This is my first post on Forumosa, so let me first say that Forumosa is awesome! Tons and tons of useful information about Taiwan. Good job and keep growing!
A little bit about myself: I have a Master’s degree in engineering from a prestigious university and ~3 years of working experience. I currently reside in the US but I am in the process of negotiating an offer from a huge Taiwanese engineering company. Does anyone know what the salary level is for engineering? Is there anyone who is also a foreigner working as an engineer in Taiwan?
Aside from rent, is NT10,000 per month for other expenses (food, necessities, entertainment, etc) normal in Taiwan?
Thanks guys! I appreciate the responses beforehand.
[quote=“vodche”]Hey guys,
This is my first post on Forumosa, so let me first say that Forumosa is awesome! Tons and tons of useful information about Taiwan. Good job and keep growing!
A little bit about myself: I have a Master’s degree in engineering from a prestigious university and ~3 years of working experience. I currently reside in the US but I am in the process of negotiating an offer from a huge Taiwanese engineering company. Does anyone know what the salary level is for engineering? Is there anyone who is also a foreigner working as an engineer in Taiwan?
Aside from rent, is NT10,000 per month for other expenses (food, necessities, entertainment, etc) normal in Taiwan?
Thanks guys! I appreciate the responses beforehand.[/quote]
Welcome to Taiwan & Forumosa!
With a degree and working experience it depends usually on your position what the pay will be in big companies.
“Managers” get payed higher (even they still do all the engineering jobs) and also more on other things (such as business trips allowance). So be careful “as what” they put you down. Don’t accept the plain “工程師” (gong cheng shi) = engineer. But go at least for 主辦工程師 (主辦 = zhu ban / Leading, literally “host”) engineer or even better 專案副理 (zhuan an fu li = project or assistant manager).
For a single person 10000 / month is enough to survive (outside Taipei). But I find its kind of the minimum.
In my company “Taiwanese” starter engineers usually get around 40000 / month (thats the engineers who only doing testing and stuff). Better ones we pay 60000 (who also can program for example). If they are really good they get up to 90000. Once you enter 專案副理 or higher you’d get 100000 or more (Hsinchu Science Park). Foreigners don’t usually start under 80000. Hope this helps a bit. What kind of engineering will you do? Will they provide you housing?
Thanks for the reply! Well, I interviewed for a senior engineer position so it better not be a starter position doing only testing and stuff =D. Yes the company is located in Hsinchu Science Park. The numbers that you mentioned, are they just base salary or including bonus? Sorry I did not make myself clear but I was particularly interested in knowing the base salary level. I do not think they would provide housing since they do not really consider me as an expat (just a foreigner being offered a job in Taiwan).
I am married (but no kids yet), so from your response, it seems that NT 10,000 would be an underestimation. How much do you think would be reasonable?
[quote=“vodche”]Thanks for the reply! Well, I interviewed for a senior engineer position so it better not be a starter position doing only testing and stuff =D. Yes the company is located in Hsinchu Science Park. The numbers that you mentioned, are they just base salary or including bonus? Sorry I did not make myself clear but I was particularly interested in knowing the base salary level. I do not think they would provide housing since they do not really consider me as an expat (just a foreigner being offered a job in Taiwan).
I am married (but no kids yet), so from your response, it seems that NT 10,000 would be an underestimation. How much do you think would be reasonable?[/quote]
Whatever you do, don’t sell yourself under value!
The numbers are without bonus (12 salaries like this per year).
I got my company to accept that they pay me a annual “home leave” (to Europe) with 7 extra vacation days.
I don’t get a bonus. I refused it with saying “I don’t want to play in the casino and its not my culture”.
In consequence my base salary is higher.
I’m spending like 800/day or more for food (we usually eat out in summer) and they are not cheap stinky tofu outside restaurants Phone bills/ADSL/Water/Electricity total to around 4000 each month for us (we don’t need air condition in every room, if you do then it can easily go up to 10000/month).
Rent in Hsinchu we got (very close to the Science Park with around 80 square meters) is 15000 / month in rent. This can be higher if you live in [strike]Foreigner Village,[/strike] errrr Holland Village in Hsinchu, which is more far away from the Science Park (and for teachers)…
[quote=“kaiwen338”]
Think less in terms of how much could you live on. Better think in terms of how much value do you bring to the table.[/quote]
Think also in terms of what you can learn by working here. Financially, it will suck working for a Taiwanese company.
Thank you all for the responses. Yes I am coming from the US and I am not expecting them to match my US salary (that would be ridiculous). I had asked around and some told me the base salary (the monthly one) in Taiwan is sooo low, so I got a little worried . I find it bitter to work my ass off only to find I never have any money left for savings at the end of the month.
I am sure many Taiwanese engineers are equally qualified (or even smarter) but I guess I am bringing with me experience from the US (better English, of course) so I am hoping for something better than the local standard. On the other hand, I can learn Chinese while living and working in Taiwan (you can say that’s the trade-off for giving up US salary).
Anyway, the offer’s not finalized yet, so we’ll see how it goes. Taiwan’s compensation culture is a little confusing: very low base salary, and very high bonus. Do bonus get paid monthly?
[quote=“vodche”]
I am sure many Taiwanese engineers are equally qualified (or even smarter) but I guess I am bringing with me experience from the US (better English, of course) so I am hoping for something better than the local standard. On the other hand, I can learn Chinese while living and working in Taiwan (you can say that’s the trade-off for giving up US salary).[/quote]
Your English is worthless. Your boss will ignore your native skills and publish materials in Chinglish anyway. What you have to offer is knowledge of standards, SOP, project management, cost / benefit analysis etc. You may have what you think is a mundane skill which noone here possesses. Learning Chinese is not so valuable (though it is useful) as simply gaining an understanding of how development / manufacturing / testing etc. is done out here. Very few people back in the west have any idea… including the people designing / building / selling equipment for this market. There are over a billion people can speak Chinese, so this ability in and of itself is worthless.
Do not sell yourself cheap and do not let them suck you dry. Be flexible with salary but firm with hours / holiday package. Push for at least two positions above what you sit at now. In Taiwan, ‘manager’ means next to nothing, ‘lead engineer’ or ‘team leader’ even less. Shoot for Head of R&D or something with pazzaz.
Put in your time learning how things work here and then go sell that to the highest bidder back home in a few years time, or start your own business as suggested. If you learn some Chinese in the process, that’s icing on the cake, but don’t let it become your focus. I can tell you as a whitey with fluent Chinese that language is not what puts the bread on the table.
I’m a mechanical engineer but it’s all the same as far as treatment inside local companies goes.
Usually twice per year (one month in August/September) and one time before Chinese New Year (1-2 months is realistic, 6 month is what everyone “dreams” of and is kind of the maximum).
I think its a scheme cause the salaries are already low.
If you give someone 100 bucks per month and suddenly I give 200 bucks on top you’ll make them feel happy.
Whereas it would actually be better to pay them right in the first place no?
One example, “engineer” at 50000:
50000 * 12 = 600000
on top (lets say 4 month total bonus) 4 * 50000 = 200000.
200000 + 600000 = 800000.
800000 / 12 = 66666. ~16000 more per month . But still crap right?
And 4 month are optimistic! Remember you work here for many years. If you quit before Chinese new year, you loose big.
When I got my “last bonus” around Chinese New Year (when saying I don’t want that shit anymore and they increased my salary and removed the bonus) the bonus was one month of my “old salary”. Damn that felt so low
Oh, and the first year you will get no or little bonus.
Good luck if you enter that casino scheme and if they really made you believe that it actually would mean more (most sheep that work under me do believe so). Chinese like to gamble.
By all means push for other things (like home leave) just say other foreigners get it.
No matter what level of engineer, my salary was always about 1/3 of an equivalent position in the US. I was in the public sector so the bonus structure and salary was weaker than the science park. But I did have about 7 weeks holiday a year.
Most of my friends who are in research or at the director level have been making US equivalent compensation (though not this year).
No matter what level of engineer, my salary was always about 1/3 of an equivalent position in the US. I was in the public sector so the bonus structure and salary was weaker than the science park. But I did have about 7 weeks holiday a year.
Most of my friends who are in research or at the director level have been making US equivalent compensation (though not this year).[/quote]
Where in the US? Before or after tax?
Does the holiday you mention include Chinese New Year?
Vodche, quick ?, has this company ever hired a foreign employee before? You may want to get yourself sorted out with a 1-5 year multiple entry visa and do not forget that they initially tax you at 20% here, but you should get most of it back. Best of luck
Yes, pay very close attention to the Mandarin version of your title. There is like 3 times mor levels here than NA and as said above, Manager means nothing. Anybody got a list of the typical levels arg they always escape me…
Mechanical’s make nothing here. Upper managers start to get something “livable”, like ~100k-150k /month including bonus. You need to be Snr Manager or Director level to start pulling the big bonuses and typical perks you find at a much lower level Stateside.
Redwagon is spot on with his post. If you’re used to working in the Valley, you’re going to be sorely disappointed here. You need to come with an open mind and focus on skill building, not building a nest egg or having a cushy job.
I’ve never seen any expats here working non-expat positions with lots of holidays. Guess some people have been succesful though.
[quote=“engerim”]
Does the holiday you mention include Chinese New Year?[/quote]
6 weeks plus Chinese new year I believe. This was 6 or more years ago and it was about the only benefit I had. Unfortunately I had to take part-time work to actually afford to go anywhere as my salary at that time was little more than 1/2 what my wife was making teaching. Few move/stay here for the money.
Correction: Financially, it will suck working for a Taiwanese company on local terms.[/quote]
Yes, fair point… but very few Taiwanese firms are hiring foreign engineers on expat terms. Actually, none that I’ve ever heard of.
You are right, it’s probably an exception and you have to have some luck to get such a job. Many other reasons though why working for a Taiwanese company may still suck.
Yes this company has tons of foreign employees (according to people who interviewed me), but I won’t be surprised if they do (it’s a huge, internationally known company, I just can’t say which one). Another reason why I am seriously considering the offer; there’s gotta be lots of things I can learn there.
Whatever you do, don’t put the first number on the table. Let the company do that, making sure they know full well what you are bringing to the table.
If this is a large global company, their HR team should be trained well enough to come at you with an offer in the proper ballpark.
If they don’t, you should really consider if you want to work for a shoddy company. Yes you can learn a lot about Taiwan business culture here, but if the offer package looks sub-par to you… it just might be.
. I find it bitter to work my ass off only to find I never have any money left for savings at the end of the month. 
