Mackay Hospital expects 10 more fatalities.
5th fatality. 22 year old woman with 90% burns.
Condolences to her family.
Mackay Hospital expects 10 more fatalities.[/quote]
Docs told media hush hush not for broadcast they expect 30 dead by end of month. RIP all.
I think basically anyone with 3rd degree burns to over 50pct of their bodies are most likely not going to survive.
Lesson we’ve learned? Avoid mass events in Taiwan unless you are a reporter of some kind or don’t care what happens if something goes wrong, and stay near an exit.
This is a paper on the subject.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2873368/
[quote]Background
The treatment of patients with extensive burns remains a major challenge, even with advances in burn care over recent decades [1]. Some publications [2,3] have suggested that survival rates reach 50% in young adults sustaining a Total Body Surface Area (TBSA) burned of 80% without inhalation injury. Recent U.S. data indicate a 69% mortality rate among patients with burns over 70% of TBSA [4].
Burn patients are an heterogeneous population, with wide variation in age, mechanism of injury, depth and site of burn and a different co-morbidity [5]. Attempts to provide valid and objective estimates of the risk of death following burn have a long and extensive history, yet little has changed during the time [2].
Hence it is important to identify injury- and treatment-related factors influencing survival of patients with severe burns.[/quote]
This event in particular has left me shaking my head at the response so far. So many kids injured and killed, and I’m just not seeing the root and branch safety reform that needs to be implemented. This place is still far from a developed country. I did open a thread on this very same subject a while back.
I just touched a little bit on it in my OP, but I think I had largely ignored the importance of how people think about safety.
[What is holding up Taiwan becoming a real developed country?
-[quote]Over emphasis on money , superficial emphasis on face saving rather than doing your job properly and ethically
This is a problem that runs through the educated classes, in the government especially. Many Taiwanese have been educated overseas, but when they come back they end up getting sucked back into the system. They know there are better ways to do things, but they don’t do them. They just sit there and go through the motions and wait for the pensions. Look at the mayor of Taichung as an example, he has a PhD from Cambridge and the President has a PhD from Harvard. CSB was a law professor at NTU. This doesn’t stop them being rotten or useless at their job. [/quote]
If we look through the thread, safety was only really mentioned in terms of ‘food safety’.
after many years here, i still look in disbelief as those huge crane type trucks (the ones in Terminator 3) come barreling down tiny roads jam packed with cars, scooters, bicycles, kids, old ladies pushing garbage carts, people crossing the road, etc. I find this beyond belief, almost surreal. It’s unforgivable that so many PhD’s and highly educated people have not come up with some radical solutions yet or at least attempted to back in the 90s, 2000s.
[quote=“headhonchoII”]This event in particular has left me shaking my head at the response so far. So many kids injured and killed, and I’m just not seeing the root and branch safety reform that needs to be implemented. This place is still far from a developed country. I did open a thread on this very same subject a while back.
I just touched a little bit on it in my OP, but I think I had largely ignored the importance of how people think about safety.
[What is holding up Taiwan becoming a real developed country?
-[quote]Over emphasis on money , superficial emphasis on face saving rather than doing your job properly and ethically
This is a problem that runs through the educated classes, in the government especially. Many Taiwanese have been educated overseas, but when they come back they end up getting sucked back into the system. They know there are better ways to do things, but they don’t do them. They just sit there and go through the motions and wait for the pensions. Look at the mayor of Taichung as an example, he has a PhD from Cambridge and the President has a PhD from Harvard. CSB was a law professor at NTU. This doesn’t stop them being rotten or useless at their job. [/quote]
If we look through the thread, safety was only really mentioned in terms of ‘food safety’.[/quote]
It has to do with safety awareness which is sorely lacking. They used to tell us in school, “Make it impossible for an accident to happen”, that type of foresight is very much missing. E.g. in driving they expect the other guy to look out for them, while they themselves drive recklessly.
Desperate measures: one kid had his legs amputated, in order to try to increase the odds of survival. 90% of body burned, including 4 limbs.
ettoday.net/news/20150713/53 … fb_et_news
Commonwealth magazine used the incident to attack weaknesses in the NHI but completely missed the point that ‘Prevention is better than Cure’.
english.cw.com.tw/front.do?action=index
[quote]Taiwan’s Health Care Crisis
Water Park Disaster Exposes Systemic Flaws
The huge crush of burn victims from the Formosa Fun Coast disaster has exposed long-existing problems in Taiwan’s national health insurance system. Can the incident…[/quote]
Shouldn’t it be re-worded?
[quote]Taiwan’s Lack of Safety Awareness Crisis
Water Park Disaster Exposes Systemic Flaws
The huge crush of burn victims from the Formosa Fun Coast disaster has exposed long-existing problems in Taiwan’s disaster prevention and safety processes. Can the incident…
[/quote]
All this within a year of the Kaoshiung explosions and two aircrashes. Seems there’s a giant gap in locals brains on this subject.
All over the news today; the families of the burn victims are demanding the government pay all medical fees and aftercare once they’re out of hospital. Lots of sobbing and wailing on TV, but it’s being met with a backlash on in other media and on Facebook with accusations of unfairness, as Kaoxiong gas explosion got little to no financial aid.
Maybe someone with better Chinese could chime in with more detail? Ive seen several posts about it from Taiwanese friends on FB, and it seems to be causing a a bit of a north / south divide.
Obviously the Ktown gas victims need the same financial and other assistance, as also required by the families of these unfortunate victims.
The water park should be taken over by the govt as compensation for govt assistance. Operated by the govt and all profits go to the govt.
[quote=“tommy525”]Obviously the Ktown gas victims need the same financial and other assistance, as also required by the families of these unfortunate victims.
The water park should be taken over by the govt as compensation for govt assistance. Operated by the govt and all profits go to the govt.[/quote]
Come on Tomster…you know if the govt. took it over it’d make an immediate loss…
Yesterday my girfriend was complaining about that; she was calling it on selfishness, and although I don’t totally agree, I see her point. According to her, they claim that the government has to take “responsability” for what has happened, cover all the medical bills during the time in the hospital, and also after it (forever), because what happened was so bad and it happened to “poor people” (that’s what they claim to be). My gf argues that she is poor because she wouldn’t ever pay the ticket (1,500) for such an event, and that in the end this is not her fault. My gf also points out that the spokewomen of this group (a couple of mothers of these kids), one of them lives in Tianmu (a good area, much better than where we live), and the other one in the most expensive complex in Taichung. It doesn’t really like they are poor, all things considered…
My posture: I come from a country where most likely most of the medical costs would be covered by the public health insurance system, so I like the idea of the public money covering these costs, BUT I don’t like the idea of making an exception with these poor guys because it is unfair for all the other people who 1) are the same or more fucked up and 2) their case is just not popular so they will receive no help whatsoever, and no social suppport, no nothing.
Basically, why should these people receive an special economical favor from the government, when there are many other cases of people who the system forsakes? beacuse the popularity of the case? because we saw how happy people having fun ended up wrecked? because the case had a lot more of visibility than many others? because this group of people and their case have more influence on the media and they use it? What do we do with the people who can not even afford those 1,500 NT for a crappy concert or any other amusement?
The case reminds me a lot of M13’s accident; yeah, I felt pity for him, and I felt bad. But then he was in a very priviledged situation: because he’s an english teacher in Taiwan he’s making much money than the ordinary Taiwanese citizen; because he’s a famous youtuber, he has some steady source of income every month; because he’s famous he would receive a lot of support from here and there. He could even monetize the accident! But then the guy decided to show himself like in a desperate economical situation, asking directly for economical support. And although I sent him some money, I was thinking of all the people that have an accident and we don’t help ebcause they are not famous, popular, or whatever. Even further. I’m poorer than him, and helping him in this fucked up situation, but if I ever see myself in similar conditions, I am going to receive ZERO support from annonymous people, internet, etc…
So… are fair these campaigns? the answer is very simple: NO. Is the system fair or good? there’s a lot of room for improvement, and I’d like it to be much better. But… instead of fixing it, what these people are doing is to look after their own, punctual interest. And not others.
I would like to see them in a better situation, but NOT MORE than any other citizen of this country who suffers from chronical dissease, severe injuries, or similar. Not more. Do you guys think that these people, because were having fun and now they are all over the news totally fucked up, deserve more than the annonymous Wang who, I don’t know, suffers from burns from some other explosion? just because it’s not on the news? or because parties are cool, to be young is cool, and we sympathise more with that image than with a, I don’t know, a fisherman who wrecks his legs in an accident fishing?
The thing is that they are setting up a separate fund with donations and such. That is being held hostage by the Government, which within there are certain individuals that have made it as hard as possible for families to organize, contact each other and collaborate on any class action or joint petition. While the gummit has a contact list, for instance, the families’ representatives have gone hospital by hospital gathering the information one by one.
The separate fund has been set because the burden on NHI is such it could topple it over. And as said, this is just getting started.
We can complain about the gummit’s lack of action and support in Kaohsiung, for instance, taking into consideration that the accident was a direct result of government mistakes, lack of supervision, lack of accurate records, etc. in summary, the usual inaction chabudoism masking protecting special interests, which endangered the whole population. But then a lot can be said also about nuclear power plants, electricity facilities, etc. belonging to the gummit, not to get started on certain private enterprises with special privileges.
The bottom line is that this accident, while also under the responsibility of the gummit because lack of legislation and enforcement of safety codes and also because it is protecting its own -on which I won’t elaborate, just leave it there. But mostly, because it is toothless in getting any kind of compensation or resemblance of justice from the ones directly responsible. Not a cent. People already feel deep anger over such injustices in the past -the Hong cadet incident, the Miaoli evictions, etc- and adding to the pile is pushing the pot past the boiling point.
So all assistance given is just a patch to prevent a bigger explosion.
Just read this - “Taiwan water park event managers allegedly transfer properties to avoid compensation”
http://www.whatsonxiamen.com/news39373.html
That’s sick.
The owners have repeatedly stated that they are not responsible because all they did is rent the place to the activity. Disgusting.
The ball is being thrown between lawyers. As we say in Spanish, from one hand to another, an elephant went missing. Bottom line is no penalties will be applicable.
A 35-year-old woman became the sixth fatal victim, her 31 year old brother is in critical condition, very sad.
The officials of New Taipei City have been claiming that they were not aware of this event taking place at the water park. However, according to leaked documents by ab insider, NTpC officials had known about the event taking place, and is by law required to come up with a safety contingency plan for each mass event.
The new regulation which became active on January 3rd of this year, called Public Safety Management White paper (公共安全管理白皮書), and corresponding regulation Mass Event Safety Management regulation (大型活動安全管理), requires the city government to prepare a safety contingency plan for any mass public events held at New Taipei City.
Well, NTpC didn’t write one. By not preparing a safety contingency plan, NTpC failed to follow regulations, thus should also be held accountable for the accident.
Plus, just 9 days before the explosion, NTpC government sent 7 officials from tourism bureau, sports division, fire department, health and sanitation department to participate in Formosa Fun Coast’s emergency drill. There is no way that NTpC were unaware of a massive event taking place just 9 days later, especially one that had been running ads all over television.
The newest come back from NTpC is that Formosa Fun Coast did not file an application for the color concert event, thus NTpC is not responsible.