# Chinese translations that seem to make no sense but actually do **URL:** \ **Category:** Learning Chinese\ **Created:** [January 26, 2018, 6:30am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779 "2018-01-26T06:30:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![hansioux](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/hansioux/32/253648_2.png) [@hansioux](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/hansioux)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 6:30am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/1 "2018-01-26T06:30:37Z")
For years and years I wondered why the heck would Switzerland be translated in to Rui-shi (瑞士)… It’s only a few days ago that it dawned on me, that thing is supposed to be read in Taigi or Cantonese… Taigi: Suī-sū 瑞士 Cantonese: seoi6-si6 瑞士 Mando: Ruì-shì 瑞士 The same goes for Sweden 瑞典 as well. Compare to the usage when transcribing Venezuela 委內瑞拉, the seems the person who made that transcription spoke Mandarin. So the person that popularized this transcription of Swiss had to be either a Min speaker or an Yue speaker, or at least someone who spoke a language closer to Middle Chinese. How did Middle Chinese /s/ turn in to Modern Chinese /ɻ/ in the first place? Perhaps it was a case of /t/ to /ts/ to /j/ and split to /s/ and /ɻ/? ---
**Author:** ![yyy](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/yyy/32/12085_2.png) [@yyy](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/yyy)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 6:52am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/2 "2018-01-26T06:52:30Z")
It made sense to me when I noticed that Nigeria is (in one spelling) 尼日利亞. If you take the pinyin r as /ʐ/ rather than /ɻ/, it’s no stretch to see it as /ʒ/, from which it’s no stretch to see it as /ʃ/, and we all know how /ʃ/ and /s/ get confused. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![hansioux](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/hansioux/32/253648_2.png) [@hansioux](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/hansioux)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 7:25am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/3 "2018-01-26T07:25:57Z")
> [@yyy](#): > > Nigeria is (in one spelling) 尼日利亞 There’s definitely a /dz/ → /ʐ/ thing going on in 日’s case. I think 尼日利亞 is obviously the older transcription, and it probably came from Holo or Cantonese, as Nî-jit-lī-à in Taigi, with j representing /dz/, definitely come closer to the original pronunciation of Nigeria. In Taiwan, that transcription has since been replaced by 奈及利亞, which is obviously a Mandarin transcription. ---
**Author:** ![tempogain](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/tempogain/32/264650_2.png) [@tempogain](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/tempogain)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 7:39am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/4 "2018-01-26T07:39:35Z")
> [@hansioux](#): > > For years and years I wondered why the heck would Switzerland be translated in to Rui-shi (瑞士)… That occurred to me some time back. I tried to explain my theory to a local gentleman in a bar once and he refuted it quite strongly, lol. Are there other s-/r- characters? ---
**Author:** ![Liam\_Og](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/liam_og/32/146898_2.png) [@Liam\_Og](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/Liam_Og)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 7:50am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/5 "2018-01-26T07:50:06Z")
The other explanation is that the pronunciations are Mandarin pronunciations. One of the earlier interactions that involved Chinese drawing atlases of the world involved Portugueese Italians and Mandarin speakers. Mandarin pronounciations have shifted since then, and its haphazard depending on the speaker reporting the name and the ear of the person writing it down. > **[Kunyu Wanguo Quantu](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunyu_Wanguo_Quantu)** > > Kunyu Wanguo Quantu, printed in Ming China at the request of the Wanli Emperor in 1602 by the Italian Catholic missionary Matteo Ricci and Chinese collaborators, the mandarin Zhong Wentao, and the technical translator Li Zhizao, is the earliest known Chinese world map with the style of European maps. It has been referred to as the Impossible Black Tulip of Cartography, "because of its rarity, importance and exoticism". The map was crucial in expanding Chinese knowledge of the world. It was The 1... ---
**Author:** ![Liam\_Og](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/liam_og/32/146898_2.png) [@Liam\_Og](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/Liam_Og)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 7:58am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/6 "2018-01-26T07:58:08Z")
I have often wondered where the word for greece comes from, xila? 希腊 ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Milker](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/dr_milker/32/181996_2.png) [@Dr\_Milker](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/Dr_Milker)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 8:00am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/7 "2018-01-26T08:00:15Z")
One of my favorite examples of this is 約翰 for John, which doesn’t make sense until you realize it’s a transliteration of Johan. ---
**Author:** ![the\_bear](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/the_bear/32/192391_2.png) [@the\_bear](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/the_bear)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 8:09am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/8 "2018-01-26T08:09:56Z")
> [@Liam\_Og](#): > > 希腊 Transliteration of Hellas, the name for Ancient Greece. ---
**Author:** ![tempogain](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/tempogain/32/264650_2.png) [@tempogain](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/tempogain)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 9:02am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/9 "2018-01-26T09:02:42Z")
That currently makes more sense in Minnan as well. ---
**Author:** ![hansioux](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/hansioux/32/253648_2.png) [@hansioux](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/hansioux)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2018, 7:22am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/10 "2018-01-27T07:22:25Z")
Before I’ve had a couple of classmates named Jesus, I had no idea why that is translated to 耶穌 as well. In Latin, 耶穌 is a even better fit, than how it sounds in Spanish. 穌 has the meaning of revival, so who ever translated Jesus into 耶穌 did a really brilliant job. ---
**Author:** ![mkspkr](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@mkspkr](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/mkspkr)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2018, 8:08am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/11 "2018-01-27T08:08:45Z")
Why is it 加拿大 rather than 咖拿大? ---
**Author:** ![tempogain](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/tempogain/32/264650_2.png) [@tempogain](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/tempogain)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2018, 10:22am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/12 "2018-01-27T10:22:29Z")
Good one: 加 is pronounced as “ga” in Minnan and I’m sure Cantonese as well. 新加坡 is another example. ---
**Author:** ![mkspkr](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@mkspkr](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/mkspkr)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/13 "2018-01-27T14:26:55Z")
Also explains why 金門 and 基隆 are written as “Kinmen” and “Keelung” ---
**Author:** ![Liam\_Og](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/liam_og/32/146898_2.png) [@Liam\_Og](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/Liam_Og)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2018, 3:01pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/14 "2018-01-27T15:01:24Z")
I think there are other threads about this, but anyway, jinmen would have previously been kinmen in mandarin but there was a pronounciation shift much like the great vowel shift in english, but minnan and cantonese did not do the same shift. plus these letter distinctions are blurry and are not chinese anyway. try substituting l for n and see if anyone bats an eyelid. Much as some Shakespeare still rhymes in regional accents but not always in standard British English > **[Listen: how Shakespeare really sounded](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/books/booknews/9143302/How-should-Shakespeare-really-sound.html)** > > Listen: ever wondered how Shakespearean English was pronounced at the time? Audio files from the British Library have the answer ---
**Author:** ![Brianjones](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/eada6e/32.png) [@Brianjones](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/Brianjones)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2018, 4:32pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/15 "2018-01-27T16:32:37Z")
Here you go. > [@Who put the K in 高雄 (Kaohsiung)](http://tw.forumosa.com/t/who-put-the-k-in-kaohsiung/160816/84): > > Agreed regarding the false dichotomy. I don’t share my former teacher’s views. For any language, especially one with as vast a speaking base as Mandarin, I think there can be multiple “standard” accents. I’d imagine that most native Mandarin speakers might find a general Northern accent (not necessarily a strong Beijing accent) to be the “most standard” and that a general Southern accent (Shanghai metro, Wuhan metro) or a Taipei accent (as opposed to Southern Taiwan) to be generally acceptabl… ---
**Author:** ![hansioux](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/hansioux/32/253648_2.png) [@hansioux](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/hansioux)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 8:05am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/16 "2018-01-31T08:05:07Z")
I have one that I can’t figure out… there’s gotta be a reason… Why is Russia translated to 俄羅斯? For Russia, just the characters 羅斯 seem to do the job. 俄 seems completely random and unnecessary. If they want to make it 3 characters, 羅斯亞 would do. Or go back the earlier forms such as 羅剎 seems to do the job perfectly. Maybe someone who speaks Russian could help. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Milker](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/dr_milker/32/181996_2.png) [@Dr\_Milker](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/Dr_Milker)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 8:12am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/17 "2018-01-31T08:12:08Z")
> [@hansioux](#): > > Why is Russia translated to 俄羅斯? It’s derived from the Middle Mongolian term for Russia: _Orus_. ---
**Author:** ![tando](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/t/6f9a4e/32.png) [@tando](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/tando)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 8:32am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/18 "2018-01-31T08:32:31Z")
> [@hansioux](#): > > Why is Russia translated to 俄羅斯? This report might answer. 《俄羅斯國家名稱變遷考》，郭文深著，江淮論壇2010年3期 [http://www.jhlt.net.cn/CN/article/downloadArticleFile.do?attachType=PDF&id=8370](http://www.jhlt.net.cn/CN/article/downloadArticleFile.do?attachType=PDF&id=8370) ---
**Author:** ![hansioux](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/hansioux/32/253648_2.png) [@hansioux](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/hansioux)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 8:58am UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/19 "2018-01-31T08:58:05Z")
Nice way to remind the Russians of their past I guess… Even though it’s nice to know that 俄羅斯 came from the Mongolian term Orus, it still doesn’t explain why the Mongolians added the O. The answer given in the article is that there is no Mongolian word that started with R, so when dealing with those loan words, Mongolians added an O to make it conform to their phonology. ---
**Author:** ![OrangeOrganics](https://forumosa-12829.kxcdn.com/user_avatar/tw.forumosa.com/orangeorganics/32/206888_2.png) [@OrangeOrganics](https://tw.forumosa.com/u/OrangeOrganics)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 2:53pm UTC](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779/20 "2018-01-31T14:53:25Z")
匈牙利 ， although don’t know what could be done better [Next page](https://tw.forumosa.com/t/chinese-translations-that-seem-to-make-no-sense-but-actually-do/166779.md?page=2)