Am I a bad person to get bugged by all these people in a Chinese speaking country who speak english to me right off the bat? I mean, I know that there’s a pretty good chance that a foreigner won’t have fluent Chinese, but i mean, really, some of us do know how to say a few things. Yeah, they aren’t doing anything morally wrong I know, but I mean, I came here and thought I would be able to learn Chinese and I would be in a Chiense speaking country and I would go out on the street and hear it etc etc etc, but at so many places around here where you know, you don’t. At school, at host family (my host family is determined to not. I have had conversations back and forth where only I don’t speak English, and my seven year old host sister has super good english and won’t speak chinese to me), and so I get a little frustrated sometimes.
I wouldn’t get too worked up about it. People in Taiwan and China are usually eager to show what English they know. They probably don’t get much chance to use it, the same way you probably felt about your Chinese. The best thing to do is humor them and not lose your cool (and not losing face!). Let them know that you’re glad to help them with a little English if they help you with Chinese. Actually not letting on that you know much Chinese can be very useful in some situations - you’ll find out.
When we’re slowing the car down to look for a house number, we get irritated by the guy behind us honking the horn, but when we’re in a hurry and the car in front of us slows down for no apparent reason, we get irritated by that (failing to realize that he needs to slow down to look for a house number). In other words, the other guy could easily be you!
Remembering to pause and take the other person’s viewpoint, to pause and try to be more generous with one’s assumptions, is often the cause of our getting upset, rather than the cause being that the other person is somehow in the wrong.
Similarly, you might be upset in this case because you’re thinking only of your own desire to practice Chinese. But the other person’s desire to practice English with the rare foreigner they meet is just as valid. That doesn’t make them rude; they’re no different from you.
Furthermore, you are surrounded by millions of Chinese speakers, so you have millions of opportunities to practice. But the handful among them who try to speak English with you probably only have a handful or fewer such opportunities to practice English. So slow down, be more generous, and give them a chance to practice English too.
Next, be more generous with your assumptions. Some of them are probably trying to be polite and welcoming when they talk to you in English. I find it delightful, not irritating. Also, they might not be aware you speak Chinese.
Finally, if you really find that you don’t have enough chances to practice, just go out and make some friends with people who don’t speak English, or who speak some but are a bit lazy and prefer to communicate in their native tongue. They are the vast majority of the inhabitants of this island. You can’t fail to find them if you try. But start with a smile, not a scowl.
[quote=“Dragonbones”]
Similarly, you might be upset in this case because you’re thinking only of your own desire to practice Chinese. But the other person’s desire to practice English with the rare foreigner they meet is just as valid. That doesn’t make them rude; they’re no different from you.[/quote]
Sure they’re different from him. He came here to learn Chinese. If they want to practice English all the time, they should go to an English speaking country. Of course, it could be his own fault for having gotten himself into a homestay situation where the family just wants to use the foreigner for English practice. I’ve never heard of a homestay that didn’t turn out like this.
[quote=“Dragonbones”]
Next, be more generous with your assumptions. Some of them are probably trying to be polite and welcoming when they talk to you in English. I find it delightful, not irritating. Also, they might not be aware you speak Chinese. [/quote]
Or you could just ignore them. I have plenty of friends and acquaintances with whom I can speak Chinese. I’m not in search of random friends. If someone insists on speaking English with me, I just ignore them. More times than not, a person who insists on speaking English with a foreigner whose Chinese is better than their English isn’t really interested in you for who you might be; they just want English practice. Do you really need to talk to people like that? If you actually need to get along with that person or if your Chinese isn’t good enough yet, then you might need to use some English. If not, then just ignore them and find another crowd.
Jive Turkey wrote: (quote) Sure they’re different from him. He came here to learn Chinese. If they want to practice English all the time, they should go to an English speaking country. (end quote)
That seems rather harsh and unfair. Why must someone leave their homeland to learn something?
[quote=“Dragonbones”]Jive Turkey wrote: (quote) Sure they’re different from him. He came here to learn Chinese. If they want to practice English all the time, they should go to an English speaking country. (end quote)
That seems rather harsh and unfair. Why must someone leave their homeland to learn something?[/quote]
沒錯. 不要不好意思,告訴他們你的感覺. But be polite about it.
There you go, see how terrible my Chinese is… practice is easy to get but finding the right people is difficult.
when i stayed with a host family in france, they were respectful and happy to speak with me in french all the time. they didn’t capitalize on the chance to ‘brush up’ on their english. in fact, they always insisted graciously that i don’t use english.
i don’t see why it’s not possible with other families unless that was their intent all along and the fact was communicated in which case you had clear warning.
but strangers coming up to you and saying hello isn’t such a big deal (but maybe if you’re the only foreigner within 20mile radius).
[quote=“Dragonbones”]Jive Turkey wrote: (quote) Sure they’re different from him. He came here to learn Chinese. If they want to practice English all the time, they should go to an English speaking country. (end quote)
That seems rather harsh and unfair. Why must someone leave their homeland to learn something?[/quote]
How is that harsh or unfair? I didn’t say that they shoud leave Taiwan if they want to learn English. What I said is that if they only want to speak English all the time, they should go to an English speaking country. How is it my or Plappy’s duty to let Chinese or Taiwanese people practice their English with us? If your goal is to learn Chinese and your time is precious, then why should you bother speaking English with people unless you really want or need to?
I have a few Chinese and Taiwanese friends with whom I speak English from time to time. I do this because they are my friends and I know it makes them feel good to practice their English. If a stranger first speaks English to me, I don’t take issue with it, although I will usually push the conversation over to Chinese as soon as it becomes evident that their English is not up to the task. If a stranger still insists on tryng to communicate in English even though it is clear that the task could be wrapped up much faster if we just spoke Chinese, then I won’t have much patience for that person. If Plappy’s goal is to learn Chinese, but others don’t respect that, then he should by all means find people who do. There’s nothing harsh, unfair or rude about that.
99 out of 100 foreigners in Taiwan don’t speak Chinese worth shit. Speaking to you in English because they think you can’t speak Chinese well enough is a reasonable assumption. I’m sorry if you are one of the 1% of foreigners in Taiwan that can carry on a reasonably fluent conversation in Chinese, but try not to get too offended by this reality.
I wish more people spoke English to me. Down here in Tainan the only Taiwanese who can speak English worth a damn are all English teachers. Oh, well maybe some of the people that work in foreigner pubs.
[quote=“Jive Turkey”][quote=“Dragonbones”]Jive Turkey wrote: (quote) Sure they’re different from him. He came here to learn Chinese. If they want to practice English all the time, they should go to an English speaking country. (end quote)
That seems rather harsh and unfair. Why must someone leave their homeland to learn something?[/quote]
How is that harsh or unfair? I didn’t say that they shoud leave Taiwan if they want to learn English. What I said is that if they only want to speak English all the time, they should go to an English speaking country. How is it my or Plappy’s duty to let Chinese or Taiwanese people practice their English with us? If your goal is to learn Chinese and your time is precious, then why should you bother speaking English with people unless you really want or need to?
.[/quote]
I think DB had some valid points. Harsh and unfair? I think so. Ignorant, maybe. It isn’t your duty to give them an opportunity to practice English, but then it isn’t their duty to help you with your Chinese. The world may be your playground and you may very well make the rules, but you should also be aware that not everyone understands your rules. There are millions of opportunities to practice Chinese here and if you’re put off because some of those millions don’t play by your rules, then you’re not really seeing things clearly. There’s no reason to assume that people who speak English to you do so with selfish intentions; often it is to help.
i guess it can be a bit irritating at times but i dont think you should be bugged by it. people from non-english speaking countries tend to assume foreigners do not speak domestic languages, which, if you think about it, is not an unreasonable assumption. plus, some of them are probably just being friendly, its sorta like a nice gesture and friendliness blah blah… if you want people to speak chinese to you, i think you will HAVE to ask for it
i doubt it. most chinese are not eager to show how much English they know hmm
Some Taiwanese aren’t used to dumbing down their language for the sake of a foreigner understanding them.My friend seems to be unable to alter his speech for my low-level Chinese.It’s true that my Chinese is crap so if we’re to be understood,he has to use English. I felt humiliated that my Chinese wasn’t upto parr but now I understand. However, I don’t think it’s that difficult to change how you would normally speak just so a foreigner can understand. This friend knows how much it means to me to be able to communicate in Chinese and still hasn’t said “Ok, from now ,lets only talk in Chinese”.I guess I have to find someone who is comfortable speaking and explaining things to me in Chinese.If a Taiwanese person is willing to provide me with some examples then I usually understand what it is they are trying to say.Bless all patient Taiwanese.
The main thing is to not get hurt or stressed-out about any of it.It can be dealt with. Sometimes I even feel that staying at home by myself studying and listening to the radio is better for my Chinese than going out…(oh…what a geek…)
Some Taiwanese aren’t used to dumbing down their language for the sake of a foreigner understanding them.My friend seems to be unable to alter his speech for my low-level Chinese.It’s true that my Chinese is crap so if we’re to be understood,he has to use English. I felt humiliated that my Chinese wasn’t upto parr but now I understand. However, I don’t think it’s that difficult to change how you would normally speak just so a foreigner can understand. This friend knows how much it means to me to be able to communicate in Chinese and still hasn’t said “Ok, from now ,lets only talk in Chinese”.I guess I have to find someone who is comfortable speaking and explaining things to me in Chinese.If a Taiwanese person is willing to provide me with some examples then I usually understand what it is they are trying to say.Bless all patient Taiwanese.
The main thing is to not get hurt or stressed-out about any of it.It can be dealt with. Sometimes I even feel that staying at home by myself studying and listening to the radio is better for my Chinese than going out…(oh…what a geek…)
hairyknuckles, I have found the same thing in certain areas. However, I think it is important to note who you are talking to. People who are used to foreigners trying out their Chinese are great. Most people here are not used to people learning their language. This is not a multi-cultural society!
In the US midwest, if you don;t speak fluent English, they just speak louder. I have had a bartender in Australia not understand a “pot of beer” and she brought me a glass of Coke. I’m a native speaker of English!
I have Taiwanese friends who speak great English, but love speaking chinese to foreigners. I almost feel like I am taking advantage as my chinese is way worse than their English.
I do think if your Chinese is mediocre to shit (like mine), you are best off finding friends here that speak English well. They know what it is like to learn a foreign language!
have you try asking your Chinese friends to speak Chinese when they are talking to you? if you dont tell them exactly what you want, no offense but how do you expect them to know what to say? they probably thought you’d be happier if they explain things to you in English. plus, people generally find it offensive when people talk slower than usual. it is a form of mockery. therefore, i think it would be the best if you would just explain to them what you want… if they still talk to you in English, by all means find other friends to help you
hmm