Expat vs. Immigrant

To EOD, Harry Crack et al.:

Yes, T.C. Lin, Christopher Locke and Poagao are the same person! He’s the author of the book and the blog, and our cherished poster (and, as a side note, the person who gave me the perfect cat :slight_smile: ). But you could have easily found that (and some background on his serving in the Taiwanese army) by checking some of his earlier posts including the thread on Poagao’s book :?

HTH
Iris

There may be an American/British divide on the use of the term ‘expat’, but from reading (rather than dictionaries), I’ve always understood ‘expat’ to mean someone who has left their home country more or les permanently. I think the real difference is that ‘expat’ is used for westerners (again I’m thinking Brits here) who have gone to live in Hong Kong or Greece or somewhere. You always read phrases like ‘among the expat community’.

Brian

When I worked for a big international telco before an expat was defined as a flexible (in terms of contract duration and location) professional working in a foreign country with the already mentioned package (high salary, free housing and other benefits), on a temporary assignment with no intention of immigrating / settling down. Of course this is not exclusive if the person chooses to, but it was not the intention of the company - though later a localization policy was actually implemented, i.e. benefits would be cut on a yearly basis and you can choose to stay on more local terms or return home / transfer. They called us “International Professional” then instead of “International Expatriate”.
Typically in Asia an expat would enjoy a higher status than locals and (at least in Malaysia) is perceived as a “rich” (high earning) foreigner working in that country.

OCW - and no offense is intended - sounds more like foreign labour, i.e. a person carrying out less skilled jobs (e.g. maids, construction workers etc.).

So I guess the defintion might differ from the one in the dictionary, depending on the company your work for or how you would like yourself to be seen as.

My words are laxative – all it took was nine of them to generate a half-page of diarrhoea from Harry’s Crack.

If you want longer, more considered responses from me, you’ll have to post something that doesn’t bore me within the first three lines – I have a very short attention span. :wink:

There seems to be two camps pushing their definition here. On one side we have those who will forever see an expat as one of those hard drinking, fast living lost souls in a Henry Miller, Graham Greene or Paul Theroux novel. In the other camp we have those whose definition doesn

Actually I have tried twice to move the family business out of Taiwan. Unfortunately nearly all of our manufactures are Chinese from Taiwan with their factories in China.
If you knew how much they paid me to live here you would see why it is so difficult to leave. I simply can’t make this much money anywhere else. Taking that into consideration I am still tempted to quit and pack up.
T. C. Lin may be cool but Christopher Locke is person who gave up. America has it

Finally, someone who not only understands my schizophrenia but my illusionary children as well! And all this time I thought nobody understood me. :frowning:

No ofense Chris but I just can’t see the logic or follow your thinking. I have tried to consider the option myself but cannot. What brought you around to making this kind of decision? How much money did they pay you?

There’s a they? EOD, tell us more…

Please!!! Poagao is great, someone who follows through on his convictions regardless of what other people think and popular thought. A true self thinker and a doer.

What have you done lately?

He was on a boat. :slight_smile:

I’m not going to try and explain, EOD, not only because it would take too long and be inappropriate in this forum, but also because I really don’t think I could say anything that would change your opinion of Taiwan.

Is he the same T. Locke who was a hostage during the Iranian embassy seige in London and won a medal for beating up a terrorist ?

Yes he is. He also gnawed off one of his own legs when he got caught in a bear trap in the Klondike and survived at sea for 167 days during his round-the-world pedalo attempt when a marauding shark tore off one of his floats.

Xpat, friends, it’s Xpat.

Just to get this thread back on topic, did you hear about the hiker who amputated his own arm with a pocket knife after being trapped by a boulder for 5 days? Then he slapped on a tourniquet, rapelled 60 feet down to the canyon floor, and hiked out two miles until he met some other hikers.

Just to get this thread back on topic, did you hear about the hiker who amputated his own arm with a pocket knife after being trapped by a boulder for 5 days? Then he slapped on a tourniquet, rapelled 60 feet down to the canyon floor, and hiked out two miles until he met some other hikers.[/quote]
Yes, but was he an Expat or an Immigrant ?

Dunno, but if he’d been an X-man he probably could have gotten out of it a bit more easily.

Straying off the topic of arm gnawing and superheroes for a moment, I think that one of the reasons foreigners in Taiwan aren’t likely to consider themselves immigrants is that it’s so damn hard to become one (an immigrant, not a foreigner). When I first got here it was almost unheard of for a foreigner to have permanent residency, and I ended up leaving right about the time it became legal. If the laws had been less restrictive 5 or 10 years ago I might have considered permanent residency. Another issue, for Taiwan at least, is that Taiwanese who get US citizenship don’t have to renounce their Taiwan citizenship.

I wonder if that would stop the majority of Taiwanese who are set on immigrating to the States from doing it? Somehow, I doubt it would.

[quote]Please!!! Poagao is great, someone who follows through on his convictions regardless of what other people think and popular thought. A true self thinker and a doer.

What have you done lately?
[/quote]
It’s not so much what I have done but what I haven’t done. I have not followed my fathers advice and severed all links to Taiwan. There is now a third generation of us living here. Chances are my children will not consider themselves immigrants either, even though they were born here.
I cannot explain why 3 generations of Jewish Americans cannot assimilate here in Taiwan. I have come closer than any other member of my family and I still call my self an expat (Xpat). [/list]

EOD is an immigrant, nah, nah, ne-nah, nahhhhh.

Immigrant, expat who really cares?.. its all a matter of perspective (from where you left v. where you are). Pretend not to know the subjective difference in the use of the word, then you really do not know what you are doing when you put your foot on the road…

As for giving up American citizenship. Lin Dao Ming (T.C.) is Tiwanese; an immigrant to Taiwan, an American expatriate. Who really gives a flotaing battle ship why.

EOD you show only frustration in your ethnic situation and bigotry in thinking that being a citizen of the USA is better than being a citizen of any other nation. (Nation - a modern political word refering to artifical borders maintained by might… and shaky social compacts.) In doing so you confuse citizenship, ethnicity and the natural movement of people from one place to another in a warped criticism of somebody you do not know or understand.

Your forefathers were freakin’ immigrants, as were those before them, who lived without borders and states to call home. Your children and thier children apparently have missed thier opportunity to be all that they can be.

I’m done with this discusion, all y’all fussy nomads are way to picky for me.

Content to live on Taiwan and never be Taiwanese.

Chou