"Christians" cancel prayer breakfast with Tsai

I believe free will is a test. Like in a relationship, if your significant other does not have free will, how do you know they really love you? Are they with you out of love or because they don’t have a choice?

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This is waaay out of topic but I like it lol

I actually feel like some ppl r in love because they don’t have a better choice.
I had this boyfriend who would always criticize me.
And I’d always encouraged him to just beak up so he no longer needed to suffer from a not so satisfying girlfriend :joy:
So yeah I think some ppl try really hard to convince themselves that they’re in love just because they don’t think they can do better

Another question is
According to the Bible, if you do something bad you r sent to the bad place
Well, but if you get punished when you make the wrong move, do you really have free will?
If I was held at gun point, and the villain asks me to finish his stinky tofu in his stead, I wouldn’t really feel “free” to say no

But doesn’t Got pardon you if you remorse?

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Waaaaiiiit a second
So I could be a villain and still go to a good place if I remorse?
So if I truly remorse it’s canceled?
No community service at all?
Sounds like a good bargain lol

What about all those 信我者得永生 stickers I see on the road
It says if you believe in got you live forever
But I think it actually means as long as you convert to Christianity, or perhaps be a Christian from the beginning, you can go to heaven
Is this a common belief among Christians?

You have free will. But your choice determines your result. Some choices have consequences. Some choices have rewards.

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That’s what I mean
It’s not free
Is manipulated by god’s morals
What if I believed in Satan but I only do good stuff?
(Cuz I’m evil and I’d like to screw with them lol)
Do I go to hell just because I worship a devil?

First, what is hell? If we define it as complete separation from God, then why wouldn’t you want to go there if you don’t want to have anything to do with God?

Let’s look at an analogy. You have a husband but another man comes to woo you. You make your choice to dump your husband and be with the other man. Would you still want to live with your husband while being in an intimate relationship with another man? Wouldn’t your husband just divorce you and ask you to leave the house?

Good point
I thought in the Bible ppl burn in hell and suffer from enternal torment
But if I could just join the devil and eat souls then why not?
So my question is, how is the Christian hell described in the Bible?

Because in many cultures the ruler of hell or underworld is not a diabolical evil being but a symbol of fair, just, and mercy
Although the underworld do practice chastise (or torture sometimes…)
This is not the only thing they do
The underworld is also a place for a soul to rest before they go on another journey
You can see that in Tao and Buddhism
For as far as I know also Ancient Greek and ancient Egypt
In those cultures the underworld is as sacred as the heaven

But somehow in every Christian movie I’ve seen the hell is depicted as a torture room where the demons really enjoys the scream

So I just assume a soul would only receive punishment down there
It’d be much freeer if ppl could just join the devil :joy:

Well, I’ve never been to hell, so I couldn’t tell you from experience.

But if God is the essence of what holds our universe together and maintaining the cosmic order of things, imagine what separation from that would be like. It could be like your atoms being ripped apart and put back together infinitely. And if you’ve ever felt the searing pain from a torn ligament or tendon at the moment it is being torn, then imagine that pain except not just localized in one area of your body, but everywhere at once, infinitely.

That is hell.

Christians define it is the God. Non Christians who define it as other thing(s) go to the same place with Christians or is it different?

My issue is Christians hating someone for their sexual orientation and other “vices”, when God himself doesn’t generally hate people the way many Christians hate.

If using the ten commandment as a reference, it doesn’t say anything about being gay or whatnot. It says thou shall not commit adultery. So to me it seems if you are in a committed same sex relationship, what sin is being committed here? The ten commandment is more about respecting both God and your neighbors.

You’re not allowed to covet your neighbor’s ass. It think that’s a pretty clear commandment.

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Fundamental misunderstanding. Old Testament and New Testament very different.

Christians should be reading and searching for meaning in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Then follow up with the later books of the New Testament with some understanding of the history of the books.

The New Testament is a new promise from God, brought to us through Christ. Instead of punishing sinners (as in the Old Testament stories) God came to us in the form of a man (Christ) to offer forgiveness and mercy to all those who will accept God’s message of love.

It can be mysterious and confusing to read, but there is a profound message to be found there, whether or not you call yourself religious or believe in God.

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problem is too many Christians, especially fundamentalist Christians, dwell on the old testament. I guess human nature likes punishing people.

Old testament is the foundation of the new testament, and the new testament is the fulfillment of promises told in the old testament. Both are important but we are not under the old convenient. In fact if you are not Jewish or the children of Abraham, the old testament doesn’t even apply to you as God only made the covenant with the children of Abraham.

And according to the new testament, we have no authority to judge anyone’s sins.

It’s mainly the Presbyterian church that’s throwing tantrums over Tsai’s support for marriage equality.

It 's very weird because Taiwan’s Presbyterian church was founded by Canadian missionaries such as MacKay. The attitude of the Canadian Presbyterian church at the moment is pretty open on the subject.

https://presbyterian.ca/sexuality/

It would seem like Taiwan’s Presbyterian church is hijacked by the American church.

Many of America’s churches are pretty open on the subject too, it’s the Southern Baptists, Baptists, etc. that are firmly against this.

The reason is Taiwanese, like many Asians, are deeply religious. While Taiwanese are probably not as religious compared to say Thailand or India, compared to Americans they’re still deeply religious. So Taiwanese who goes to church tends to be the fundamentalist type. If you compare conservatives in India with conservatives in the US the American conservatives are screaming liberals compared to India. That’s how religious they are.

Meaning those people are already deeply homophobic.

There are Presbyterian churches in Taiwan who are welcoming to gays.

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It seems to me that it breaks God’s first command to humans: “be fruitful and multiply”. It’s not possible to procreate with the same sex is it?

“be fruitful and multiply” is not the wisest commandment to follow, considering overpopulation or traditional Christian couples having far more kids than they can financially support. Same sex couples can adopt kids.

you’re going off tangent again

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cannot procreate is a sin, or dont procreate intentionally is a sin?

Priests and nuns are breaking God’s first command to humans?

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