When I started working in US many years ago, during lunch hours we would get together with other Taiwanese in the same table in company cafeteria talking in Chinese of course. Vietnamese would sit on one table. Koreans in another. This situation has caused some strange reaction from our American colleages. The usual resentment and their reasoning is that once in US, you should learn the culture and converse in English specially when other mono-lingual English speaking Americans are present.
In recent years, there are a lot more other folks from different cultures have arrived, and these type of complaints are not often heard anymore. Our company IT department is now composed of hundreds of programmers from India.
Many of you are now bi-lingual. Do you still resent the fact that other folks speaking their own language in front of you like my American colleagues did? Do you talk to other English speaking people in English in Taiwan work place, while other folks present? Did you ever hear complaints from others that you use English around them seemingly not respect their presense?
English is the official language of my company, so I speak English all the time. But I speak Japanese too, sometimes Chinese, sometimes French or German… Depends on whom I am speaking with: we have a lot of nationalities here.
New assistant from Poland. Fortunately she speaks five languages fluently (including English and Chinese), so I won’t have to learn Polish as well.
Why would you expect people to have to speak a English just to pay homage to some Americans. The USA is a country full of foreign languages and it’s not rude for someone to speak in their native language amongst their friends at lunch time.
Do I “still” resent that others are able to communicate in various languages? I didn’t resent that to begin with. When I was young, I was fascinated by the variety of languages in the USA. It’s one reason why I liked learning languages (and “still” do). And I “still” don’t understand why people in majority cultures want to oppress minority cultures. Diversity makes people and cultures stronger.
In my workplace, we use English. I will use English with everyone because it’s an English department which is meant to motivate and encourage others to use English as a tool of communication. I encourage other teachers to use English all the time in order to show students the practical uses of English as communication.
Socially, I mix and switch according to what is most comfortable for everyone in the situation. I’m also one of those people who automatically interpret everything so that no one is left out of the conversation.
Socially, I mix and switch according to what is most comfortable for everyone in the situation. I’m also one of those people who automatically interpret everything so that no one is left out of the conversation.[/quote]
I kind of resent it, it being the fact that some people won’t or can’t interpret things for me at certain times.
It’s more my frustration at my own language ability and lack of any bi-lingual teachers or schools within a reasonable distance.
I try to instill in my kids that let’s say out in a group, they should try to be polite and inclusive and speak the language that everyone understands or at least take the time to interpret. … everyone meaning … that odd foreigner who is not bilingual.
Sitting at a lunch table with your close friend… that’s your business what language they speak. It’s being part of the group not being inclusive especially when all the members have the ability to be bilingual sometimes gets my goat. Of course, that will change when and if I get to a competent language level.
It used to annoy me when people spoke Taiwanese to each other. I know it is natural as it is their first language, but yes it was very annoying especially in business meetings!
It’s quite normal to have business meetings where people speak Taiwanese. I was with Llary the other day with Cyborg Ninja planning some new adventures and Llary was quite happy to have his friends speak to me in Taiwanese even though he doesn’t speak it so well himself
It’s maybe not a big deal if you are not the one left out. If you are the one left out of the conversation, and everyone involved does share another common language of fluency that you also speak, it is potentially different. That’s rudeness at worst, or simply them not paying attention at best (it does happen). But if you politely comment that you do not speak Taiwanese, and everyone involved speaks English or Mandarin including you, from a Western perspective there is no reason why they should not switch assuming that they are in a business environment where you belong as well. They shouldn’t be having non-business-related conversations during work hours anyway, unless it’s lunchtime or a break.
From a Chinese/Taiwanese perspective – why would anyone care?
Just speak English to everybody, when they look at you with that blank look in the face, then try something else. I will assume them to be educated until they prove otherwise, unless I am getting into a taxi in Taiwan.
Or you could speak the local language. I don’t go to an American business meeting and start speaking Taiwanese or Bahasa now do I.[/quote]
Just wondering if I can get some advice from a real mover and shaker here: When you go to your American business meetings, what do you wear? Surely not your skateboard/paintball gear?
Also, being so upwardly mobile, who writes your portfolios? It’s obviously not the same PA that you have posting here at your behest.
It’s quite normal to have business meetings where people speak Taiwanese. I was with Llary the other day with Cyborg Ninja planning some new adventures and Llary was quite happy to have his friends speak to me in Taiwanese even though he doesn’t speak it so well himself
No big deal really.[/quote]
In a business meeting it can be a big deal! As I said I know why it happens but it is still annoying!
Taiwanese use it to create a shared bond and joke around during negotiations during the meetings, let off steam, but it shows they dont fully value the participation of the non Taiwanese speakers…to the people who don’t speak Taiwanese. They will use rough forms of Taiwanese and colloquialisms, it’s breaks down their barriers but creates barriers to others.
Not a big deal in general, happens all over the world, but not cool in a business meeting in my book.
I must also say that sometimes I enjoy being left out of the conversation. Although I am not a business person, I do have to attend meetings that are not in my native language. Sometimes it’s nice to get to pick and choose what I understand, what I listen to, and what matters require a response. In English, I’m outspoken and I admit that sometimes I talk too much. In Chinese, I’m quiet and have an air of sophisticated mystery.
Living in multi-cultural, multi-lingual society is fun. It motivates me to learn and expand my ideas. I hope I never get to a point in life where I’m not learning new things!
I mostly speak Mandarin with my Taiwanese co-workers, but as a native speaker of English, I speak English with my native-English-speaking co-workers.
Why anyone would feel resentment at people speaking another language is beyond me. Language is a means of communication, and people generally default to the most effective way of communicating their ideas given the situation.
I remember taking to someone in the US who complained about foreigners walking around speaking their languages. He said “When you go to another country, you should learn their language. I lived in Germany and dagnabbit I learned me some German. But when they come here, they babble in their own language to each other. When they come to America, they should speak English, galsh durnit.” I told him I agreed it’s wise to learn the language of the places you go. But I asked him if he spoke German or English with his fellow Americans when in Germany. He hemmed and hawed. Hopefully he gained some insight into the issue.
It’s like when someone decides for some reason to speak to me in Taiwanese (as if, somehow, big-nosed, white-skinned me would be expected to understand)… I know I can summarily ignore it.
[quote=“Chris”]
Why anyone would feel resentment at people speaking another language is beyond me. Language is a means of communication, and people generally default to the most effective way of communicating their ideas given the situation.[/quote]
Right. So if there is a group of six people, and only five of them understand Mandarin or Taiwanese, yet the group speaks Mandarin or Taiwanese, that isn’t the most effective way of communicating their ideas, assuming that all six of those people is supposed to be in that group for whatever reason.
Again, people who are talking to each other, with no obligation or intention of talking to someone who doesn’t speak their language, can certainly use any language they wish. But when the choice of a language leaves people out who are supposed to be included, that’s when the problems start.
[quote=“ironlady”][quote=“Chris”]
Why anyone would feel resentment at people speaking another language is beyond me. Language is a means of communication, and people generally default to the most effective way of communicating their ideas given the situation.[/quote]
Right. So if there is a group of six people, and only five of them understand Mandarin or Taiwanese, yet the group speaks Mandarin or Taiwanese, that isn’t the most effective way of communicating their ideas, assuming that all six of those people is supposed to be in that group for whatever reason.[/quote]
Well, that’s a different situation. I was talking about, say, five or six Japanese tourists walking along the street in Des Moines, Iowa, talking amongst themselves, and some random American onlooker, completely unconnected to the situation other than overhearing their foreign chatter, says “Why cain’t them galdurn furriners larn t’speak English? This here’s Amurrica.”
But in the situation you describe, you’re absolutely right. It’s like when I went on a tour not long ago in Changhua County, and the local guide said “Do you all speak Taiwanese?” And I said “No”, but she spoke Taiwanese anyway, even though everyone present understood Mandarin.
