Just saw this interesting History channel documentary and thought I’d share (did search, but if I missed someone already posting this, I apologize)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4861099270516462721
I found the first half particularly interesting. Neo-nazism in the US has always been pretty well documented and exposed, but I didn’t know anything about the pre-WWII history and how it all began, or that there even was a Nazi movement in America back then.
[quote=“tash”]Just saw this interesting History channel documentary and thought I’d share (did search, but if I missed someone already posting this, I apologize)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4861099270516462721
I found the first half particularly interesting. Neo-nazism in the US has always been pretty well documented and exposed, but I didn’t know anything about the pre-WWII history and how it all began, or that there even was a Nazi movement in America back then.[/quote]
Seen it before and watching it again. I may not be able to put my thoughts together but this does speak utter volumes. I won’t try to battle the trite crap I hear out here because I know my memory doesn’t serve me as well as some others but I feel as if this administration and the fear of the next truly drives me bonkers. Billary/Obama…same party and yet world’s apart. I suppose if you think about it…either or is fine because it’s a chance but both have some serious warning signs for fuckery in the future. Turncoat/assasination or over protective mother? Fuck.
I’m Canadian and I’ve trusted my government because my parents and granparents did. I’m praying that I’m not as stupid as I feel. Oh Canada…please…Please…PLEASE.
The world’s listening now and that’s the problem. So outright complicated that…well…roll the dice.
Ok, Monster…well, I’m not sure how to tell you this, but…Canada is America…(you just can’t accept it yet) 
Canada is not America.
By your logic spiritguide, then so is Mexico.
Why does everyone seem to understand what Monster is saying except me?
This is starting to disturb me.
It’s alright, tash, we had the same problem with Deadwood, if you recall. We agreed it was probably the mumbling. And yes, that means you’re not alone.
HG
My family has a story that grandpa was working in a very large German beer hall in Philadelphia in the pre-war years. He was a bartender and one day the owner told the staff that they would be required to wear swastika arm bands while working.
Not really knowing what it was but smelling a fish in the bratwurst, my grandad said, “I ain’t wearing that, I’m a catholic.”
They argued and grandad folded his bar apron neatly on the bar and punched the owner in the face. Thus in family lore we’ve come to believe that our our Grandfather was the first American to fight the Nazis.
Hmmm. eyes the bottle Uh…hmmmm…steps away
You’re a bigger man than me, MONSTER, and you bloody no doubt are too!
HG
America has been much more successful than Europe–particularly continental Europe–at keeping the radical Right under control. By most estimates the neo-Nazi movement has proportionately more supporters in Germany, Hungary, Poland, the Czech Republic, and Sweden than in the United States. One in ten Swedes reportedly listens to “white power” music.
Furthermore, the Far Right “Preachers of Hate” have enjoyed much more electoral success in Europe than they have in the United States (where white militia numbers are at an all time low and where the Nazi party is full of old, frail members). In 2003, the Swiss People’s Party won 26.6 percent of the vote. One of the election posters showed a black face with the caption “The Swiss are becoming Negroes.” Jean-Marie Le Pen’s National Front remains a considerable force in French politics. In 1999 Jorg Haider’s Freedom Party came in second in Austria’s election and became part of the ruling coalition. By contrast, Pat Buchanan, the most right wing candidate to ever run for the US presidency, got only 0.5 percent of the vote in 2000.
In other words, the politics of hate are much more evident in European politics than in North America or the UK. And since most countries in Europe don’t have a history of massive immigration (and most countries there now need immigration just to keep populations numbers at current levels), I see this problem only getting much worse in Europe. Much, much worse!!!
Pretty well known stateside, still interesting though. Was wondering if any link would be shown between the Bund and the modern-day nazis, but apparently no.
[quote=“Chewycorns”]America has been much more successful than Europe–particularly continental Europe–at keeping the radical Right under control. By most estimates the neo-Nazi movement has proportionately more supporters in Germany, Hungary, Poland, the Czech Republic, and Sweden than in the United States. One in ten Swedes reportedly listens to “white power” music.
Furthermore, the Far Right “Preachers of Hate” have enjoyed much more electoral success in Europe than they have in the United States (where white militia numbers are at an all time low and where the Nazi party is full of old, frail members). In 2003, the Swiss People’s Party won 26.6 percent of the vote. One of the election posters showed a black face with the caption “The Swiss are becoming Negroes.” Jean-Marie Le Pen’s National Front remains a considerable force in French politics. In 1999 Jorg Haider’s Freedom Party came in second in Austria’s election and became part of the ruling coalition. By contrast, Pat Buchanan, the most right wing candidate to ever run for the US presidency, got only 0.5 percent of the vote in 2000.
In other words, the politics of hate are much more evident in European politics than in North America or the UK. And since most countries in Europe don’t have a history of massive immigration (and most countries there now need immigration just to keep populations numbers at current levels), I see this problem only getting much worse in Europe. Much, much worse!!![/quote]
I agree entirely!
Europe, and it’s satellites, are the regions to watch.
Really? Then how did I come to be part English, part Austrian, part German, part Hungarian, part Danish, part Spanish, part French, part Alsatian (is that German, French or something else? Jewish, anyway) - and those just are the parts I know about (very likely part Irish, I suspect) - not to mention my ex-wife a Zaza (some say Kurdish, some say not - possibly some kind of krypto-Armenian) from Turkey? We’ve been migrating all over the place for countless centuries, mate.
If you want to know more about your family tree, I’m not the person to be asking. You should really be asking Comrade Stalin! 
Fascinating video tash. Thanks for posting that. I too was unfamiliar with the birth of Nazism in the US before WWII. The large rally in Madison Square Garden was amazing. I had no idea.
I was familiar with the Nazi’s plan to march through the Jewish neighborhood of Skokie, Illinois, which was initially banned, so they ironically got support from a Jewish lawyer at the ACLU and took their case all the way to a famous US Supreme Court decision. One of the great moments in US First Amendment history.
True, but it’s not due to government suppression. As the documentary points out, the US government used strongarm tactics against the Nazis in the 40s and 50s. But since then they’ve been entitled to their constitutional rights to gather and spout hate speech if they want (so long as they don’t cross the line from words to action). I think the difference is, and I don’t mean offense by this – I recognize worldwide such losers are a minority and are strongly criticized by the majority of citizens who are ashamed of such idiocy in their countries – but these losers appear to find a larger support group of poor, uneducated, unemployed losers who prefer to blame others for their difficulties rather than take personal responsibility in Eastern Europe than in the US.
Btw, if you haven’t seen the movie American History X, I highly recommend it.
The paradoxical genius of free speech is that bad things thrive in the darkness and wilt in the sunlight. Standing back and allowing evil to freely come out from under its rocks isn’t tacit support, it’s the wisdom that the only real cure for such things is direct sunlight and the faith that the truth will always prevail in free, open competition because it’s innately more powerful than lies.
[quote=“Mother Theresa”] I don’t mean offense by this – I recognize worldwide such losers are a minority and are strongly criticized by the majority of citizens who are ashamed of such idiocy in their countries – but these losers appear to find a larger support group of poor, uneducated, unemployed losers who prefer to blame others for their difficulties rather than take personal responsibility in Eastern Europe than in the US.
Btw, if you haven’t seen the movie American History X, I highly recommend it.[/quote]
So you think the people that are influencing these movements in Eastern Europe are from America and migrate their because they don’t get an audience in their home country? :loco: Do you also think that the US is pulling the strings to help these countries elect far-right messengers of hate? I mean, the Le Pens, Haiders etc. have received 20 and 30 percent of the vote in many European countries. I just think it is interesting that so many Europeans criticize and stereotype many Americans as cornpone racist rednecks, and yet, American politics, with two entrenched mainstream parties, is much more moderate than most European countries–where candidates of the extreme right do well nationally. Sure, you can bring up David Duke in Louisiana, but that is pretty local and it was almost a decade ago.
In other words, the American political parties and electorte are very moderate in comparison to the current European model. I always bring this up to my establishment friends in London when they make disparaging remarks about Bush or other American politcians They don’t stomach it too well.
[quote=“Chewycorns”][quote=“Mother Theresa”] I don’t mean offense by this – I recognize worldwide such losers are a minority and are strongly criticized by the majority of citizens who are ashamed of such idiocy in their countries – but these losers appear to find a larger support group of poor, uneducated, unemployed losers who prefer to blame others for their difficulties rather than take personal responsibility in Eastern Europe than in the US.
Btw, if you haven’t seen the movie American History X, I highly recommend it.[/quote]
So you think the people that are influencing these movements in Eastern Europe are from America and migrate their because they don’t get an audience in their home country? :loco: Do you also think that the US is pulling the strings to help these countries elect far-right messengers of hate? I mean, the Le Pens, Haiders etc. have received 20 and 30 percent of the vote in many European countries. I just think it is interesting that so many Europeans criticize and stereotype many Americans as cornpone racist rednecks, and yet, American politics, with two entrenched mainstream parties, is much more moderate than most European countries–where candidates of the extreme right do well nationally. Sure, you can bring up David Duke in Louisiana, but that is pretty local and it was almost a decade ago.
In other words, the American political parties and electorte are very moderate in comparison to the current European model. I always bring this up to my establishment friends in London when they make disparaging remarks about Bush or other American politcians They don’t stomach it too well.[/quote]
A closer look at ourselves suggests otherwise:
[quote]John McCain yesterday happily received an endorsement from, and then expressed lavish gratitude towards, one of the most hateful and radical evangelical ministers in the country, Pastor John Hagee. As documented in that post, Hagee has a history of making some of the most extreme and twisted statements of any religious figure in the country towards multiple groups of Americans.
Among the many groups which McCain’s new associate has targeted for hateful bigotry are Catholics. As a result, The Catholic League today issued a statement – entitled “McCain Embraces Bigot” – which pointed out that Hagee:
has waged an unrelenting war against the Catholic Church. For example, he likes calling it "The Great Whore," an "apostate church," the "anti-Christ," and a "false cult system." [/quote]
[quote=“spook”]
John McCain yesterday happily received an endorsement from, and then expressed lavish gratitude towards, one of the most hateful and radical evangelical ministers in the country, Pastor John Hagee. As documented in that post, Hagee has a history of making some of the most extreme and twisted statements of any religious figure in the country towards multiple groups of Americans.
Among the many groups which McCain’s new associate has targeted for hateful bigotry are Catholics. As a result, The Catholic League today issued a statement – entitled “McCain Embraces Bigot” – which pointed out that Hagee:
has waged an unrelenting war against the Catholic Church. For example, he likes calling it "The Great Whore," an "apostate church," the "anti-Christ," and a "false cult system."
The Catholic Church is a evil cult![/quote]
As a Roman Catholic myself, I am definitely not a Hagee fan. And, yes, politicans in the mainstream parties may receive endorsements from less-than-stellar characters (Hagee, Sharpton, Farakkan etc.), but surely you must agree that American politics shuts out radical preachers of hate on the left and the right to a greater degree than the Europeans–at least on a national level. Now you can point to examples such as Hagee etc., but 20 to 30 percent of the American population on a national level isn’t voting for a candidate that is saying “Swiss are becoming negroes.” If anything, America could be electing its first African-American (well half) president. Like I mentioned before, the only far-right national candidate in a recent election has been Pat Buchanan (whose foreign policy views are Spookesque in many regards 
) and he only got 0.5 percent of the vote. And, to be fair to Pat, his policy positions are still moderate compared to the far-right parties in Europe.
I’m really interested in Mother Theresa’s viewpoint on Americans pulling the strings behind neo-nazi groups in Eastern Europe. I’ve always thought of these groups as being ultra-homogenous to their own respective countries. I mean I don’t think some skinhead from Idaho is saavy or international enough to be able to lead a group of losers in Stockholm in Sweden or Gdansk in Poland