How can it be illegal to teach Kindergarteners if

…Schools like Hess advertise positions, for foreigners, in a kindergarten classroom? I know its in the law books that foreign teachers are not allowed to do so, and the topic is not new, but Hess is no small fry.

Just today I ran across some of their promotional videos on youtube.com,  search for Hess and Taiwan.  You'll find a bunch of videos chronicling working for Hess and personal experiences.  Watch the one by "Janine", although I haven't been to Taiwan, thats more of the living quarters I expect to pay rather than the lavish life of "Tim and Ellen."  Anyways, they all are teaching to me what looks like kindergarteners, considering they work at 8-noon on a weekday.  How can they do so if its illegal?  Also, why would Hess promote their school by showing people like me a video of improper activity?  Also, recruiters ask if I'm interested in teaching kindergarten and I kindly say no thanks, although I know that limits me.

 If there is a great loophole or scapegoat method, what does one advise for those thinking about working at a kindergarten classroom?

Thanks again, as I appreciate the useful insight from English teachers in Taiwan as I sit across the ocean in far and distant land.

Because it’s Taiwan? But seriously I remember when I first came here and just after we completed our kindy trading at HESS, on the last day they sat us all down and said “it is illegal to teach in a kindy”. Of course they didn’t say what could happen to you if you got caught.

…this one is always fun to watch

There is. When the inspectors come round, the school pays them a “fine” (bribe).

The politicians enact a law banning something for which there is great demand. They know many schools will break the law. The politicians appoint their cronies to jobs in the bureaucracy. Bureaucrats go around pretending to inspect schools and filling their pockets with “fines”. The bureaucrats pay back the politicians with financial or political support.

If the school doesn’t pay the so-called fine, it will have to pay a real fine (more expensive). In that case, the law will really be enforced and illegally employed teachers will be deported. Tough luck, pal. You’re just a teacher, a foreigner, a pawn, a prawn. You pay tax but you have no vote. Deportation is an administrative process. You have no legal recourse. Get on the plane and don’t come back.

But the school will usually elect to pay the “fine” rather than the fine…in which case the presence of a foreign teacher will be observed by blind eyes only. So don’t worry. Carry on teaching.

You’re not teaching “kindergarten”, but 4 year old adults.

There is. When the inspectors come round, the school pays them a “fine” (bribe).

The politicians enact a law banning something for which there is great demand. They know many schools will break the law. The politicians appoint their cronies to jobs in the bureaucracy. Bureaucrats go around pretending to inspect schools and filling their pockets with “fines”. The bureaucrats pay back the politicians with financial or political support.

If the school doesn’t pay the so-called fine, it will have to pay a real fine (more expensive). In that case, the law will really be enforced and illegally employed teachers will be deported. Tough luck, pal. You’re just a teacher, a foreigner, a pawn, a prawn. You pay tax but you have no vote. Deportation is an administrative process. You have no legal recourse. Get on the plane and don’t come back.

But the school will usually elect to pay the “fine” rather than the fine…in which case the presence of a foreign teacher will be observed by blind eyes only. So don’t worry. Carry on teaching.[/quote]

I’ve never seen the situation as it really is here described so well. Classic post.

There is. When the inspectors come round, the school pays them a “fine” (bribe).

The politicians enact a law banning something for which there is great demand. They know many schools will break the law. The politicians appoint their cronies to jobs in the bureaucracy. Bureaucrats go around pretending to inspect schools and filling their pockets with “fines”. The bureaucrats pay back the politicians with financial or political support.

If the school doesn’t pay the so-called fine, it will have to pay a real fine (more expensive). In that case, the law will really be enforced and illegally employed teachers will be deported. Tough luck, pal. You’re just a teacher, a foreigner, a pawn, a prawn. You pay tax but you have no vote. Deportation is an administrative process. You have no legal recourse. Get on the plane and don’t come back.

But the school will usually elect to pay the “fine” rather than the fine…in which case the presence of a foreign teacher will be observed by blind eyes only. So don’t worry. Carry on teaching.[/quote]

:bravo:

Juba’s general description is correct. One thing is not. The rule against teaching kindergarten is not statutory, but rather regulatory. In other words, it was created by bureaucrats at the Ministry of Education, not politicians in the legislature.

There is. When the inspectors come round, the school pays them a “fine” (bribe).

The politicians enact a law banning something for which there is great demand. They know many schools will break the law. The politicians appoint their cronies to jobs in the bureaucracy. Bureaucrats go around pretending to inspect schools and filling their pockets with “fines”. The bureaucrats pay back the politicians with financial or political support.

If the school doesn’t pay the so-called fine, it will have to pay a real fine (more expensive). In that case, the law will really be enforced and illegally employed teachers will be deported. Tough luck, pal. You’re just a teacher, a foreigner, a pawn, a prawn. You pay tax but you have no vote. Deportation is an administrative process. You have no legal recourse. Get on the plane and don’t come back.

But the school will usually elect to pay the “fine” rather than the fine…in which case the presence of a foreign teacher will be observed by blind eyes only. So don’t worry. Carry on teaching.[/quote]

I’ve never seen the situation as it really is here described so well. Classic post.[/quote]

Have you ever seen the movie Monty Python’s Life of Brian when the headquarters of the People’s Front of Judea gets raided by the Roman army? That’s what it’s like when a HESS branch gets a police raid (assuming a thick enough red envelope has been left in an easy to find place). If not, the teacher gets deported.

Thanks for the clarification. That makes it more straightforward - it’s just the bureaucrats lining their own pockets.

Is it possible to spot a school that won’t/can’t pay its bribes?

For instance, are larger schools more reliable about paying their bribes than smaller ones? Rural vs. city? Chain vs. independent?

Is it possible just to ask the school directly…“Prove to me that you pay your bribes.” LOL

Ah, the nostalgia of my former naughty days and this classic thread…

http://www.forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopic.php?t=15826&highlight=Hess

I was chatting to a HESS employee on Saturday and he said that the loophole they believed they were exploiting was one where the kindy English teacher was actually employed in a bushiban on the same premises as the kindy. Then, if they get raided, they claim that the English teacher is a consultant or visiting lecturer to the kindy class. Not sure what the lecture would involve (today I’m going to talk about my favorite color?). Anyway, he said that the HESS management had effectively convinced themselves that they were pretty much untouchable. With big companies if enough people say an opinion often enough eventually everyone takes it as fact.

What he and some of his colleagues were worried about was the fact that management were now blatantly taking the piss out of the MOE, showing westerners teaching kindy on adverts, their website etc. The Taiwanese way may well be to ignore/bend/break a regulation, but you definitely don’t make a big deal about it. At the moment the MOE are tolerating a serious loss of face, and may well decide enough is enough and commence a major clampdown on HESS kindy schools.

Anyway, not sure if this is the case, but it sounds likely. Liked your old thread Mr. Bassman - definitely a classic.

Another guy said to me tonight that there is going to be an MOE clamp down in January. How he knows, or why January I have no idea.

:laughing: :bravo: Only in Taiwan could they get away with that…

:laughing: :bravo: Only in Taiwan could they get away with that…[/quote]

… and only in Taiwan would they need to… :laughing: :bravo:

Well, it seems that they’re pretty straight up about it on their Wiki page.

Interesting. The police routinely announce their crackdowns on vehicular violations in advance. So the MOE does this too? It’ll be interesting to see whether schools do get raided at that time. Please keep us informed, everyone. :laughing:

Bear in mind that this information came from a bloke I met in the pub.

Tomthorne said:

Just before the elections, our lovely authorities -especially police officers- like to show off to their constituents by organizing high profile promo events such as raids where they can appear to be doing something useful while keeping control of the situation -meaning will not escalate, there will be no one to retaliate, nor will it antagonize really bad guys, we don’t want that.

In summary, it’s election smoke and mirrors. Just remember foreigners are the weakest link and act accordingly (meaning being a very, very good boy :angel: )