Have you moved back to Canada? Please share your experience

[quote=“headhonchoII”]You’ve made me point out the obvious flaw in your reasoning (once) again, that you need to abandon your original citizenship to get Taiwanese citizenship AND you need to serve in the army if a male of a certain age. Therefore getting Taiwanese citizenship is next to impossible for most long term residents here.

Well do carry on :slight_smile:.[/quote]

You’re either incredibly stupid or a piss poor reader. As stated above, I said my family is getting Canadian citizenship in a few weeks and it took pretty much 7 years from the time in Taipei they applied for PR (6 years if you count the time they arrived in Canada) to the ceremony. I then said that in comparison Taiwan’s system in terms of its naturalization period or its application process is relatively easy. It is.

As you mention, the one bad thing about naturalization in Taiwan that foreigners frequently criticize is the requirement that they renounce their original citizenship (although they can get it back) or serving in the military (exempt if you’r in your late 30s).

Me thinks they protest too much :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: After all, a lot of European countries such as Germany, Lithuania, and the Netherlands either forbid double citizenship or they make it virtually impossible to achieve it. Likewise, a lot of these same developed nations have very difficult tests (e.g., Canada, Netherlands etc.) that test social knowledge as well as language. You don’t pass? No citizenship and you may even have to reapply and have the processing time period start again. There is one celebrated example where one immigrant woman was unable to get citizenship for like two decades.

In other words, Taiwan’s system is about the same as most countries in North America or Europe. More liberal in some regards (e.g., way quicker processing, residence period requirements before naturalization can begin) and maybe more conservative than some in others (military service as you mention or no double citizenship until after becoming Taiwanese). My point is that some European nations completely forbid double citizenship (even after you gain their nation’s citizenship) and have much longer residence requirement times.

Would love your balanced commentary! :laughing: Do you really think Taiwan’s system is much worse than others?

You keep listing the exceptions such as Germany while most developed countries have no such rule. It is not about the same.

You also forget to mention the discriminatory aspect of Taiwan’s law (local born citizens can hold dual citizenship).

You also forget to mention overseas Chinese get priority or automatic citizenship or ID in most cases and that Chinese are not considered foreigners anymore (even though they mostly can’t work or immigrate here …yes it’s a bizarre country Taiwan…and citizenship
Is still handed out along racial lines…similar to the ‘whites first’ policy in Australia of years past).

Taiwan has fairly relaxed immigration and residency laws but very outdated and unfair citizenship regulations.

I’m not saying that Canada is perfect either, since they seem to place many work or health restrictions on immigrants.

It’s not just Germany, it’s also Andorra, Monaco, Norway, Sweden etc. These, especially Norway, are some of the wealthiest countries in the world are they not?

I don’t think it is discriminatory at all. Local born citizens have ROC citizenship at birth. A foreigner that obtains ROC citizenship (by giving up his citizenship) can get it back and then hold dual like ROC citizens can. It’s not nearly as good as countries that allow dual (which is preferable I agree) but it isn’t as bad as some European and Asian countries (Japan comes to mind as well) that forbid dual.

[quote]You also forget to mention overseas Chinese get priority or automatic citizenship or ID in most cases and that Chinese are not considered foreigners anymore (even though they mostly can’t work or immigrate here …yes it’s a bizarre country Taiwan…and citizenship
Is still handed out along racial lines). [/quote]
I agree. I don’t think it’s optimal. Never have. I too have problem with citizenship based on blood. What I have said all along is that Taiwan has some liberal laws in naturalization (time and efficiency in processing) and some conservative laws (military service requirement and renouncing citizenship). This puts it in league with a good number of developed countries.

I don’t think we’re too far apart here. :laughing:

Belgium did trump it all … my wife and many others got nationality without ever having lived in the country. After 3 years of marriage and having lived at the same address as a couple anywhere in the world you were up for application. She knows almost nothing about the history, all she knows is that Belgium is cold in winter, has good waffles, chocolate and beer, that it has a king, … and probably some other things … doesn’t speak either language.
Sadly (or luckily) they abandoned this procedure due to misuse from mostly people with North African background.
Procedure:
Fill out an application, write a letter why you wanted to become a Belgian national, birth certificate, proof of good behavior and marriage certificate, pay money, wait for about a year and viola … it’s called fast track to Belgian Nationality.

Responses to dumb posts were sent from my Nexus 7, I hate Apple BTW, with Tapatalk 8

It used to be like that in Ireland too, same reason why it was changed (except influx was more from Nigeria).
Anyway…Ireland just handed out 1000s of passports to new citizens, waiting period 5-10 years, no restrictions on new citizens rights and no requirements to give up original citizenship. I also have relatives in the US who have got citizenship within a relatively short-time…me no time soon…because the rules are simply too difficult to work through.

No I am not willing to rescind my citizenship, it would cause me a massive amount of trouble and worry and I don’t see why I should need to do it anyway when it doesn’t apply to native born citizens.

There have also been some cases recently where individuals have been made STATELESS after gaining ROC citizenship, by the use of vindictive and out-dated conditions applied retroactively. You see all citizens are not made the same it seems. Who would gladly give up their original citizenship for this?

michaelturton.blogspot.com/2013/ … ss-in.html
taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/ … 2003531969

I know this is slightly OT, but not really due to the ongoing discussion of dual citizenship, I noticed that Canadians can apply to resume their citizenship but it is not really worth it. The person would need to apply for PR first and live in Canada for one year before they could even start the citizenship application process. And that is the problem, qualifying for PR. I did the questionnaire just for fun, and they are only looking for certain industries and trades, so my skill in business was not something they are looking for, so the questionnaire suggested that I can only apply for the travel for one year visa. So no way in hell am I giving up my Canadian citizenship for a Taiwanese one, so not worth it just for some small added benefits like voting. Even the pensions are being addressed for permanent residents now by the government so the benefit gap is closing. But they really need to change that unfair double standard of dual citizenship for them and not for immigrants.

If you’re born Canadian, after renouncing, you would just need one year of residence and then 2-3 years of likely processing, meaning it would require three to four years of actually being in Canada to re-obtain it. You wouldn’t have to apply for an investor or special industry/trade type of PR because you were originally born in Canada and are automatically entitled to citizenship (even after giving it up). But you would have to go through the process of getting PR through birthright and then putting in a year of residence plus the application time.

Taiwan’s system is not really that unfair, although it’s not ideal. I prefer countries that offer the dual citizenship option, but lots of European countries and Asian countries have it. It’s not like Taiwan is unique by having such laws.

On the topic of pensions, I think that new 6% measure, while being positive, is not extraordinary or really all that comprehensive. At the end of the day, the pension in Taiwan that foreigners/PRs are now entitled to is a defined contribution pension scheme (not all that good).

I’m going to check this tomorrow with Immigration Canada. I am pretty sure they told me that I would be considered just like an immigrant off the street with no extra benefits. I’ll check back in with the answer.

Taiwan may not be the only one with these crappy laws regarding naturalization but I bet they would be crying the blues if Canada decided to make it reciprocal (which obviously won’t happen since Canada doesn’t play childish games)