Well yes, if you drink lots of liquids with water in them then you don’t need to supplement with pure water. 
But I for example have one or two cups of coffee and consume no soft drinks (shudder) or fruit juice. If I don’t drink at least a water a day and much more when exercising then I will get dehydrated.
[quote=“Chris”]The body has a built-in warning mechanism that has evolved over millions of years, which tells you when your body needs water.
It’s called “thirst”.[/quote]
Sorry, have to completely disagree. If you let your body get to the point of thirst, you are already dehydrated. Thirsty does not mean “drink water,” it means “You haven’t been drinking water, idiot.” Similar with the stomach grumbling-by then, your body is already eating away at the protein in your muscles, which is not good.
The rule I always heard was eight 8oz glasses per day as a minimum. Add an 8 oz glass for every coffee or alcoholic beverage, as these are diuretic. (And the water in your coffee/tea doesn’t count-your body processes that differently, Mr. Jimmy)
Also, peeing a lot from drinking more water is (sort of) a myth. When you pee, you are not peeing out what you just drank. Your body is pushing out the older water and replacing with the new. When you finally start drinking enough water, your body will begin purging out the old-so for a while, you will pee more. After some time of drinking enough (usually a week or two), your body will only pee out the amount you put in.
More water also allows your kidneys to function properly and gives the liver a break, increasing metabolism and fat loss-which is why every single exercise book/program insists that water is key. When I am going through heavy training periods, I drink at least 2 gallons per day. Otherwise, I usually keep it at about a gallon.
I don’t buy your explanation, I think this whole drink 8 bottles a day was pushed by health fads in the US and companies selling bottled water. I’ve studied biology and evolutionary wise I don’t see where this vast excess of water is neccessary. Do we see dogs and cats and monkeys drinking gallons of water a day…of course not! We are mammals just like them, why the hell do we need so much water? Some mammals hardly ever drink liquid water, getting their water from the leaves and fruit they eat.
The amount of water each of us needs to drink must vary enormously according to how much we sweat, how big we are, what we eat and how hot it is. There’s no way anybody needs 8 oz glass of water for every tea and coffee. Water will get processed the same whatever way you imbibe it. Also, the amount you pee is of course related to the amount you drink minus the amount you sweat. Drink more, pee more unless sweating!
It’s also well known that people who have died from MDMA abuse usually die from drinking too much water, their kidneys fails, not other reasons. Drinking a lot of water to excess will stress your kidneys for sure…we are not camels after all!
Like a lot of old tales there is some truth to warm water being better than cold water, at least for me. I found when I started to drink warm water sometimes and cut out too many ice cold drinks I didn’t cough so much. It helps to break down the mucus (I guess) and it doesn’t seem to irritate the throat like cold water. Plus the stomach won’t be so impacted with ice cold water going in. Don’t knock it!
P.S. Interestingly enough warm/hot water tastes pretty good after a while, really.
I drink about a liter of water a day, plus one cup of coffee, a bit of whisky and a beer or two. By Suiyuan’s reckoning, I suppose I should be dead years ago. I’m with headhoncho – a myth put about by faddists and bottled water companies. I bet not even combat troops in Desert Storm were expected to drink 16 fecking pints a day!
Wow! So you’re drinking 16 x 8oz glasses a day normally or 32 glasses a day when you train? Thats 200% to 400% of what is already widely regarded as a dubiously large quantity of water to drink. Sounds pretty dodgy to me.
I never drink bottled water.
[quote]I’ve studied biology and evolutionary wise I don’t see where this vast excess of water is neccessary.Do we see dogs and cats and monkeys drinking gallons of water a day…of course not![/quote]A rather silly argument…all mammals are not created equal. And my dog drinks a lot of water…maybe she learned it from watching me 
[quote]The amount of water each of us needs to drink must vary enormously according to how much we sweat, how big we are, what we eat and how hot it is. [/quote]Agree. I’m active, I need more, no doubt. I wasn’t suggesting everyone drink the amount I do. If you run, swim, and lift weights like I do, then you probably would want to. On the other hand…I have noticed that a lot of Forumosans are rather…umm…husky? (I’ve seen your pics people!) Try drinking eight 8 oz glasses/day for a month and see if you don’t slim down when you give your liver a break from the work of the kidneys.
[quote]Also, the amount you pee is of course related to the amount you drink minus the amount you sweat. Drink more, pee more unless sweating! [/quote]Umm, it’s not that simple. Why do you think some people get water retention problems, edema, etc? Hormones play a role. The kidneys play a role. Even the heart plays a role. It’s not as simple as water in, pee out. Though you will pee more if you are replacing more, sure…but the first few days of drinking what you need (if you are dehydrated) will make you pee more to flush out what your body is holding because it was not getting enough, and will release the old, stagnant shit because there is plenty of fresh water coming in to replace it. Do a google search on water retention-#1 tip is to drink more water. Your body retains because it senses it’s not getting enough. Seems counterintuitive, but our bodies are smarter than we are.
[quote]Drinking a lot of water to excess will stress your kidneys for sure…we are not camels after all![/quote]Again, I agree. I wouldn’t suggest a couch potato drink 2 gallons per day. What I would suggest is a coach potato get off of his/her ass, be more active, and drink more water than soda.
[quote=“sandman”]I drink about a liter of water a day, plus one cup of coffee, a bit of whisky and a beer or two. By Suiyuan’s reckoning, I suppose I should be dead years ago.[/quote]No, if you’re not active, a liter is probably good enough. I never said that amount would kill you…even a small amount from only tea would keep you alive, but that is not the point. I’m thinking of optimal amount, and for me it’s a lot. Instead of theorizing about it, why don’t you guys just give it a try and see if you don’t feel better/look better? I have done a lot of experimenting over the years, and have found that a gallon per day keeps away headaches completely, helps me have more energy, and just generally improves my mood…plus, when I’m on 2 gallons per day, I do pee a lot more…which means I get to touch myself all the time :discodance:
If I don’t drink 2 liters a day, I feel like crap. More if I’m exercising but 2 as a minimum. Have done for as long as I can remember. Then again, other than 2 or 3 black coffees, water is about all I drink. I rarely drink alcohol and only drink coke if I’m in a bar or restaurant.
I try and drink about 2L of water a day. Given that we are bags of mostly water, and that many of us, and some more than others, are exposed to certain high levels of toxicity (some through environment, and some through dietary intake), replenishing our bodily fluids would seem an obvious method of a healthy flush.
Soup is also a good method of replenishing fluids, though not of the high salt packaged variety.
[quote=“TheGingerMan”]
Soup is also a good method of replenishing fluids, though not of the high salt packaged variety.[/quote]
I was trying to convince the students at the local girls high school of an even better way to replenish fluids, but somebody called the police and I had to run away.
Suiyuan, your arguments are pretty weak. It’s obvious if that we are a mammal just like all others and our need for water intake is not exceptionally large. It stands to reason that the animals that need to drink more water are living in hot dry windy environments and are small and active. That’s because they burn more calories using water in the process to cool down and lubricate and probably help with metabolism, the small size would mean that have larger surface area to volume so they would sweat more and be exposed, the high activity means they need to replenish metabolites faster etc. That’s how a logical argument is constructed.
We are living in artificial conditioned environments, we don’t run around hunting animals all day and very few of us do manual work anymore. Plus the amount of water that goes into our body is pretty much exactly the amount of water that will go out, it doesn’t matter about hormones or this or that, that’s all superfluous. Water doesn’t really get broken down in the same way sugars do, it acts as a solvent mainly.
The reason you are in good shape is because you exercise a lot not because you drink lots of water. Of course you need to drink more water if you exercise more but don’t put the cart before the horse!
ajpregu.physiology.org/content/283/5/R993.full
I’m not saying drinking lots of water won’t have some benefits but not to excess. Your whole idea of the liver giving the kidney break blah blah…it’s all hokum. You like to lecture people but your ideas have no scientific basis, just based on your own cultural ideas as much as Chinese and cold water gave you the flu. You also seriously changed your tune from drinking a gallon of water to ‘if you are not active a liter should be good enough’…that’s not very consistent.
[quote=“TheGingerMan”]I try and drink about 2L of water a day. Given that we are bags of mostly water, and that many of us, and some more than others, are exposed to certain high levels of toxicity (some through environment, and some through dietary intake), replenishing our bodily fluids would seem an obvious method of a healthy flush.
Soup is also a good method of replenishing fluids, though not of the high salt packaged variety.[/quote]
Don’t want be a pain in the ass but where’s the evidence for drinking more water helps in washing out toxins? And what toxins?
I mean it seems to make sense but is there any evidence for that?
My guess is just like all our bodily processes there’s a limited amount of metabolites that we process every day and as long as use you drink a certain amount of water you cannot process and push out anymore toxins as your kidney has a limit to it’s daily function.
Our parents and grandparents and our ancestors in the middle ages got by fine with drinking milk, beer, tea etc. I’ve never seen my grandparents drink water only tea and three of them are in their 90s now!
Of course the faddists say coffee and tea don’t count, why do they not count, who said they don’t count, they are 99% water. When I’m thirsty I drink tea, then I don’t feel thirsty anymore! Maybe everybody should drink liters of tea, how about it? Tea has antioxidants and it worked for my family.
Or how about coffee, it helps ‘regulate the bowels’ (indeed that was it’s original claim to fame in Europe), probably gives you a lower incidence of colon cancer.
Evidence? Exactly which website do you think this is? Next thing you’ll be asking for peer-reviewed citations.
Okay a bit of cold hard logic would be nice, instead of some pseudo health fad pronounced as gospel truth.
An excellent article, and should be mandatory reading for all who espouse excess water drinking. Waterboard them if they don’t agree!
I find the whole evolutionary and comparison with other animals ridiculous. What mammals do you want to be compared to? In one breath, you say you are not a camel, and in the next you want to be compared to the very general category of mammals? All mammals need different amounts of water and I find no comparison between them and I’m certainly not going to compare myself to the broad category of mammal to decide how much water I should be drinking.
I don’t see any point in discussing physiology while people are taking a nearly religious evolutionary stance, but if you want studies, here:
edition.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/08/2 … index.html (obviously more about filling the tummy before eating, and something I would actually never do)
Colon Cancer: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8827352
And if you do a search in pubmed, you will find plenty of studies on hydration in relation to vitamin absorption, healthy cellular function, liver fat metabolism, urinary cancer/breast cancer, etc. I’m not going to do all the research for you-it’s there.
Water is not a panacea, and I never claimed it to be such. Everyone should play around with what works best for them based on their activity levels. And MT’s wife is probably a little over the top-water is not going to prevent a cold 100% of the time. But let’s not act as though what we can survive on (maybe a couple of ounces per day) and what our bodies thrive on is the same.
As a side note, I find people’s relationships with scientific studies peculiar. In one breath, you want a study before you act. But after reading this:
drbenkim.com/drink-too-much-water-dangerous.html
I wonder if you would conclude that drinking 2 gallons of water in one sitting is at least a bad idea and potentially dangerous, or would you wait for a study that confirms that a certain percentage of people die from drinking 2 gallons of water at once? There is enough anecdotal evidence for me. I am not going to wait for them to come up with the perfect studies for me to decide that drinking more water has made a very positive impact on how I feel. I have just played around with it too much since I was in my teens-not enough water, headaches and allergies. Keep myself floating, no headaches, no allergies. Scientific studies are great, but why let them decide what you should do when you have the ability to try out different things yourself?
Oh, thanks for the lesson…
But it fell apart on you a bit there. Funny, you kind of make the same type of argument I did. Before bashing me, you might want to have a look at your own posts 
My point at the end was that I could just as easily argue tea is as good as water, from my experience and from it being an antioxidant and that it is boiled so thereby kills harmful bacteria, but obviously life is more complicated than that (tea has caffeine so a lot of the healthy freak crowd are afraid of it, yet tea has been proven to have numerous health benefits). Sure we can all cite studies of this or that, but common sense tells us that since our ancestors didn’t go around drinking gallons of water we don’t need to either. In fact it’s doubtful that many of our ancestors had ready access to large amounts of fresh water (could be wrong of course, but I know water is difficult to carry around and transport, and we can see in Africa even to this day that fresh water is difficult to locate and transport). Probably there are variations in different genetic backgrounds of people, some people need to drink more, some less. Granted our saltier and richer diet might need lead to need for more water, but I have no clue about that part. I’ll agree that it should be better to drink slightly too much water than too little.
[quote=“headhonchoII”]My point at the end was that I could just as easily argue tea is as good as water, from my experience and from it being an antioxidant and that it is boiled so thereby kills harmful bacteria, but obviously life is more complicated than that (tea has caffeine so a lot of the healthy freak crowd are afraid of it, yet tea has been proven to have numerous health benefits). Sure we can all cite studies of this or that, but common sense tells us that since our ancestors didn’t go around drinking gallons of water we don’t need to either. In fact it’s doubtful that many of our ancestors had ready access to large amounts of fresh water (could be wrong of course, but I know water is difficult to carry around and transport, and we can see in Africa even to this day that fresh water is difficult to locate and transport). Probably there are variations in different genetic backgrounds of people, some people need to drink more, some less. Granted our saltier and richer diet might need lead to need for more water, but I have no clue about that part. I’ll agree that it should be better to drink slightly too much water than too little.[/quote]I don’t think we disagree all that much, actually. Often when people argue here, there is not much that separates their viewpoints. I think more water is better than too little. I have noticed more makes me feel better. There are studies that show more water can be better for some things. The studies are inconclusive to a degree, and no one can claim there is absolute data on 8x8 being better for everyone, at all times (an argument I didn’t make). But if someone’s urethra burns when they pee, more water would be the first thing I would think of. If they have headaches every day, it would also be the first thing I would ask them about. I have met plenty of people who drink NO water, thinking that the tea they drink is good enough, for example-I don’t think that is smart for anyone, regardless of other factors, but hey-to each his/her own–when I’m measuring the water I drink, tea doesn’t count for me. All I am suggesting here is that people actually pay attention to the amount they drink first, vary it from week to week, play around with amounts and see what is ideal. I have found what works for me and I measure it out everyday-and at this point it take a few minutes of my day to measure it, drink it, and pee it out. Very much worth it to get rid of what used to be crippling headaches.
Edit: The more I think about it, the less I get this evolutionary argument. So our ancestors and people in Africa don’t drink a lot of water, so we shouldn’t either? What was the life-span of our ancestors? What is the life-span of people in Africa (only following you in generalizing an entire continent)? Infant mortality rates? Rates of heart disease, cancer, etc? I don’t get the logic of doing what our ancestors did when I see the chart on life expectancy by era:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_expectancy
That chart could be interpreted a variety of ways, but I just don’t see any data about our ancestors that would lead me to believe we should follow in their shoes, assuming even that we can all agree that they didn’t drink much water. :s
Drink it! I am another water advocate! Suiyuan31 good posts. The amount the OP said is a bit crazy for kids, but after my family read this book it really helped us. Just check out the reader reviews if nothing else.
amazon.com/Your-Bodys-Many-C … 0970245882
This guy has written more than one very outstanding book on the subject. He does not sell water or work for some big company either and while everybody is different the majority of people do not drink enough. My cousin was doing water research at UCLA and told us about the books and water. I myself have asthma and since turning to much more water I have dropped my inhalers and started feeling much better, I do not have attacks anymore and I had tried everything. My Dad used to always get congestion and stuffed up. He drinks a lot more since and rarely has nasal problems now. While some people may rarely drink it most of us don’t have super genes to help us live to be 99 while drinking tea, whisky and cokes. Out body is mostly water isn’t it. As stated earlier, thirst means you are now becoming dehydrated, it is a warning signal from the body. Medicine costs a lot more than water does for me and I don’t know why anyone is comparing animals at all. They drink what? Milk as babies…water as adults not any of our drinks as it is. The book also tells you how in water vs tea water wins hands down. The book goes into physiology of the body and explains every function of the body and what role the water plays in our condition. I’m convinced!
Your kidneys need water to eliminate body wastes, especially nitrogenous waste like urea. Too little water can result in levels of the undesirable stuff remaining at slightly higher values than otherwise. But they really don’t care where the water comes from, as long as there’s enough of it. The water you absorb from beer or Coke or tea or coffee is absorbed as water, and the kidney can’t tell the difference.
Now, there may be other problems from too much sugar absorbed or whatever, but that doesn’t mean that the kidneys care about where the water they use comes from. And there are some who point out that beer and coffee are diuretic, but really, for habitual drinkers, they are such weak diuretics and the amount of water also added at the same time as the diuretic is drunk is more than sufficient to compensate, and habitual drinkers of alcohol or caffeine become so tolerant to the diuretic effects that it doesn’t make any difference.
Just drink stuff, and make sure it’s not salty. If your diet is salty, then drink more water.
Eight liters of pure water, on the other hand, is dangerous, and leaches essential nutrients and vitamins out, often faster than they can get replaced. Then you get in the whole stupid rollercoaster of lots of water, and needing to take lots of vitamins, minerals, crazy foods, and special diets just to maintain the same even keel you could be on by drinking more normally anyway.