I went to Burger King one day last week, sat down to a meal of Fat (bacon cheese burger), Salt (french fries liberally salted) and Sugar (massive cola), and wondered which of the poisons was most toxic. I guess the answer depends in part on the particular person – whether he/she has high blood pressure, diabetes, hypoglycemia, etc.
But, in general, which is most deadly?
I also wondered what’s the difference between the effect of eating fat v. sugar.
I guess both would make one gain weight, but it seems that a bacon cheeseburger has the added effect of clogging up ones blood vessels with fatty deposits that make a heart attack more likely some day. It also seems that big fatty meals are more likely to be deposited directly on ones hips, stomach, ass or wherever fat tends to accumulate (eat fat and it is directly converted into ones own human fat), but perhaps for sugar it’s not such a direct route. Sugar, on the other hand, probably has its own unique harms that fat doesn’t, such as tooth decay, etc., but it’s my understanding that if one eats a lot of sugar (and doesn’t exercise enough to burn it off) it will also be converted to fat on ones body.
Is that basically true? Do fats and sugars, when eaten, both turn to fat? Is one worse than the other?
I would vote for sugar.
I generally eat a high salt diet to keep my blood pressure high enough to force the blood through my fat clogged blood vessels.
[quote]. . . According to a slew of recent diet books, it’s sugar, not fat, that causes chronic overeating and adds extra pounds that wont budge. Their solution: Slash sugar from the diet. . .
And no matter what form you eat . . . carbs contain 4 calories per gram, break down to simple sugars during digestion (except for fiber, which is indigestible) and are either used for immediate energy or stored for later. In other words, you need sugars in your diet to keep your body running. Most should come in the form of nutrient-rich starches like whole grains and cereals. You should also eat plenty of fruits, vegetables and lowfat dairy products–which contain sugars, but also valuable vitamins, minerals and disease-fighting chemicals.
The kind of sugar that concerns health experts is added sugar–the sweeteners that are dumped into foods by manufacturers (and sometimes us, when we ladle out table sugar)–because most people eat way too much of it. . .
Many diet books claim that sugar itself causes the body to store more food as body fat, and so even the natural sugars found in fruit should be avoided. But most health experts say that’s misguided reasoning. Fruits and vegetables are loaded with good-for-you substances. The extra calories from added sugar in the American diet are the real cause of unwanted pounds. “Sugar is a significant factor when it comes to obesity,” says Michael Jacobson, Ph.D., executive director of the Center for Science in the Public Interest in Washington, D.C. Case in point: Obesity rates have risen as our intake of added sugar has climbed. “If you eat a lot of empty calories, you run the risk of excessive calorie intake and weight gain,” . . .
Sugary soft drinks and fruit-flavored beverages, the biggest source of added sugar in the diet, may lead to extra pounds in an especially tricky way. Research has shown that the body doesn’t compensate for calories taken in as liquid as it does for calories eaten as food (in other words, after gulping a 300-calorie supersize soda, you’ll still eat the same-size dinner). . . [/quote] findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m … i_98594272
So I guess the answer is that fat and sugar in the diet both turn to fat, but sugar’s a bigger problem because one gains weight and fat by eating excess calories and, in today’s society, one is more likely to eat excess calories from high-sugar foods (especially soda) than from high-fat foods. Is that basically correct?
Is there a difference between the fat one gains on one’s body from eating excess fat v. excess sugar? I know one difference is that eating fat leads to clogged arteries; eating sugar doesn’t (or at least I think that’s true). But what about fat on ones butt or ones gut – is it created the same from fat or sugar intake? It’s just that one takes in more calories from sugar?
Sugar. But in all processed forms.
White breads, white rices, white noodles, white sugar, all other processed sugars and all other processed non-fiber carbs (which turn to sugar)
in the short term, salt is the most dangerous: if you eat 100g of each in one meal, the salt will kill you.
but we don’t eat them in the same amount. fat and sugar cooperate in the dietary environment, and can substitute for each other in many cells energy requirements.
fat is a very dense store of energy, about twice the energy storage of equivalent amount of sugar. (building all the extra bonds in fats takes more energy, and thus fats themselves store more energy). your body generates most of its resting energy from fat. excess fat you eat is stored in fat cells. much sugar you eat is stored in muscle and liver cells for use in bursts of energy. for example, when walking up stairs, each step you take uses a small burst of sugar. muscle cells can use both fat and sugar for their energy supply. on the other hand, your brain can only use sugar for energy, not fat, and you cannot create sugar from fat, so your brain will starve if you cut out all carbs. (your stores will last for a fair while, mr atkins)… and your kidney and heart can only use fat for energy supply, not sugar. so you need to eat both.
sugars, be they simple or complex, are turned into fat if there is too much to store in the muscle and liver cells. this is why excess sugar is bad for you in the long term, as it is turned into fats and stored. there is no difference as far as your body is concerned, especially in regard to the destination of the fat, between simple and complex sugars.
the simple sugars are absorbed faster than complex sugars (starch, agar, etc) and thus the level of sugar in the bloodstream reaches a higher maximum level after a meal of lots of simple sugars, like in fruit or colas or cakes. in addition to being converted into fat, the high level of sugar that cannot be stored in the muscles (as the muscles are full up) also causes diabetes type II, which used to be called adult-onset diabetes, but now many kids are too fat and they get it too. it is insulin-resistant, unlike the separate juvenile-onset diabetes type I, a completely different disease. get rid of sugar in the muscles by exercising and you can then store simple sugars again. do not be afraid of simple sugars if you’re an athlete, but cut out on most high sugar meals if you are a sedentary person. ride your bike to work, and you can eat what you want.
so what is your question: what time scale are we talking? how much of each are you taking? etc
" According to a slew of recent diet books, it’s sugar, not fat, that causes chronic overeating and adds extra pounds that wont budge. Their solution: Slash sugar from the diet. . . "
actually, it is people who cause people to eat too much.
if someone asks to ‘upsize’ you for another dollar, the correct response is ‘go boil your head’. unless you actually are hungry. how many people know what hunger really is. is it that mild sense of (psychological) discomfort i get when i look at my watch and realise i have not eaten for three hours? gimme a break.
occasional fasts of a day or so are very useful to clean out your gut and then you can actually experience minimal to mild hunger. real hunger starts after at least a couple of days with no food. and hunger does not kill you, anyway. most people have enough fat to live off for a week at least, if not more. you just run out of vitamins and minerals if you don’t eat for that long.
[quote=“Tyc00n”]
Sugar doesn’t turn into fat. Its chemically impossible[/quote]
um, no. you’re a little bt wrong here. it is only one of the many things our mitochondria (enrgy conversion factories in all cells) and particularly our liver cells are specialised to do.
otoh, our bodies cannot turn fat into sugars. but many other creatures can, including plants and bcteria and fungi and manyother kinds of animals, just not vertebrates…
there are a thousand articles in cyberspace. use your search engine and read them.
Sugar (and other forms of simple carbohydrates) are the most efficent substance the body can use in order to convert to energy. If you just eat sugar and have no fat in your diet you won’t put on any weight.
The reason sugar has such a bad rap, and rightly so is that the body will readily use it, but store any fat eaten. I.E. sugar has the tendency to make the body store any fat eaten.
If sugars are avoided (by sticking to complex carbs), then the body is forced to process more of the fat than it usually does. This is why the Atkins diet works.
If you really want to lose weight, use the glycemic index to avoid carbs that are broken down easily (this is pretty difficult in Taiwan), eat tonnes of vegetables (they should be snack foods too… esp the dark green ones), fruits (not too many tropical but more citrus) and lean meats / fish.
[quote=“Tyc00n”]Actually fat is the biggest killer, not sugar.
Sugar (and other forms of simple carbohydrates) are the most efficent substance the body can use in order to convert to energy. If you just eat sugar and have no fat in your diet you won’t put on any weight.[/quote]
um. no again. sorry, but you need to do some research here before posting this. it is a complex area, and there is a lot to understand, which is why there are so many terribly-written ‘nutrition advice’ books out there.
[quote=“Tyc00n”]The reason sugar has such a bad rap, and rightly so is that the body will readily use it, but store any fat eaten. I.E. sugar has the tendency to make the body store any fat eaten.
If sugars are avoided (by sticking to complex carbs), then the body is forced to process more of the fat than it usually does. This is why the Atkins diet works.[/quote]
fat or sugar are both used for energy in most cells. please read my prev posts. excess CALORIES make the body store fat, regardless of whether the calories come in in protein, sugar or fat form. the atkins diet can up-regulate genes for fat burning processes, which is why it works in the short term to help burn fat, but there is a huge risk of hypoglyaemic crash and coma especially once one goes inot ketoacidosis, that funky smell from the breath that atkins dieters aim for. you need sugar for your brain and eyes to operate. you will eventually not be able to supply enough sugar once you run out of your sugar stores (glycogen in liver and muscle cells) for your brain, so you go into a coma. the main reason the atkins diet works is becuse you eat less in total because the things you eat are the triggers that make you feel full, like protein and fat. sugars do not induce the same sensations of satiety, so you eat more total calories.
glycaemic index rightly tells you which foods to eat more of and which to eat less of, but has nothing to do with the energy content of the food. 100g of starch has pretty much the same, actually slightly more energy than 100g white sugar (due to the presence of more complex bonds which store more energy and can release it back in the body when converted back inot single sugars for use in the mitochondria). high GI foods release sugar quickly into the bloodstream and their major disadvantage is the risk of diabetes. if you are exercising hard, you NEED that quick burst of sugar, so sports drinks have a lot of fructose and glucose to pick your blood sugar levels up quickly, as you have depleted your blood’s sugar content and your liver cannot convert glycogen and fat into simple sugar fast enough to resupply the muscles.
raw sugar is exactly the same as white sugar with a few impurities left in it, hence the colour. here, it is actually called white sugar grade B in the store, and the white sugar is called white sugar grade A, if you are looking for it. and brown sugar is totally refined white sugar with some molasses from the first stage of processing added back into it to get that wet lumpy appearance and richer taste. i buy raw sugar because it tastes better than white sugar though…
you cannot avoid the simple relationship: energy out should equal energy in.
if you don’t exercise, don’t eat a lot. don’t eat just because it is time to do so… eat when you’re actually hungry. if your current food intake means you have become fat, and if you want to lose weight, you have to eat less than your current amount forever! or add large amounts of exercise to your regime, and eat the same. as a rough guide, a single serve of fries takes about an hour of intense cycling to burn off, or two hours of hard aerobic-level dancing, or three hours of sex. take your choice
The pancreas is responsible. You spike your insulin levels with refined carbs (sugars) or any other form of which can lead to diabetes down the road. Especially in obese/fat people who tend to eat too much of either.
Some bodybuilders I know have used injectable insulin which has proven to have anabolic properties. Usually they’ll take it in combination with Human Growth Hormone and Immune Growth Factor 1. All very risky business and it turns into a full time job tryin to keep track of all of these hormonal balances throughout the day. One slip up and you could go into insulin shock and croak on the spot.
Tycoon, I agree with your glycemic index suggestion as well. People should be very careful as it can be very easy to gain wait if you’re a sugar fiend.
[quote=“M0NSTER”]
Some bodybuilders I know have used injectable insulin which has proven to have anabolic properties. Usually they’ll take it in combination with Human Growth Hormone and Immune Growth Factor 1. All very risky business and it turns into a full time job tryin to keep track of all of these hormonal balances throughout the day. One slip up and you could go into insulin shock and croak on the spot.[/quote]
“i am not enough of a meathead so i shall take dangerous drug combinations to get more so”
maybe they deserve what they get.
:wanker:
Ps, ain’t no such thing as immune growth factor 1. perhaps you mean insulin-like growth factor 1?
Houseknecht KL et al, "Effect of dietary energy source and level on serum growth hormone, insulin-like growth factor 1, growth and body composition in beef heifers."J Anim Sci. 1988 Nov;66(11):2916-23.
[quote=“urodacus”][quote=“Tyc00n”]
Sugar doesn’t turn into fat. Its chemically impossible[/quote]
um, no. you’re a little bt wrong here. it is only one of the many things our mitochondria (enrgy conversion factories in all cells) and particularly our liver cells are specialised to do.
otoh, our bodies cannot turn fat into sugars. but many other creatures can, including plants and bcteria and fungi and manyother kinds of animals, just not vertebrates…
there are a thousand articles in cyberspace. use your search engine and read them.[/quote]
Well I’m not sure I care too much about what various internet articles say…so suggesting I use my search engine is probably going to provide plenty of misleading articles. I’ll send my father an email as he works for Queensland Health, Scientific Services.
From my understanding of basic chemistry, there is no way you take take this:
[quote=“urodacus”][quote=“M0NSTER”]
Some bodybuilders I know have used injectable insulin which has proven to have anabolic properties. Usually they’ll take it in combination with Human Growth Hormone and Immune Growth Factor 1. All very risky business and it turns into a full time job tryin to keep track of all of these hormonal balances throughout the day. One slip up and you could go into insulin shock and croak on the spot.[/quote]
“i am not enough of a meathead so i shall take dangerous drug combinations to get more so”
maybe they deserve what they get.
:wanker:[/quote]
Do you have any idea how much work goes into bodybuilding? Do you have a clue what it takes to lift a car? No, you don’t.
There are many types of athletes and there are many ways of enhancing your performance (blood doping and various other drugs that are not on the banned lists that pro athletes use). Don’t think that it doesn’t come without hard work and dedication. Most of these guys know exactly what sciences are involved and know the body so well that they might as well have a MD.
Your “meathead” comment was uncalled for. It’s not my problem that you live your life scared of your own shadow.
edit yes, Insulin Growth Factor 1. Keep doin your homework and you might just end up a pin cushion. Good on ya.
there is no way it will happen spontaneously, but there are thousand sand thousands of enzymes in every cell. some of them can indeed turn glucose into fat by a process called lipogenesis, carried out predominantly in the liver.
maybe i have the advantage of being a physiology lecturer interested in sports nutrition. but the internet is full of information, some of it crap, some of it extremely useful. i do agree that it is hard to sort the chaff from the rye without a decent bit of background, though.
