Coronavirus Vaccine Discussion

The most draconian social distancing measures followed by universal vaccination was a done deal from the moment politicians accepted they had no idea how to control the virus. Anyone with any other perspective could be written off as a crazy anti-vaxxer.

1 Like

This I agree is possible if not likely in places like the Philippines and Indonesia. But it will precisely be due to the difficulty of vaccine rollout in those places, not due to ā€œuniversal vaccinationā€ as you put it.

Sorry, your thinking continues to mystify. :grin:

Guy

It is very worrying.

IMO itā€™ll be the ā€œfirst worldā€ - those countries where people live in fear of death depriving them of the next episode of Game of Thrones. Nobody in the Philippines gives a ratā€™s ass about COVID-19. They go through the motions, but 90% of them are just rolling their eyes and want it to be over - not least because the number of official deaths currently stands at a fearsome 0.01% of the population.

In any case the Philippines will become PRC property before the decade is out, IMO, and the CCP will make sure everyone gets a dose of Sinovac.

I agree this outcome would not be awesome. :grin:

Guy

Would that lead to believe that young, thin, in shape muscular Taiwanese guys are prone to heart failures? And that an overweight, exercise fobia, video games addict lives longer?

Or you could think that we do not know everything about heart conditions. We are just now realizing and publicizing that men and women have different symptoms regarding heart attacks for example.

If a vaccine has the usual ingredients -which have been published- then it can be studied if there is a certain propensity/match with the people who have suffered the reaction of clots, if there is any. But first, it must be established if the clots were caused by an existing condition, then you can examine if there was some particular reaction to this specific vaccine.

Maybe, like the virus itself, there is some genetic propensity towards such seriousness.

But to stop vaccination in all instances does not seem logical to me, first of all because no testing has shown the vaccine as defective to that extend. There is no reason to think itā€™s components are deadly after previous usage.

1 Like

You talk a lot but no facts . You must be Trump

By the way Trumps real last name is Trumpet
Wonder why

It isnā€™t really but it sounds good

Itā€™s going to be very sad indeed. I still donā€™t think this virus was deliberately engineered by China, but they know how to exploit a good opportunity when they see one; theyā€™d be stupid not to. The entire planet has voluntarily dropped to its knees, and China be like:

image

Venezuela got Sputnik V, not Sinovac. Even they know China cannot be trusted.

Ask which countries are getting Sinovacā€¦then see what vaccine the elites are getting for themselves.

I donā€™t want to stop vaccination of everyone now that itā€™s started. I want it done.

1 Like

No scientist here and possibly just spouting nonsense but all these vaccines except for the Chinese one Iā€™m told are RDNA ones that is they make you create some corona virus attributes essentially creating cells that mimic the virus so your body can learn to fight it

Developers design the vaccine by using particular DNA of the virus and not others

Hence the concern that the vaccines may not protect against variants

The astra Zeneca vaccine uses almost the whole of the virus minus less DNA then others and may carry the dna portion that causes blood clots in some people

One of the main problems for many in getting the virus was blood clots

So I wonder if this is so that the rdna of this vaccine causes our cells to mimic too much of the real virus

Germans are not taking up this vaccine and itā€™s been stopped in Europe while they find out whatā€™s up

Designed by Oxford university

If anybody wants to give up their AstraZeneca shot, can I have it?

1 Like

Actually, it is the other way around: rnas use a part, Chinese allegedly use all the inactive virus.

However, there is no data on Chinese extent of vaccination, side effects, delivery, as usual. So we cannot effectively compare.

Moreover, China started its own rna vaccine production facilities in December.

Again, whatever is going on in Europe, the wise thing is to go the opposite direction.

And the general anti vaccination feeling in the West is politically charged.

This biologist i talked to recently says heā€™s not sayin you or I should or should not get the vaccine but he had a few concerns

  1. These vaccines are previously untried in the masses because they are RDNA and not using dead virus like the Chinese one

So the Chinese one is more traditional

  1. He has a problem with the inability to stop any complications from the vaccine should there be any

  2. He feels the virus danger has been blown up 100 times than actual

That said I guess I would take the jab
When itā€™s my turn

Many countries are said to be thinking of banning any entry to people who are unvaccinated

Actually rna has been on the works for several years. Otherwise they could not get the stuff ready so fast.

There has always been difficult to control allergic reactions, otherwise asthma and anaphylactic shock would be a thing of the past.

That he says the danger is overstated places him in a certain category IMHO. The fact is that the longer this is out there, the greater the chance for it to have all kinds of variations. And that so over quoted 1% death is, on one hand, still too high for me, and on the other, inaccurate.

Imagine if they had said the same of polio.

1 Like

I donā€™t think this is a fair comparison, Icon. Polio is a dreadful disease, on all sorts of measures (and in any case vaccination is just one tool, not the primary means of stopping it). COVID-19 is qualitatively different. You might also want to google ā€œcirculating vaccine-derived poliovirusā€. Polio vaccination has been extremely successful, but vaccinations are never a no-brainer.

:eyes:

This sounds like a course or a how to me. :joy:

Polio live attenuated vaccine is probably the poster child for disease induced vaccination . It was a necessary evil , wiping out polio transmission but still causing very rare infections for a few unfortunates.

1 Like

I donā€™t disagree. Nevertheless, I was pointing out that things are never as straightforward as they seem. Nature always fights back. Vaccine-derived poliovirus thrives in certain places not because people are ā€œunfortunateā€, but because the conditions in which it thrives have not been eliminated. Or even addressed.

Itā€™s a bit like clearing out the cockroaches from a slum, but leaving the slum intact. Vermin come back because slums are the perfect habitat for vermin.

The polio vaccine is (broadly) a Good Thing, but it also permits dictatorships to carry on doing what they do best by muting the human cost of their actions.

Whatever goes wrong with the COVID-19 vaccine, I suspect itā€™ll come from way out in left field. People will be like, damn, we never expected that. Hereā€™s Finleyā€™s third law: the cleverer the technology, the weirder the side-effects.

Go to Germany low take up rate there
Soon as they are allowed to administer it again

They said it may be a bad batch but others say no the labs that make them are highly advanced

Something may be off with the vaccine itself ?
Because of the high relation to the real thing perhaps ?