So, I’ve been in Taiwan and China for a total of eight years now. First three in Taiwan, last five in Xiamen. I might return to Taiwan this year.
I’ve never officially studied, besides doing two months of a Donghai Uni 12-2pm programme that catered to us ‘busy’ English teachers - it must be said I learned quite a bit in those two months.
The realization has dawned on me (I’m slow on the uptake) that I’ll be in Taiwan and/or China, doing business, dealing with the locals, potentially settling down with a local lass and getting married and teaching indefinitely.
South Africa has just joined BRIC (Brazil-Russia-China-India) and I see China-SA/Africa relations getting closer in future. I see myself fitting in there somewhere and REALLy need to get my Mandarin up to spec, ie. fluent as fluent can be, so that I’m in a place to take full advantage of any opportunities that may arise.
Back on topic - all the Mandarin I know I’ve learned from listening, mimicking, using a dictionary, asking local friends how to use a term/word, speaking (and making mistakes and getting corrected), etc.
I’d say my spoken Mandarin is okay, but not good, definitely not great, most definitely not good enough to do business.
So, do I go back and start from Step 1 - join a uni programme? Or get a tutor and spend plenty of time with them? I think I could go from OK to good in a year and good to great in three years.
Xiamen has some good Chinese learning programs from what I’ve heard. I think you might have to back to a uni program to get reading/writing up to speed as you’d need it for e-mails and documents. I deal with mainlander from time to time and they are more fond of using Chinese e-mails than the Taiwanese who are happy to use English.
I went back to a uni program after many years in the same positions as yoursel, it was painful for the first 3 months at least but after that I didn’t feel I was holding myself back too much. It took me about 1.5-2 years to get a fairly good proficiency in Chinese and also in business related Chinese. If you haven’t picked up good Chinese now you will need to take the formal route, some of us are not naturals at languages or super outgong.
BTW it is true that there will be and already are plenty of opportunities and I know S.Africans in S.Africa who have never been to Asia who are learning some Chinese! For instance Chinese have invested in quite a bit of property in Cape Town, they are also investing in mines all over Africa. Then there would be big tourism/guide opportunities for bringing them on Safari. There’s a lot of ideas business wise.
If you think you’ll be working with mainland Chinese, it might be a good idea to study/live in northern China at some point. The accents there can be problematic if you don’t prepare for them. And since you can already get along with the southern variety, familiarizing yourself with northern Mandarin won’t hurt you.
Geez, that guy says neige far more than is necessary. And he sounds drunk.
She’s pretty clear, other than it sounds as if she has a bag of marbles in her gob…
Edit:[quote=“Toasty”]I’d say private tuition, with the learner (you) customizing the content of the lessons to suit your specific needs and goals.[/quote]
I’ve found that to be quite useful, but I have to admit that I miss the structured approach of a uni program. What I don’t miss is paying 10k/month on the lottery of perhaps having a good teacher, probably having a bad one, and the two weeks of “review” and tests.
If I could do it all again, I’d definitely have spent the first 3 to 5 years in Taiwan at a formal CLI (NCKU, in my case) and done one of the foreigner friendly (i.e. free) MA degrees. Would have done my Mandarin the world of good, and saved me a fortune by staying away from the pub culture.
However, we don’t get do overs IRL, and it’s dismaying to find myself in pretty much the same position as the OP after eight years. After a lay off of more than a year I’ve recently jumped back on the Chinese learning band wagon (I’ve dedicated 2011 to learning Chinese), but I’m basically doing self study and trying to implement Ironlady’s CI/TPRS approach to language learning as much as possible in a self study context. But it’s tough going and I’m considering ponying up the moolah to go back to NCKU later this year and ride that horse to the end of PAV Book 5.
When I first got here I never imagined I’d be here longer than two years, and I certainly never thought I’d be applying for citizenship eight years down the road. Living here permanently, making Taiwan my home, closer ties with China, and a possible return to the “old country” with closer ties and opportunities to China, it’s definitely a good idea to get as fluent as possible. And I’m tired of being told by newbs how good my Chinese is with full knowledge myself that it sucks arse.
With everything I know now I think a multi-layered full on approach is the best way to get things done. CLI combined with a private tutor once or twice a week and several hours a week of self study. A year or two of 40 odd hours a week (including the ten to 15 hours a week of class time) and actively seeking out local friends is sure to get the job done.
Geez, that guy says neige far more than is necessary. And he sounds drunk.
She’s pretty clear, other than it sounds as if she has a bag of marbles in her gob…
Edit:[quote=“Toasty”]I’d say private tuition, with the learner (you) customizing the content of the lessons to suit your specific needs and goals.[/quote]
I’ve found that to be quite useful, but I have to admit that I miss the structured approach of a uni program. What I don’t miss is paying 10k/month on the lottery of perhaps having a good teacher, probably having a bad one, and the two weeks of “review” and tests.
[/quote]
One thing you won’t miss is the bs that goes on in uni programs. Yes, group classes can definitely be a boon. There’s structure, interaction and the ability to learn from your classmates. On the other hand, in Taiwan’s uni programs, you get a lot of time-wasting, pointless exercises.
She’s pretty clear, other than it sounds as if she has a bag of marbles in her gob… [/quote]
She isn’t so bad. I met some mainland Chinese professors a couple months ago and I could hardly understand them. Marbles in their gobs to the extreme.[/quote]
It’s not only the accent but the terminology, including common terminology, is often quite different. They use different words for numbers and even for close relatives. On a recent trip I was asked how was my ‘xiao huir’, completely threw me but later found it is the common term for wife there.
What I’m thinking is I’ll join a part-time programme at Xiamen Uni (I should get a discount as I’m a teacher there), then a private tutor to polish up specific areas of weakness/interest.
Also, spend much more with my Chinese and Taiwanese buddies speaking in Mandarin only.
A good dictionary and/or software on my phone seems to help too, when I’m on the go (suggestions? I currently use mdbg.net and its software).
I am/was seeing a girl who refuses to speak English to me. She understands English, but will only speak Mandarin to me. It forces me to listen more intently, and I quite enjoy speaking back to her in Mandarin, and having her correct me. It helps that I enjoy spending time with her
