verdicts out Friday.

Vorkosigan

[quote=“Mucha Man”]Of course he’s not innocent, but if much of the original trial’s verdicts are overturned then it really gives a lot mroe credence to the notion that it was a farce.

I’m not of the opinion that the entire legal system is in bed with the KMT, but it was hard to watch the first trial and not conclude that Chen was not given a fair trial.

As I’ve said all along, I want to know what he really did, so he can be judged on that, and not on the speculation and slander of his enemies.[/quote]

Yes, I think the whole process has been wonderful for the DPP, on the whole. They’ve detained him since 2008, meaning that he has been silenced, enabling Tsai to move the DPP into the post-Chen era with nary a whimper from him. He has been both detained and silenced, meaning that he isn’t out making random stupid and bombastic things that would distract from the KMT’s limitless incompetence, venality, colonialism, and authoritarianism. Had he been free, he could have severely impacted the DPP’s forward motion. Locked up and silenced, he has ceased to exist.

Internationally, since the trial is so obviously political, it has created much international criticism of the Ma government for very little benefit for that government – even among individuals predisposed not to criticize the government.

Great work by the KMT!

Vorkosigan

IF the millions he acquired were legal then they are legal. I believe this is subject to debate as the prevailing thinking is that it is NOT legal to amass money in this manner. Or perhaps he got too much. Had it been 3 million instead of 30 million perhaps it wouldnt have come to light.

But we need to establish whether this is legal practice or not. If its legal, let him out.

Chu an hsiung was very wealthy already, not sure if he was using this position for bribe taking.
Hes got the money. He may have been out for more power to get more of his businesses on track. Power to beget more money rather then straight bribery per se.

Taiwanese Presidents dont get to go on speaking tours like US Presidents. The Clintons have made more then 100 mil on books and speeches.

So should we “pity” Chennie and let him out?

No doubt to the KMT it was never about the money , it was bout the mouth. Keeping the MOUTH shut, and that they have done. I think it was the KMT that wanted a quiet Chen. The DPP simply benefited by default.

Perhaps now he will get a PRes Horsey pardon and be out among us again. Well not me , specifically as I am here, but you guys over there , yes.

[quote=“sandman”]So he’s guilty of taking the other millions and of money laundering and of bribe-taking and corruption, but he’s not guilty of diverting diplomatic funds. Phew! Well, THAT’S a relief! But wait! Isn’t this supposed to be a kangaroo court hell-bent on crucifying Chen come what may?
My goodness! And they found him NOT guilty? My goodness! What kind of fit-up is it when … gasp … the sap ISN’T fitted up?
Could it…? Is it possible that…? NAAAAAH! No WAY are those dirty Blues playing a fair clean game! :laughing:[/quote]

Campaign left overs … so did ‘Money’ Soong … He is not in jail … :ponder: but then they were sooo poor when he was a child, they didn’t even have doors in the houses … now he has several house in the US … with doors … :roflmao:

[quote=“Belgian Pie”]
Campaign left overs … so did ‘Money’ Soong … He is not in jail … :ponder: but then they were sooo poor when he was a child, they didn’t even have doors in the house … now he has several house in the US … with doors … :roflmao:[/quote]

Campaign left overs, was Chen Shui Bians explanation for where the 10’s of millions of US$'s came from. He was charged and found guilty I believe of corruption, fraud and money-laundering. In particular to accepting bribes to facilitate two property deals and laundering the funds overseas.

As to whether or not he got a fair trial, changing judges seemed like political influence trying to manipulate the outcome, I dont know if there was or wasn’t from a legal perspective beyond all reasonable doubt that the money was indeed from bribes rather than campaign expenses. I seem to remember there was quite a bit of solid evidence and testimony that substantiated the claim, along with the land in question being sold well under the market value.

I also agree with Vorkosigan that Taiwan and the opposition have been doing much better with Chen out of the way, and with Ma’s popularity not so great, and I believe if he goes ahead and signs ECFA, once the details are known, plenty of ammunition to attack him will be available. So am wondering what secret weapon the KMT will use to boost popularity.