"(Bob Barr, R. Ga.) the former Clinton impeachment manager is the skunk at CPAC’s party this year. He says President Bush is breaking the law by eavesdropping on U.S. citizens without warrants. And fellow conservatives, for the most part, don’t want to hear it. . . .
“Are we losing our lodestar, which is the Bill of Rights?” Barr beseeched the several hundred conservatives at the Omni Shoreham in Woodley Park. “Are we in danger of putting allegiance to party ahead of allegiance to principle?” . . .
But nobody said anything in the deathly quiet audience. Barr merited only polite applause when he finished, and one man, Richard Sorcinelli, booed him loudly. “I can’t believe I’m in a conservative hall listening to him say [Bush] is off course trying to defend the United States,” Sorcinelli fumed.
Far more to this crowd’s liking was Vice President Cheney, who stopped by CPAC late Thursday and suggested the surveillance program as a 2006 campaign issue. “With an important election coming up, people need to know just how we view the most critical questions of national security,” he told the cheering crowd."
As Bob Barr’s experience shows, traditional conservatives are an endangered species as a “new” conservatism has swept the Republican Party, fundamentally transforming it almost overnight. Many “new” conservatives are apparently unwilling to admit that they’ve changed rather than the other way around but the evidence seems clear that they represent a new breed with fundamentally different values than those of traditional conservativism.
So how do you know if you’re a neoconservative and not a Bob Barr, traditional conservative? There are several fairly iron-clad indicators:
You know you’re a neoconservative if you’re personally offended by the word “neoconservative.”
You know you’re a neoconservative if you believe the U.S. Constitution, as currently written, has probably outlived its usefulness
You know you’re a neoconservative if you wouldn’t mind if the government tapped your phone
If you believe Christopher Hitchens is the closest thing there is to a post-911 American Thomas Jefferson and Colin Powell the closest thing to a Benedict Arnold, you’re a neoconservative
If you finally understand why liberals weren’t concerned about running up huge deficits and bankrupting the country, you’re a neoconservative.
If you believe that, as a member of the faithful, you’re personally too valuable to sacrifice in the war on terror with so much cannon fodder yet available, you’re a neoconservative.
If you’ve completed a first draft of “The Protocols of the Elders of Islam” in your head and are just waiting for the free time to put it down on paper, you’re a neoconservative.
If you believe the American people are so hopelessly far behind in really “getting it” that they have to be misled regularly or there’s no hope of getting anything done, you’re a neoconservative.
If you’ve almost completely lost your sense of humor and are sick and tired of being the butt of jokes, you’re probably a neoconservative.
Original title of article is…[quote]
Bob Barr, Bane of the Right?
By Dana Milbank
Saturday, February 11, 2006; Page A02
You could find just about everything at the annual Conservative Political Action Conference this week: the bumper sticker that says “Happiness is Hillary’s face on a milk carton,” the “Straight Pride” T-shirt, a ride on an F-22 Raptor simulator at the Lockheed exhibit, and beans from the Contra Cafe coffee company (slogan: “Wake up with freedom fighters”).
As of midday yesterday, a silent auction netted $300 for lunch with activist Grover Norquist, $275 for a meal with the Heritage Foundation president and $1,000 for a hunting trip with the American Conservative Union chairman. But lunch with former congressman Bob Barr (R-Ga.), with an “estimated value” of $500, had a top bid of only $75 – even with a signed copy of Barr’s book, “The Meaning of Is,” thrown in." washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co … tml?sub=AR[/quote]
and strangely enough…the 9 talking points posted by spook are no where to be found in the article…
Interesting article which illustrates the diversity of thought prevalent at CPAC this year.
How to tell if you’re a neoconservative and not a conservative, Part II:
You know you’re a neoconservative if you’re personally offended by the word “neoconservative.”
You know you’re a neoconservative if you believe the U.S. Constitution, as currently written, has probably outlived its usefulness.
You know you’re a neoconservative if you wouldn’t mind if the government tapped your phone.
If you believe Christopher Hitchens is the closest thing there is to a post-911 American Thomas Jefferson and Colin Powell the closest thing to a Benedict Arnold, you’re a neoconservative.
If you finally understand why liberals weren’t concerned about running up huge deficits and bankrupting the country, you’re a neoconservative.
If you believe that, as a member of the faithful, you’re personally too valuable to sacrifice in the war on terror with so much cannon fodder still available, you’re a neoconservative.
If you’ve completed a first draft of “The Protocols of the Elders of Islam” in your head and are just waiting for the free time to put it down on paper, you’re a neoconservative.
If you believe the American people are so hopelessly far from really “getting it” that they have to be misled regularly or there’s no hope of getting anything done, you’re a neoconservative.
[color=red]9) If you were shocked that peace and tranquility didn’t break out in the Middle East almost immediately after Saddam Hussein was captured, you’re a neoconservative.
If you blamed the news media for the “anomaly” in #9 because you couldn’t think of anyone or anything else to blame, you’re a neoconservative.[/color]
If you’ve almost completely lost your sense of humor and are sick and tired of being the butt of jokes, you’re probably a neoconservative.
Update, [color=red]12[/color] ways to tell if you’re a neoconservative rather than a conservative:
You know you’re a neoconservative if you’re personally offended by the word “neoconservative.”
You know you’re a neoconservative if you believe the U.S. Constitution, as currently written, has probably outlived its usefulness.
You know you’re a neoconservative if you wouldn’t mind if the government tapped your phone.
If you believe Christopher Hitchens is the closest thing there is to a post-911 American Thomas Jefferson and Colin Powell the closest thing to a Benedict Arnold, you’re a neoconservative.
If you finally understand why liberals weren’t concerned about running up huge deficits and bankrupting the country, you’re a neoconservative.
If you believe that, as a member of the faithful, you’re personally too valuable to sacrifice in the war on terror with so much cannon fodder still available, you’re a neoconservative.
If you’ve completed a first draft of “The Protocols of the Elders of Islam” in your head and are just waiting for the free time to put it down on paper, you’re a neoconservative.
If you believe the American people are so hopelessly far from really “getting it” that they have to be misled regularly or there’s no hope of getting anything done, you’re a neoconservative.
If you were surprised that peace and tranquility didn’t break out in the Middle East almost immediately after Saddam Hussein was captured, you’re a neoconservative.
If you blamed the news media for the “anomaly” in #9 because you couldn’t think of anyone or anything else to blame, you’re a neoconservative.
If you’re convinced that the ultimate solution to the problems in the Middle East is to invade and occupy more countries and then declare them sovereign and independent without any intention of ever leaving, then you’re a neoconservative.
If you’ve almost completely lost your sense of humor and are sick and tired of being the butt of jokes, you’re probably a neoconservative.
It’s amusing when leftists call men like Donald Rumsfeld and Dick Cheney “neo-conservatives”. They’re traditional conservatives and always have been. There’s a liberal myth out there now that conservatives, in the past, were all isolationist libertarians who would never tolerate the kind of aggressive foreign policy and domestic spying now propogated by the Bush Administration. Anybody remotely familiar with the foreign policy of the US of the past 60 years and the mountain of domestic surveillance accumulated during the Cold War knows that notion is a bunch of nonsense. “Neo-conservative” is just a term used by leftists to portray the Bush Administration and anyone who agrees with them as outlandish and extremist.
[quote=“gao_bo_han”]“Neo-conservative” is just a term used by leftists to portray the Bush Administration and anyone who agrees with them as outlandish and extremist."[/quote]gao_bo_han -
That is the most accurate definition I’ve seen so far. :bravo:
Everytime one sees this term being used a flag goes up. Its a trite little tool used to prejudice the standards for the discussion.
[quote=“TainanCowboy”]That is the most accurate definition I’ve seen so far. :bravo:
Everytime one sees this term being used a flag goes up. Its a trite little tool used to prejudice the standards for the discussion.[/quote]
I think you’re half right. It is a used to prejudice the discussion, but there are serious cleavages between traditional and new conservative movements, so assuming you accept that premise (do you?), what’s a better, fairer label to hang on the movement?
[quote=“TainanCowboy”][quote=“gao_bo_han”]“Neo-conservative” is just a term used by leftists to portray the Bush Administration and anyone who agrees with them as outlandish and extremist."[/quote]gao_bo_han -
That is the most accurate definition I’ve seen so far. :bravo:
Everytime one sees this term being used a flag goes up. Its a trite little tool used to prejudice the standards for the discussion.[/quote]
It’s also often used by those who think JFK walked on water but know nothing of either his domestic or foreign policies.
[quote=“Comrade Stalin”][quote=“TainanCowboy”][quote=“gao_bo_han”]“Neo-conservative” is just a term used by leftists to portray the Bush Administration and anyone who agrees with them as outlandish and extremist."[/quote]gao_bo_han -
That is the most accurate definition I’ve seen so far. :bravo:
Everytime one sees this term being used a flag goes up. Its a trite little tool used to prejudice the standards for the discussion.[/quote]
It’s also often used by those who think JFK walked on water but know nothing of either his domestic or foreign policies.[/quote]
Tax cuts, “Flexible Response”, a love of counterinsurgency operations — he was a Neo : :bravo:
[quote=“Chewycorns”][quote=“Comrade Stalin”][quote=“TainanCowboy”][quote=“gao_bo_han”]“Neo-conservative” is just a term used by leftists to portray the Bush Administration and anyone who agrees with them as outlandish and extremist."[/quote]gao_bo_han -
That is the most accurate definition I’ve seen so far. :bravo:
Everytime one sees this term being used a flag goes up. Its a trite little tool used to prejudice the standards for the discussion.[/quote]
It’s also often used by those who think JFK walked on water but know nothing of either his domestic or foreign policies.[/quote]
Tax cuts, “Flexible Response”, a love of counterinsurgency operations — he was a Neo : :bravo:[/quote]
That rather expansive three-part test would have made George Washington a neoconservative, too. I find it hard to believe that man who said the following would have made a very good neoconservative though:
“Excessive partiality for one foreign nation and excessive dislike of another cause those whom they actuate to see danger only on one side, and serve to veil and even second the arts of influence on the other. Real patriots who may resist the intrigues of the favorite are liable to become suspected and odious, while its tools and dupes usurp the applause and confidence of the people, to surrender their interests.”
[quote=“Jaboney”][quote=“TainanCowboy”]That is the most accurate definition I’ve seen so far. :bravo:
Everytime one sees this term being used a flag goes up. Its a trite little tool used to prejudice the standards for the discussion.[/quote]
I think you’re half right. It is a used to prejudice the discussion, but there are serious cleavages between traditional and new conservative movements, so assuming you accept that premise (do you?), what’s a better, fairer label to hang on the movement?[/quote]
I don’t completely accept that premise. I think the core beliefs of the conservative movement have remained basically consistent since the beginning of the Cold War. There have always been disagreements among conservatives regarding specific military interventions, but the fundamental belief in American global supremacy has been part and parcel of conservative thinking for the past sixty years. The days of mainstream isolationism are long past. Leftists take joy in positing the Iraq War as a break from the conservative norm, because by doing so they cast the Bush Administration in a dark and sinister light. But the truth is that post-WWII conservatives have always been dedicated to military supremacy, and have supported military engagements across the globe. The only reason we aren’t under Soviet domination today is because of the conservative commitment to military supremacy. The liberal suggestion that the Iraq War contradicts traditional conservative mentality, thereby making Bush and his supporters “neo”-conservatives, is historically ignorant.
