if you miss one day of work?
if you get seriously sick/injured and miss a few days of work?
if you want to go on vacation?
my boss is trying to put in a clause in a contract that states i would have to pay ‘x’ amount of NT for each hour missed. some days i have up to 8 class hours, and in signing this contract, if i miss one thursday, id lose about 1/6 of my monthly wage. absolutely ridiculous, but i do realize employers face penalties when they take contracts from outside schools, businesses, etc., when the teacher doesnt show up. i also realize they would have to pay to find a substitute.
i dont know what to do, or what a compromise would look like. any help would be appreciated. thanks
This is not reasonable, nor is it a common practice.
Whether you want to bend over and take it depends on your circumstances.
How is the rest of the deal? A good rule of thumb in judging a contract is the day on which the payday falls. If you get paid on the 5th of the following month or earlier, then it is okay. Getting paid monthly on the 10th is a bit crappy. Getting paid later than the 10th is a huge warning sign.
sign nothing now, but instead bluster, postpone, try and get more contra-deals inserted in your contract, ask to see it translated correctly with approval from a notary public, say you left your favourite contract-signing pen at home, go to the wrong room, etc, and simultaneously look for another job.
don’t refuse point-blank to sign, as you’ll get chopped then and there for refusing to work.
then, when you have a contract with another employer, get fired (if you have a firing severance pay deal) or just walk away the minute you see the money in your account.
if you miss one day of work?
if you get seriously sick/injured and miss a few days of work?
if you want to go on vacation?
[/quote]
Yes. But you aren’t required to find a sub–that’s management’s job.
You get a 1/2 day’s worth of pay for sick leave. But you aren’t required to find a sub–that’s management’s job…
Yes, if you have worked there for less than a year, but you get 7 paid days leave if you have worked for over a year. But you aren’t required to find a sub–that’s management’s job.
BTW, is your sub someone who works at the same school? If not, your boss is breaking the law.
Are you working without a work permit? Why are you doing that?
thanks for the help, everyone. ive been working hard at stalling for as long as possible while getting as much information as i can. ive also received close to 20 emails and a half dozen phone calls for job offers in the last three weeks; but, ive been with the school im currently at for over a year now, and i like it. its comfortable. thats where the conflict is.
ive never heard the, ‘7 days paid leave after working at the same school for a year,’ thing before, either.
It’s Taiwanese labour law, but I think teaching contracts are usually structured so that it doesn’t apply – you’re an hourly consultant or something like that.
[quote=“Flicka”][quote=“craigzy”]or pay out of your own pocket:
if you miss one day of work?
if you get seriously sick/injured and miss a few days of work?
if you want to go on vacation?
[/quote]
Yes. But you aren’t required to find a sub–that’s management’s job.
You get a 1/2 day’s worth of pay for sick leave. But you aren’t required to find a sub–that’s management’s job…
Yes, if you have worked there for less than a year, but you get 7 paid days leave if you have worked for over a year. But you aren’t required to find a sub–that’s management’s job.
BTW, is your sub someone who works at the same school? If not, your boss is breaking the law.
Are you working without a work permit? Why are you doing that?[/quote]
its a very small buxiban with only one full-time foreign teacher (me), and a couple others that work only a few hours a week. im not working without a permit; ive got my arc and everything is clean.
i want to compromise with my boss, but without whipping out 40 pages of the labor standards and employment standards acts. they would, like many bosses here, instantly turn into an angry/defensive mode and freak the fuck out.
This is exactly the warning you need. GET OUT NOW! It will not get better regardless of how good a teacher you are. This school has no clue as to how to treat you and are making up rules that just “sound good” If you sign, I guarantee you that you will leave without all your money at some point. Recognize it now and cut your losses. If you are a good teacher, there are many many good schools out there who will recognise your abilities and treat you accordingly. For a list, check around. PM me. I know of a few.
[quote=“craigzy”]its a very small buxiban with only one full-time foreign teacher (me), and a couple others that work only a few hours a week. im not working without a permit; ive got my arc and everything is clean.
I want to compromise with my boss, but without whipping out 40 pages of the labor standards and employment standards acts. they would, like many bosses here, instantly turn into an angry/defensive mode and freak the fuck out.[/quote]Craig, I don’t really see what compromise is possible here. There’s no way you should be required to actually pay the boss money to compensate for a sick day. Opinions seem to vary on whether or not hourly paid teachers are entitled to sick pay, but money definitely shouldn’t be going the other way!
As for vacation time, again it probably won’t be paid, but you shouldn’t have to compensate the boss for that. And while it’s nice if you can help to find a suitable sub, that’s not really your responsibility.
If I were you I’d be thinking seriously about those other job offers you had.
wow, now im kinda freaking out. i didnt realize how deep my ignorance of this subject was.
ive had health problems in the past, and i believe thats where this clause in the contract stems from. the buxiban is part of a larger company that gets outside contracts from universities, businesses, hospitals, etc., for foreign teachers. if the foreign teacher doesnt show up, the company may impose fines or rip up the contract. my boss is simply trying to cover their bases if i wind up in a hospital bed instead of the hospitals classroom. though, the likelihood of me getting sick again is slim.
Wow… having read quite a bit on here to try to understand Taiwan (of which I’m ashamed to say I have no clue about as I’ve never lived there before - only was born and left after 8mths old), you guys are making it sound like all Taiwan bosses are unscrupulous and crooks… why do y’all continue to work there then?! <— rhetoric question
Why do you say that? From what I read here, they’re talking about precisely ONE Taiwanese boss, and nearly ALL the replies are suggesting that the poster simply take a job with a different company, presumably one whose boss is less slimy.
I’m on hourly wage and I get 2 weeks paid holiday per year (the first year was only 7 days). I don’t get paid for sick days but I sure don’t have to pay, either. Like joesax said, it’s one thing not to get paid when missing work, but it’s a whole other story having to pay. My contract does, however, stipulate that if I request to go on holiday, or if I can not go to work one day, it is expected of me to help find a sub. No penalties if I fail, though, as ultimately, the responsibility falls on management. They just basically hope that I will help them find a sub and they include that in the contract.
You explained that you think your employer wants to add this “thing” in your contract because you’ve been sick in the past. If you like the school, you might be able to salvage this situation by just sitting down with your boss and reassuring him/her that you were really sick and that this should not be seen as a lack of dependability on your part. Ask your boss what happens if you get into a traffic accident, for example, and explain how you don’t think that you should have to compensate the school in addition to being injured and unable to generate an income.
This is a trust issue, I’m afraid. The school doesn’t trust you to be dependable. If you don’t want that in your contract and you still want to work there, you have to convince them that they can count on you.
[quote=“marboulette”]You explained that you think your employer wants to add this “thing” in your contract because you’ve been sick in the past. If you like the school, you might be able to salvage this situation by just sitting down with your boss and reassuring him/her that you were really sick and that this should not be seen as a lack of dependability on your part. Ask your boss what happens if you get into a traffic accident, for example, and explain how you don’t think that you should have to compensate the school in addition to being injured and unable to generate an income.
This is a trust issue, I’m afraid. The school doesn’t trust you to be dependable. If you don’t want that in your contract and you still want to work there, you have to convince them that they can count on you.
marboulette[/quote]
i agree with you wholeheartedly, and i plan on having that sit down tomorrow (if we all have work). although, sometimes sitting down and using western logic with my boss is absolutely pointless. their phd is in engineering, but i swear they deserve a honorary doctorate in sophistry.
we shall see. thanks to all, and ill let you folks know how it turns out.
Why do you say that? From what I read here, they’re talking about precisely ONE Taiwanese boss, and nearly ALL the replies are suggesting that the poster simply take a job with a different company, presumably one whose boss is less slimy.[/quote]
Well, if you take the postings under “Work” in Forumosa as a whole…
with a blue pen i circled the entire section of the contract containing the clause and drew an X through it.
‘ive talked to friends, other foreign teachers, native taiwanese teachers, and did a lot of research online, and the consensus is that i should quit today,’ i said.
[quote=“craigzy”]with a blue pen i circled the entire section of the contract containing the clause and drew an X through it.
‘ive talked to friends, other foreign teachers, native Taiwanese teachers, and did a lot of research online, and the consensus is that i should quit today,’ I said.
‘ok, fine,’ my boss said.
confused, i asked, ‘ok, fine… what?’
‘we can take that out,’ my boss said.[/quote]
That’s good news! Glad to hear that it went OK. I’ve had experiences like that before, where somebody surprisingly backed down very readily on something I’d been concerned about for a while.
Thinking about it, there were a few ideas that my first boss here had that would have had Forumosans up in arms saying “Leave now!!!” But in fact those all worked out eventually, the job was very good overall, and I’m still friends with the boss.
Still, I might be over-cautious, but I’d advise you to keep an eye on your work situation for some time. It all does sound fine, but just be alert for any signs your boss may be harboring resentment about this and planning to take it out on you in some way.
[quote=“joesax”]
Still, I might be over-cautious, but I’d advise you to keep an eye on your work situation for some time. It all does sound fine, but just be alert for any signs your boss may be harboring resentment about this and planning to take it out on you in some way.[/quote]
