[quote=“Cola”]A Taiwanese reporter for one of the main Mandarin papers told me today, privately, and he heard also privately in his own words by email to me last night: “high position officials told my co-workers privately around 30 people are estimated die…”
So word is out among doctors and city officials, 30 more will die. So so sad. Lets hope miracles happen.[/quote]
UDN reports a similar number, udn.com/news/story/2/1032668
[quote=“GC Rider”]OK, I must confess I haven’t been this heartbroken in a very long time. 
The first time I saw this on the news on Sunday morning, I had to switch channels when they showed the video footage. I couldn’t bear watching those terrified kids caught in the fire, running for their lives. Makes me sick in the stomach now when I start thinking about it.
[/quote]
I’m so sorry. What an awful thing to happen.
[quote=“schwarzwald”][quote=“Cola”]A Taiwanese reporter for one of the main Mandarin papers told me today, privately, and he heard also privately in his own words by email to me last night: “high position officials told my co-workers privately around 30 people are estimated die…”
So word is out among doctors and city officials, 30 more will die. So so sad. Lets hope miracles happen.[/quote]
UDN reports a similar number, udn.com/news/story/2/1032668[/quote]
thanks for link update. THAT must be the paper he was referring to and had early warning the news was coming. OUCH!~
An interesting twist:http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/education-community/article/1832360/hong-kong-hill-fire-survivor-defends-visit-taiwan A survivor of a 1996 fire disaster in Hong Kong comes to visit his compatriots and is criticised for some kind of self-aggrandisement. The man was burned when 12 years old and possesses one finger and one eye.
Some quarters are accusing him of just ‘trying to be famous’. An accusation I’ve never seen leveled at the mediocre pop stars and politicians who dominate the media’s attention in this region.
[quote=“ranlee”][quote=“DJCJ”]Thanks for posting the information about Alex Haas. His situation is so horrible, I had to hold myself back from crying. It doesn’t sound like money can buy his survival. Nonetheless, I made a donation to his gofundme: gofundme.com/y2qpd5s
At least his family is with him now.[/quote]
The warm comments to Alex and his family in the donation page are tear jerkers. Read at your own caution.[/quote]
What is HESS doing for Alex? When I worked at Shane, I had health insurance that included repatriation.
HESS have a moral responsibility to assist with this, if he was uninsured.
In a very good unsigned editorial, but written by top editors at the China Post newspaper on Saturday, the editorial person says some amazing things. Excerpt here and full link below:
Headlined: ‘‘Heroism shines through criticism of party-goers’’
Text begins:
''People injured in the Formosa Fun Coast Water Park fire are disproportionately young, most of them in their late teens to mid-twenties. They are supposed to be members of a demographic dubbed by the media as the millennials, the Internet generation, or the “strawberries.” …[800 MORE words:]
dated July 4 issue
chinapost.com.tw/editorial/
TERRIBLE QUOTE: "In the aftermath of the water park fire, some [Taiwanese] armchair commentators were making – and some still are making [in CHinese-language news opeds and blog posts and FB posts]-- the preposterous suggestion that THE VICTIMS ARE SOMEHOW TO BLAME TO THEIR SUFFERING [u]BECAUSE THEY CHOSE TO PARTY THERE[/u]." …(caps emphasis mine, lowercase in original newspaper editorial)
WTF? Has anyone seen such ugly opeds and comments online by Taiwanese "big mouths’’ on TV etc? Unbelievable that anyone would say that!
URGENT NEWS: Family facebook feed says: TODAY NOW;
''We need to get Alex back to the US. We think that the best chance he has to make it out of this is to get him back home and in the care of US based doctors.
Alex’s has been very well taken care of by the hospital and doctors in Taiwan but with the number of people still in critical condition and with depleting resources we are worried his team may soon be limited in what they can do. We are so appreciative of the care he has already received and are forever thankful to the Taiwanese government for the support they have offered the victims and the hospitals.
Here in the US we have more of the resources Alex will need than are currently available in Taiwan. We’re desperately trying to get him back home to Boston and to accomplish that we will need to come up with $200,000.
Please spread this far and wide, we are desperate to get these funds together AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. This is extremely time sensitive.
Again, thank you all for your support and kind words and prayers.’’
[quote=“Cola”]
TERRIBLE QUOTE: "In the aftermath of the water park fire, some [Taiwanese] armchair commentators were making – and some still are making [in CHinese-language news opeds and blog posts and FB posts]-- the preposterous suggestion that THE VICTIMS ARE SOMEHOW TO BLAME TO THEIR SUFFERING [u]BECAUSE THEY CHOSE TO PARTY THERE[/u]." …(caps emphasis mine, lowercase in original newspaper editorial)
WTF? Has anyone seen such ugly opeds and comments online by Taiwanese "big mouths’’ on TV etc? Unbelievable that anyone would say that![/quote]
That’s horrible. They went to party and have a good time, trusting that the organizers had taken reasonable safety precautions. :raspberry:
Gosh, if even the foreigners can notice how stretched are the resources of the NHI at this moment. They have the excellent oxygen membrane treatment, for instance, but there are just too many patients.
Getting the Hong Kong patient was relatively easy as it is close by and the burns were not that extensive. The young teacher is in really bad shape, hope the family reaches the goal the soonest.
This will get worse. The doctors are already turning the candle at all ends and soon there will be no candle. There are simply not enough gauze, sterile solution, etc; the companies making them are currently working day and night to try to fill the quota. Medication and even skin drafts are being imported.
More and more kids are waking up now, too.
A small country like Taiwan must find it very hard pressed to handle 500 burn victims. When did Taiwan ever get hundreds of burn victims at once? Never. So it must be a struggle. I read a lot of cadaver skin has been and is being airlifted to Taiwan now.
They are doing their best.
What surprises me is the huge majority of people wishing the injured “get well soon!”. I guess they’ve never had a serious burn.
Three years ago, I got a small 2nd, maybe 3rd degree burn in my calf with the exhaust of my bike, approximately 8 cm wide and 15 cm long. Thank god, it was quite small. However, it hurt like hell, and took a little bit more than a month to stop needing regular cures because I had to regrow the skin. It took almost another month more to get a pinkish, very sensitive skin layer on top of it, which itched all the time.
These burnt people are in for the worst time of their lives. Not the burning itself, but the healing process, assuming they make it. The people with 2nd degree burns are more likely to make it, but the people with 3rd degree burns in more than 40% of their bodies are very unlikely to survive, even with skin grafts.
As for the blame, the show organization should be the ones to take most of it, and share with the park’s administration. Even the local government, for giving permits to do that party without making sure the safety procedures were in place. And these (or their insurance companies) should be the ones paying for all the medical expenses, even for the ones that need repatriation.
What amazes me is that some people even have to crowdfund the ticket to go there and be treated, and the culprits are silent and not saying a thing. Where is the annoying Taiwanese press when you ned it?
[quote=“Blaquesmith”] Even the local government, for giving permits to do that party without making sure the safety procedures were in place. And these (or their insurance companies) should be the ones paying for all the medical expenses, even for the ones that need repatriation.
What amazes me is that some people even have to crowdfund the ticket to go there and be treated, and the culprits are silent and not saying a thing. Where is the annoying Taiwanese press when you ned it?[/quote]
You are right about the government. Don’t they send someone to inspect the safety of these events? To check the existence of fire extinguishers, the product that is going to be used in the party, the number of peoples allowed, the facility safety. How can they issue a permit without checking if everything is safe? After the accident they just start prohibiting the use of this and that, but they should have tried the best to prevent it.
[quote=“tommy525”]A small country like Taiwan must find it very hard pressed to handle 500 burn victims. When did Taiwan ever get hundreds of burn victims at once? Never. So it must be a struggle. I read a lot of cadaver skin has been and is being airlifted to Taiwan now.
They are doing their best.[/quote]
I would point out Taiwan isn’t that small, with 23 million people it’s the population of Australia and has very good medical resources and expertise. However, it will indeed be a challenge to handle so many severely
Injured people at once. They have moved patients around the country to various burn centers to spread the load. Some were moved to Changrong in Taichung I heard. Well let’s hope that each individual gets the timely reatment they need. yesterday my wife told me about the boy who the father had to ask three times did he ‘want go to heaven’ because he’s as hurt so badly. The boy shook his head to indicate he want ready , but he died anyway. Man that story sucks.
Moreover, most of the hurt are college aged kids. Their families have asked to have them moved down South, closer to them, to take care of them. But some really can`t be moced because of their serious condition.
[quote=“headhonchoII”][quote=“tommy525”]A small country like Taiwan must find it very hard pressed to handle 500 burn victims. When did Taiwan ever get hundreds of burn victims at once? Never. So it must be a struggle. I read a lot of cadaver skin has been and is being airlifted to Taiwan now.
They are doing their best.[/quote]
I would point out Taiwan isn’t that small, with 23 million people it’s the population of Australia and has very good medical resources and expertise. However, it will indeed be a challenge to handle so many severely
Injured people at once. They have moved patients around the country to various burn centers to spread the load. Some were moved to Changrong in Taichung I heard. Well let’s hope that each individual gets the timely reatment they need. yesterday my wife told me about the boy who the father had to ask three times did he ‘want go to heaven’ because he’s as hurt so badly. The boy shook his head to indicate he want ready , but he died anyway. Man that story sucks.[/quote]
Yes , it is an incredibly sad sad sad tragedy that has befallen all these people. None of whom deserved this. On a scale of one to ten , this is a ten.
More so then the hundreds who died being suddenly buried in ten thousand tons of mud with Morakot. They at least went fast. But these people are now committed to EXTREME PAIN and EXTREME SUFFERING. Along with their LOVED ones.
It is a tragedy words can not fully describe.
[quote=“Blaquesmith”]
What amazes me is that some people even have to crowdfund the ticket to go there and be treated, and the culprits are silent and not saying a thing. Where is the annoying Taiwanese press when you ned it?[/quote]
Alex Haas worked for HESS. If they didn’t arrange insurance for him, they should pay for him to be repatriated.
HESS teachers, you need to be asked what is being done. I had repat insurance at Shane, back in the day, although I had to pay myself. It’s HESS’s moral responsibility to pay for this, and then pursue those liable, legally.
Docs saying now 211 critically ill with their injuries, with 30 maybe not making it. The good news I heard is that the docs are saying ''the injured are young people…
So they have higher possibility to survive…’’
having absorbed and reflecting for a few days, here’s what I have to say…
The organizer and the hosting facility put no thoughts into understanding the potential dangers of such an event. The organizers probably should have imported colored powders from companies that makes these stuff, instead of just getting colored corn starch from local sources. The hosting facility absolutely shouldn’t have converted a pool into a concert hosting arena. That is illegal. Such converted space has no evacuation space and made rescue difficult.
It is terrible that so many young people have to suffer this tragedy, and they should be helped. People should find it in their hearts to help them.
At the same time, it seems odd that it is declared a national disaster and the deployment of 7,500 million NTD worth of second reserved disaster relief fund. Especially when the 2008 Morakot typhoon and the 2014 Kaohsiung gas pipe explosion weren’t declared as national disasters and not a single dime of central government’s funding went into disaster relief for those two disasters.
After the 2008 Morakot typhoon, President Ma denied foreign assistance, and 681 people died, 18 went missing. An entire village were lost in a mud slide, their body parts were found in mud covering Kaohisung city even after a month had gone by. In the 2014 Kaohsiung gas pipe explosion, 32 people died, 321 people were severely injured, most of them were fire fighters. Neither were declared a national disaster.
For me, these 3 events should either all have been national disasters or none of them should be.
blame is being thrown here, there and everywhere, but we all know that every aspect of life on this island is fraught with danger…the hundreds of thousands of kids with no helmets, the hundreds of nightclubs over the decades where any one of them could easily have turned into a fireball with zero escape options, the dangerous roads, traffic, construction areas, the ghost money burning fire drums, the speeding trucks through kiddie zones, forklifts speeding down the roads and so on.
really, this was a freak accident by Taiwan standards, and people will continue to do the would have, could have, should have thing. lots of festivals, events, etc are put on with the same haphazard regard for safety. the WHOLE system is to blame. or maybe no-one is to blame, and terrible things sometimes happen in this world
why wasn’t there standby fire safety crew like in overseas events? (govt fault, community legislature’s fault! parents fault! I could go on…you get the point). why did party goers and organizers not insist on water sprayed too?! (attendees and party sponsors fault!) 1000 people cramped in stuffy, dusty, empty pool?!! why weren’t they handing out bottles of water like candy? and dumping water on each other? people in bikinis in middle of Taiwan summer day and no water!!! the easy part is the blame on the water park owners and people in charge of the equipment
Indeed. There should be certain precautions/steps/regulations regarding massive events, at least. For example, in the ol country, an event over X amount of people will have by law an ambulance from the Red Cross -as a matter of fact, that is how they finance themselves. An event with X+1 needs two ambulances on site, an event with X times 2 needs 4, etc. At least they will reach to you quickly.
Talking about equipment, I do have my eye on the most likely culprit of the blaze: a short circuit on the stage’s speakers caused by INEXPERIENCED -cheap- employees spraying such speakers and hence causing the short circuit that started the fire. Many witnesses have said that the workers were spraying willy nilly. But you cannot blame them. As everything else on this Island, money rules. Inexperienced, cheap workers that do not question the orders of the laoban, that is the preferred employee. The ones that do not think on their own get far. Or end up dead.
It reminds me of another recent video brouhaha: a young woman working at a gas station plugs the hose into a car. She then turns around and seems to stare into nothingness… when the hose takes a life of its own and gets off the car and sprays gas all over the place. A similar event caused a tragic fire in our latitude, and two small children were killed in the most horrific fashion. Tragedies strike in a second but the worse are usually the result of a catastrophic chain of events, not just one. In the case of the young Taiwanese lady, no one was damaged but the car’s paint job. In the other case, a spark, fear of thieves causing people to lock their cars like fortresses, and other items caused a horrible tragedy.