Original Title: NY City thanks God for Republican Mayors
New Yorkers savor two Republican mayors and their crime fighting successes. Why not for all the big cities of America?
nypost.com/postopinion/editorial/37224.htm
[quote]If Mayor Bloomberg’s announcement this month about the city’s record-low crime rate sounded like d
Only Fred could actually manage to try and credit republicans mayor for reducing crime, but totally ignore the people who have actually reduced the crime, ie the NYPD.
Fred, the bias is getting a little pathetic do you not think. 
[quote=“Traveller”]Only Fred could actually manage to try and credit republicans mayor for reducing crime, but totally ignore the people who have actually reduced the crime, ie the NYPD.
Fred, the bias is getting a little pathetic do you not think. [/quote]
That post illustrates a profound ignorance. But, it isn’t a surprize.
NYPD is Republican.
[quote=“Tigerman”][quote=“Traveller”]Only Fred could actually manage to try and credit republicans mayor for reducing crime, but totally ignore the people who have actually reduced the crime, ie the NYPD.
Fred, the bias is getting a little pathetic do you not think. [/quote]
That post illustrates a profound ignorance. But, it isn’t a surprize.[/quote]
TM, not at all, but yours does. Whilst the general policy might be taken at a mayoral level, though most will be taken at a lower level, the actual work in improving crime rates, is done by the guys on the ground, not some fat cat republican shining his arse on the seat.
But i suppose your comments are fitting seeing as they come from another fat cat republican shining his arse on the seat 
Actually the police force credit Giuliani’s no tolerance policies and broken window approach to the problem with lowering crime. Nice try but if the police are for Giuliani and his policies, what else do you have left to say?
[quote]Mr Giuliani was returned to office after a landslide victory in January 1998. The former lawyer and state prosecutor has been credited with turning around a city that once seemed ungovernable, particularly in regard to crime.
Overall crime rates have dropped by an astonishing 44% to their lowest in more than a generation, and the city’s murder rate is down by 70%. [/quote]
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/388758.stm
[quote]POLICE OFFICERS ENDORSE BUSH; NEWS MEDIA REMAIN SILENT by Jim Kouri, CPP
The nation’s largest police union, the Fraternal Order of Police, announced in September that they enthusiastically endorse President George W. Bush for reelection. More than 300,000 police officers are members of the FOP. In addition, other police unions including New York City police organizations endorse President Bush. Most recently, the NYPD’s Sergeants Benevolent Association added their wholehearted endorsement of our Commander-in-Chief. [/quote]
Fred, did i say the police were not for the policies, or that they disapproved of them, no i did not, it seems that TM role as main obfuscator has been taken up by yourself. What i was complaining of was all the credit being given to the man who possibly thought up the policy, but more likely just approved someone elses idea, but gave no credit to where it was really deserved.
Traveller,
Fat cat Republican? Giuliani has blue collar roots big-time!!! He definitely isn
Since Traveller is back pedaling as fast as he can, I will allow him this opportunity to relent to my point gracefully as graciously as I can.
Fred, on what am i back peddling, nothing.
So my description of Giuliani as a fat cat republican might be wrong, but it was said tongue in cheek, but it does not alter my issue with the original post, giving all the credit to one man and not where it belonged, something you still feel needs no recognition.
Actually Fred, you should be thanking the crime DB, the former police commissioner and the strong economy.
NYC has been declared the safest US city with a population over a million. The mayors deserve their share of credit.
Violent crime has been decreasing in the US since 1995 or so. That was when the criminals realized the Republicans were going to take over.
Property crime has been decreasing since 1975 or so. Give credit to President Ford.
I think that the statistic being cited seems to say that New York City is a safe place. The safety in New York might be best of the nine cities with population over one million, but actually of the 210 cities reporting with populations greater than 100,000, New York City was ranked 194th. New York is still a scary place to live.
Mayor Rudy Giuliani along with others had a ready explanation for crime, their implementation of strategies based upon the so-called “Broken Windows” theory. They reason that even such minor public incivilities as drinking in the street, spray-painting graffiti, and breaking windows can escalate into predatory crime. Recently some research has been done regarding this, and they found that “research does not support broken windows, well-known theory on roots of crime, but instead pinpoints concentrated poverty and collective efficacy as primary indicators of crime”. (Collective efficacy - the degree to which residents perceive their neighborhood to be “cohesive” or “tight-knit”. A place with high collective efficacy will have few kids left alone, the people will be more likely to call the police or ambulance if they see something happen to someone from that community, etc.) See New York Times on the $50 million research study headed by Professor Felton Earls of Harvard, free subscription required.
[quote=“fred smith”]
Remember crime disproportionately affects the poor. With lower crime, housing becomes more affordable since people can “dare” to live in bad neighborhoods again and businesses can be opened in such areas.[/quote]
Are you actually saying the housing is affordable in New York? According to studies, getting rid of places where people can live in poverty is going to get rid of the crime. So, you should make it ludicrously expensive to live in a place like New York and all the crime will go away. Are you trying to say that New York has become more affordable in the past few years? Is it likely that property values or the cost of living in New York will go down? From what I’ve heard, it is very expensive to live in New York. Usually low rent is a reason for people to endure a high crime area, and low crime rates will actually lead to an increase in the cost of living.
From Wikipedia:
Thus, while you can say that it’s actually the Mayor who is responsible for the drop in crime, his theory for reducing crime has recently been shown to be a weak theory, and actually the drop in crime should be attributed to a computer system. In addition, New York City, though it has reduced crime considerably in the past decade, is still a dangerous place to live compared with most other populated areas in the US.
From Twocs:
so it was much better to have flight to the suburbs, businesses leaving the city and increased crime which drove out even more investment and citizens because this made the city more “affordable” for poor people!!! Is this a perfect example of leftist thinking or what? It also meant that NYC was broke, bankrupt and therefore unable to pay for social services!!!
Oh okay Twocs:
It is all a computer system that was implemented as part of the mayor’s broken window approach to solving crime which you say didn’t work. Oh okay then. The 70 percent drop in crime was really really coincidental and just happened to be timed with a Republican mayor who implemented these policies. Oh and NYC is “still” dangerous so we should not be so cocky about the 70 percent drop in crime. Okay, tell that to the citizens of NYC!!! :bravo: :bravo: :bravo:
Fred,
Your pathetic attempts to manipulate statistics once again to give conservative Republican policies credit for nearly everything under the sun – including annual days of sunshine – are so transparent that only a fool would give them credence.
Furthermore, anyone with even an ounce of sense would know that demographic trends are by far the most important factor in the reduction of crime rates in the United States.
And furthermore . . .
Wound up good and tight now, I hope.
Now the punchline:
Actually I agree with you. All evidence I’ve seen supports the conclusion that tough-minded realism on the part of Guiliani and the NY DA’s office directly caused the sharp reduction in crime and has made NY a relatively safe city to live in and visit.
[quote=“fred smith”]From Twocs:
so it was much better to have flight to the suburbs, businesses leaving the city and increased crime which drove out even more investment and citizens because this made the city more “affordable” for poor people!!! Is this a perfect example of leftist thinking or what? It also meant that NYC was broke, bankrupt and therefore unable to pay for social services!!!
[/quote]
Who said that? Are you trying to read my mind, and if so you’re not doing a good job of it. Do you have any real source that claims that New York has ever become more affordable for anyone?
In actuality, the crime rate went down because the computer made the police department absolutely more effective, and also poor people were forced to leave New York or become one of the city’s enormous population of 40,000 homeless people. Mayor Giuliano was often criticized for his heartless approach to crime, in which poor people and the homeless were persecuted mercilessly because he believed the invalid theory that police cracking down on them would prevent crime.
Twocs wrote:
[quote]Who said that? Are you trying to read my mind, and if so you’re not doing a good job of it. Do you have any real source that claims that New York has ever become more affordable for anyone?
In actuality, the crime rate went down because the computer made the police department absolutely more effective, and also poor people were forced to leave New York or become one of the city’s enormous population of 40,000 homeless people. Mayor Giuliano was often criticized for his heartless approach to crime, in which poor people and the homeless were persecuted mercilessly because he believed the invalid theory that police cracking down on them would prevent crime.[/quote]
I was not claiming that New York was becoming more affordable, I was claiming that neighborhoods (usually cheap ones like in Brooklyn and Inman Heights etc) have become livable. That is because of reduced crime. What really are you suggesting then? That we do not reduce crime so neighborhoods are not infiltrated by middle class home owners since this might drive poor people out?
Giuliani was often criticized for his crackdowns and yes they were called heartless by the liberal press and mindless brigade but in reality what really happened. He cracked down on the 10 percent who were causing all the trouble and 90 percent of the people minus the liberals who claim to be looking out for people’s rights (first and foremost the criminals) approved wholeheartedly.
[quote=“fred smith”]
Giuliani was often criticized for his crackdowns and yes they were called heartless by the liberal press and mindless brigade but in reality what really happened. He cracked down on the 10 percent who were causing all the trouble and 90 percent of the people minus the liberals who claim to be looking out for people’s rights (first and foremost the criminals) approved wholeheartedly.[/quote]
And research showed did not actually reduce the crime.
Actually I beleive there was an article a few years ago about COMPSTAT and how some “crime” were re-catagorized or not file in certain categories to give to persception of high visibility crime like murder and grand theft auto were not tally correctly in the city.
Twocs:
You and you alone can look to your glorious computer system as the reason why New York City is safer today. Nice try. Try telling that to anyone who LIVES in or VISITS the city regularly. These efforts to discount Giuliani’s justifiably celebrated record are pathetic. Even with this computer system, the enforcement still must be in place and we had 20 years of liberal, feel-good, poor childhood, bad upbringing kind of excuses to bring the city to its knees. I suppose we will just have to put Giuliani’s success to some random event just like Libya’s volte face regarding wmds was some kind of miraculous coincidence after 30 years of “negotiations.”