It seems the pan-Green administration is acting more reasonably now in allowing ROC planes to fly over China.
This means less the greens’ becoming more understaing of its inability to control economic activities than their intention to regain the upper hand over cross-strait relations, especially from the KMT. They have been on the defensive lately and it is hight time to take the initiative and strike back. I think this will work for the moment to divert some attention away from the fruit squabbling, but in the long term, the ROC government, whichever party is in control, will always face the same old problem of dealing with a big Chinese chauvinist country whose leaders just don’t see why many Taiwanese are not happy about the way they have been treated. Since the 1970s, every administration of the ROC has suffered this problem of passivity as a result of adverse relative strength. The greens are not particularly ineffective. I applaud them this time. It’s not easy to change the ‘no-haste’ policy put in place by LTH at a time when DPP and TSU relations are tense. Though somehow compelled by realities and political consideration, this is a good move.
Yes it is a good move, since at some point in the future PRC will ask ROC to reciprocate the favor of flying over each other
[quote=“ac_dropout”]Yes it is a good move, since at some point in the future PRC will ask ROC to reciprocate the favor of flying over each other
The China Post front page article:
http://www.chinapost.com.tw/taiwan/detail.asp?GRP=B&id=66432
Apparently, Taiwan is NOT going to reciprocate…No cheers to Frank on this one. 
[quote=“DSN”]Taiwan is NOT going to reciprocate.[/quote]So double cheers to Frank. Taiwan is currently zero security threat to China. They are a serious threat to us and allowing them to fly planes over Taiwan merely on a flight plan and an (easily faked) IFF transponder is taking a totally uneccessary risk. Let them take away their 700 missiles, and then come back and talk about overflight rights.
I thought it was the PRC that has been catching ROC spies recently.
Look any crazy Taiwan Independence supporter may get the idea of ramming a 747 into the 3 gorge dam. There been enough crazy incidents with devout Taiwan Independence supporters to make anyone worry.
But without offering the opportunity to reciprocate the favor what does Frank hope to accomplish. Let the big wigs corporate airline make more money and let the small humble farmers starve.
What started out as a step in the right direction is just going to end up as another self imposed restriction.
Well, it seems the little Chen Yonglin affair proves that China’s efforts at espionage far outpace those of Taiwan. And WHEN did this become a conversation about spying? Don’t change the subject. If you have complaints about spying…and are ready to be shot down over them…start another thread.
[quote=“ac_dropout”]
Look any crazy Taiwan Independence supporter may get the idea of ramming a 747 into the 3 gorge dam. There been enough crazy incidents with devout Taiwan Independence supporters to anyone worry.[/quote]
As crazy as the overt threats of invasion of the Chinese government?..or the second-hand threats of certain Chinese generals of nuclear first strikes? I hardly think so.
[quote=“ac_dropout”]
What started out as a step in the right direction is just going to end up as another self imposed restriction.[/quote]
Well, as hsiadogah said, a real step in the right direction would be to remove the missiles. I bet there would then be a major warming towards China in Taiwan. It would also take a lot of steam from the sails of the Greens. It seems the Chinese have a lot still to learn.
These are all ridiculous claims.
We are talking about commercial airlines flying into each other airspace.
The missles? What does that have to do with commerical planes? Is the PRC planning to put a missle in the economy class and land at CKS airport. God forbid they put one of those bulky thing in first or business class, we have standards you know.
Frank is feeling pressure from ROC based airlines to help them save some fuel. But if he is adamant that PRC commerical airlines cannot fly into ROC airspace, why did bother offering. Chances of a deal of this nature going through becomes from slim to none.
Sheesh AC, have you learned nothing? Offering is all that’s important in politics - it’s about the image, not the action.
ROC should have offered the airspace on the condition of “state-to-state” talks, at least it puts the ball back into PRC court for the usual “not-in-your-lifetime-silly-Taiwan-Independence-maverick” response. A semblance of a psuedo-dialogue.
By lifting restriction on ROC planes flying into PRC airspace and already deciding PRC planes cannot fly into ROC airspace, makes to whole offer sounds pretty empty.
Even the most ardent pan-Green supporter can see this was no offer at all.
From 8/5/05 TT: “Reacting to Premier Frank Hsieh’s (謝長廷) proposal to lift the ban on local airlines flying over Chinese air space and to allow passenger and cargo direct charter flights, Chinese Nationalist Party (KMT) Chairman Lien Chan (連戰) said his party had discussed those issues with China ‘long ago’ and ‘it was all set.’”
So, is Lien saying that he has already assumed the responsibilities of elected government officials in negotiating agreements with the Chinese government?
If Lien really wanted these proposals to come to fruition, he should have debriefed the elected governent officials upon his return from China, LONG AGO. Then the premier of the country would be more able to initiate mutually beneficial proposals without having to stumble upon ones that are already ALL SET.
Just maybe Lien kind of likes to make himself look a little important, at least once in a while. 
How many days until he goes off to the old clowns’ retirement home? Can we start counting the days down now? Isn’t it supposed to be mid-August? But, alas, we must suffer through an honorary chairmanmanship which will exhibit little honor.
Frank was speaking to a domestic audience when he made this offer of China fly over, as if he had control of that. How China will react is irrelevant. Reciprocation is of course ‘not an issue’ or better, not THE issue. It’s a good political move but never a step aimed toward cross-strait reconciliation. By the way, it’s not even Frank who was speaking. According to current government institution, cross-strait affairs are definitely the responsibility of CSB. A news repost confirmed that the whole plan was made in the Natioal Security Council. But Fran did take it one step over the prepared line by saying refusing to reciprocate without waiting for and evaluating Chinese and local response. But the news did reduced the heat from the fruit war and raised the hopes of some blues, another point for Frank on his way toward 2008. By agreeing to allow Taiwanese airliners to fly over China, Frank was playing with both sides of the political spectrum. Whatever China says won’t harms him.
Well, he still hasn’t conceded defeat in the presidential election from about a year and a half ago, maybe he thinks he actually is president?
So, perfectly befitting Lien then.
Indeed
Good to see you back on random-rant-make-it-up-as-you-go-along form. A beacon of insanity, an example to us all :bravo: 
[quote]DSN wrote: [quote]
Taiwan is NOT going to reciprocate.[/quote]
So double cheers to Frank.[/quote]
Actually, I was being facecious.
Let’s be honest; being able to fly over China would be a worthwhile economic boost for Taiwan. China is the world’s 4th largest country after:
- Russia - 17,075,200 sq. km (6.67 million sq. mi.)
- Canada - 9,984,670 (3.90 million)
- the US - 9,631,418 (3.76 million)
- China - 9,596,960 (3.75 million - not sure if this includes Taiwan :fume: ) - taken from CIA factbook
(couldn’t resist the Geography lesson
)
It would shorten travel time and reduce costs to practically every destination in Europe when travelling from Taiwan.
However, it would be of little / practically zero economic use to China. “Gee, we can’t fly over this speck off the coast. Bummer!” With the possible exception of flights to North America from Guangdong or Hainan (does this island even have direct flights to / from the US other than on spy planes?), I don’t see any real economic gain to be had by China.
The only purpose of such “restoration” of relations for China would be the political coup. In fact, I’m not sure economics has entered into the equation in the minds of Taiwan’s politicians in this regard either.