What makes them hellish? The person I knew didn’t go into details but said that they were climbing the walls…Well that can mean a lot of things for a lot of people…AJ what’s been your take/experience on it all…
Obviously not. I, for example, am still as pure and unsullied as the driven snow.
Well, the cheapness and half-arsery that constitutes the Taiwanese Business Model is the main problem. They want stuff done quickly and cheaply with little concern for the quality. They are often too cheap to pay for things to be proofread and they don’t care if information is factually correct. They are always in a hurry - no time to test things or get feedback before publication. The worst thing is when your English is Chinglified by a non-native speaking ‘superior.’ I could go on but would rather not work up a thirst.
Err that gave me a flashback that I didn’t need…thanks. I get it. 
Sandman, I’m not sure of what “contract subber” means. Is this a contract worker, a freelancer? Or is this someone who works as a substitute to someone who works for a contract? The phrase is new to me. The job that I linked to, as far as I can see, is for a full-time writing/editing job.
Look, people routinely post on this site about looking for non-teaching jobs. Some people want to work in publishing and there aren’t always jobs available. Well, here one is (and you don’t have to go to a dinner party to find it).
(Please don’t assume that everyone one writes about themselves. I’m not looking to apply for this job.)
Agreed. I was asked to help a businessman who was taking university classes to proofread his thesis. He assured me it would be easy, as his wife who speaks good English had helped him write and proofread it.
Fortunately for me, I asked to look it over first before discussing the price. What a mess! It was not just a matter of correcting his spelling like he said, but it required a whole rewrite. Each sentence required me to ask him his meaning. When I told him how much it would cost, and believe me my rates were pretty low, he said he would get someone else cheaper.
I told him in a face saving way to go for it.
A contract subeditor. A year’s contract as a copyboy. Mind-numbing, boring, repetitive drudgery of the worst kind. Real bottom of the barrel stuff. As almas points out, its a possibility for a broken English teacher who simply cannot stomach another day in the classroom maybe, but that’s about all. A complete go-nowhere job without even the attraction of a decent wage. And it WON’T set you on the path to riches in the “publishing world.” For example, try using time as a subber at one of those magazines as part of a “two years’ relevant experience” for, say, an editing job on one of the English rags (no great step up, there, I know, but even so) they won’t recognize that kind of job as “relevant experience.”
I’d advise anyone to avoid getting caught up in the Taiwanese ESL publication business unless you have a passion for ESL materials – its even worse than the buxiban caper.
Thank you for the clarification of the term, sandman.
Jenny, it’s work, and it keeps you on your toes…don’t listen to those old timer ogres. 
Sandy Man, of course one can make strides in the publishing world by taking on editorial and writing work in Taiwan as a stepping stone. There will ALWAYS be work developing content in local publishing in Taiwan, Japan, S. Korea, Brazil, Spain, Saudi Arabia, etc etc, because the markets clamour for custom publications which cater directly to local EFL needs. It doesn’t matter how good or bad it is because a teacher adapts it to his or her needs. And students love them.
Btw, the best ‘writers’ do not actually ‘write’ materials – their editors farm it out to freelancers. Those freelance jobs for international pubs are the best gigs in publishing. You make your own schedule, work in your PJs, and crank out copy that’s credited to flamboyant, rich, old Kiwi linguists. Not you, Almas John. 
Great to hear from you! Hope you said “hi” to Max for me, although she’s probably forgotten me, I know. Some great Peak District shots, too.
I’m sure one “can,” but you’re basically the only person I know who “has.” 
The rest have been driven up the wall.
There’s one other woman on here who parleyed it into a sweet gig in Oxford, too, but her Taipei work was in a MUCH higher echelon than those magazine things.
Alien! Ha, I almost used you as an example in this thread.
Nah, don’t worry about me. I’ve avoided getting into discussion here with Sandman. It’s just not worth it.
You know what they say. Can’t stand the heat… That’s cool.
Soooo…basically, publishing/writing/editing is another no-go?
Seems if you’re a long-termer tired of teaching, a tea shop is the only way to go. :ohreally:
Not at all. But working for one of them crappy local Englishee teaching mags is not one of the best ways to go about it.
The tea shop thing would be a lot less work, though.
Long time, no post! Welcome back.
Nope, coffee shop, restaurant, bar, export/import, … the sky is the limit. 
In summary, when there is a will, there is a way. And yes, the PWE world is a bit dissapointing, as money making rules over knowledge sharing.
Look, writing as a career is like acting, and as the saying goes, there are no small rolls, only small players. You need to stay working in the field at any capacity so that when your number is called you have something to show that proves you are serious.
What launches you into a good writing career are contacts and a break. I’ve gone from writing for English Digest to the Wall Street Journal in the space of a few years. I’m not any better a writer now than before; I just got lucky. It’s as simple as that. Because here’s the truth: despite having a damn good portfolio at the moment, I haven’t been able to secure a single extra freelance contract without contacts.
It is possible to move up the ladder here but probably not if your only interest in a writing job is to get out of teaching. Do a good job no matter what, be committed, never give in to cynicism and you have a chance of being noticed when the time comes to make a little step forward.
Jenny, I’d love to have you and Sandy BOTH in a room together some day. MY living room, in fact. I keep missing you when you’re in town, woman! Sandy, Pumpkin has become dim and slow and she rubs her butt on the sofa, pukes, and bites her paw when I pet her back…she’s not the ‘top’ cat anymore. There’s a new kid in town. Sunny.
No, but it’s true. If you’re creative enough, and if you have the skills that come from comprehensive and sound pedagogy in language acquisition, you can hone your skills through those crappy local publications. You could actually improve them, if you’re insistent about it. But I wouldn’t suggest just sticking with those forever if you want a career. Try your hand out with international pubs who are always looking for freelancers and fresh ideas to commission. Jenny, PM me, or better yet, email me at work.
The only reason I popped on here was to see about that Taiwanese Susan Boyle-fellow that Flicka posted on Facebook. Then I saw Jenny had written in the Women’s forum, and followed her postings to this kerfuffle with Sandman. I had to step in. :roflmao:
Yep, being a good writer with a unique voice (e.g. a high-strung Canadian outdoorsman) is a basic requirement, not a guarantee of success. A lot of it is about contacts, and the venerable MM writes. And there’s so much crap out there (see “Books about Doing Business in China” for several prominent examples), it’s obvious that the writing business often isn’t about being a good writer.
Here’s one for the funny files–I once got a writing job with a prominent travel magazine because the editor in chief mistook me for someone famous–I use a nom to plume when I write professionally, and I hadn’t realized that mine was the same as that of a famous writer :roflmao:. Once she found out I wasn’t the actual famous guy, she gave me a shot anyway. She had a deadline.
I wish I had time to develop my contacts in the biz. I’m too damned busy yapping at corporate managers these days to work on my writing “career.”
Rolls? Oh, “roles.” 
Youse gotta stay away from that Canadian tobacco.
That saying reminds me of an anecdote about Olivier in Charlton Heston’s autobiography, “In the Arena.”
Sir Lawrence Olivier was once approached about doing a small role in Zeffirelli’s “Romeo and Juliet.” He listened to a minute or two of fawning blandishment, then cut in: “No, I’m afraid not.”
There was stunned astonishment. “But, it would be such a distinguished contribution. Why not? “Because,” said Olivier, “I’m too fucking grand.”
…
As for moving up ladders my friend, sure seems a lot easier to land on a bloody snake.
Alien, good to hear from ya.
Bismarck, I’ve got an idea for you. Do you want me to post it here or send it as a PM?
Tomas, you gave me a terrible shock with your “venerable MM” - for a second I thought I’d have to visit the local STD clinic.