How did you meet?

I was on the way to England and we took the same flight. While transferring, I felt that the guy sitting next to me was peeking at the diary I was writing. First I thought he’s probably curious about Chinese characters. So I smiled at him and we started to talk. Later I found out that he can even read Chinese. And the biggest coincidence is that he lives in the city where I was going to stay for a month! So he volunteered to be my tourguide. I’m sure that some of you can already guess the rest of the story. After a month, I got the biggest souvenir ever back to Taiwan.

This is my story. It’s kind of cliche. What are your stories?

As an CSU exchange student in '88 I once asked a reported on a date; she declined, citing a hangover. After dating many of her friends and classmates, living in Japan and having Japanese girlfriends, which she openly gave me advice on, I returned to Taiwan to chase her for another six years. I’m persistent, she is forgiving, I played the field extensively, but she was stupid enough to marry me and have children…talk about being picky…

We met via ICQ. A couple of days later she asked me out to see fireworks… we’ve been having fireworks of our own ever since :sunglasses:

As an exchange student at the birthday party of my two best friends in Taiwan. We talked the whole eventhing, went to a movie the next day and you can guess the rest. We’ve been together since then for 2 and a half years now on a long distance relationship, since I had to go home to continue my studies. I’ll be gradutating by the end of this year hopefully and this torture will finally come to an end!

At a bar. I was drinking Coors light I believe. She was drinking some kind of mixed drink. Our eyes met, so I decided to try my hand at some drunken flirting. We hit it off; yada yada yada, Ill never see her again… :wink:

She was my teaching assistant.

Well, all the other girls in the room were only 12, so I didn’t really have an alternative, did I?

During Chinese New year many moons ago got a call from a friend, went out for a beer, she slept over… i had to get up next day to work, so left a key so she could get some breakfast and let herself back in (i’m a nice guy like that)…

Dunno what happened but she is still here after 5 years (never left) and we are happily married!!

Just going into the Chung Ho office building one Friday morning, smiled at a handsome construction worker outside (like we all do). Following Monday morning he was waiting, offered me a cigarette, said in broken English that his heart stopped when he saw me (Had I forgotten my make-up? Bad hair day, I wondered?), met after work, ate Korean, shagged in his RV, smoked some more. Two years, two months and three dogs later, we still have kimchi at least twice a week! :smiley:

Twelve years ago, I met an American beauty pagent princess, a doctor’s daughter, through my mom and step-dad. I finished grad school, put her up in fine digs with a nice car and lots of vacations for about six years before she dumped me for a short, fat, docile computer programmer. Her parents put the cabosh on me–seems I was too “stubborn.” Wouldn’t listen to their advice, so they had her dump me.

Lesson: Never let yourself be set up, particularly with a beauty queen who’s parents are domineering control-freaks. You’ll never win.

I think the lesson here is don’t go for women dating you because of your Benjamins. Her mercenary heart will dump you as soon as a better deal comes along. I wouldn’t go with a girl who insisted I bought her gifts on Sunday shopping expeditions (like many guys I’ve seen here - see how long your xiaojie sticks around when you can’t afford to whiz her away to Kenting on the weekends & throw hao ke-ai gifts at her). That’s just one step away from outright prostitution. Any woman with any self-respect would insist on paying her own way - either going Dutch or reciprocating in kind (I pay this time, you pay next time).

Mod lang, you misunderstand, but that’s my fault. I was poor when I met her, a financially struggling grad student. We were together eight years. I only did well financially after graduation. Also, this was in America, not Taiwan. And she was my wife.

I agree with your view that a woman who requires maintenance isn’t worth her salt. Of course, let’s not discount arrangements where women support a business but don’t necessarily earn a direct income from it. There are lots of companies in Taiwan where the backbone is the wife or girlfriend.

I should also add that I am most grateful to have been dumped. Not that she was a bad woman. Just that I’ve really enjoyed life as a single man for the past 5-6 years.

She walked into my K5 class to be my TA…I had never seen such a smile…if you believe in love at first sight, then this was it…

But reality, unlike love, is chock-a-block full of common sense and I knew this middle-aged, mid-paunched muddler didn’t stand a ghost of a chance, no matter what the fortune teller may have told.

As the months passed, her smile melted my core…her smile was as deep as it could get…not a mean or disingenuous intent possessed she. But she was only twenty-three…far too young or me…

I tested the waters…asked her for some help with this or that…then glory of glories…she invited me out…for coffee and salsa dance lessons…


I returned to Taiwan in April of last year disgraced and humiliated…my recently married bride had run off in the middle of the night…details are unneccessary suffice it to say that circumstances were beyond our control…nevertheless, I was crushed that April and by September (the time of my angel’s invitation) was just getting back to being myself…had dated a little…was content (pretty much) in the workplace and basically regaining my confidence…then, out of the blue…SHE asks me out… :shock:

Innocent enough…she had asked others too…but I was the only interested party…Duuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhh!!!

Innocent enough that I still hung onto the reality-based aspect of thought…No WAY in hell is this woman interested in me…

She gave me a lift home…she parked and came in to see my new place…we talked…I made some tea…we talked some more…

Have you ever woken up and not remembered the details of the night before…not just the fine points…but the big stuff? I, to this day, can remember making the tea…I remember nary a jot of what we talked about nor what we did…I can remember sensations and colours and waking up…best of all…of waking up…the fog of the previous eve dawned on the reality of HER…beside me!

And there she stayed…for almost 6 months…the greatest 6 months of my life…and out of 504, I have had very close to 500 great months…and these 6 were each standout memories…

And as you have probably surmised from grammar and syntax, we are no more…

I counted each day as a blessing…this new love-tempered edge of reality-based thought allowed me to totally, unconditionally love this woman and to accept the day it, inevitably, ended…ok…ok…I haven’t 100% accepted it yet…but I have been able to let go…we are still friends and we talk about possibilities…and therein lies my conundrum and my raison d’etre of this posting…

Yes I love her!
Yes, she says she loves me!
Yes, she broke up with me because she doesn’t want to be in a relationship with anyone…nothing personal…other than the smoking…but that is :smiling_imp: easily :smiling_imp: changeable.
She is encouraging me to date, which I have tried a couple of times but can’t maintain any interest cuz I’d rather wait for her…at least until she starts dating someone else…then I could get that magic elixir of closure…


In the meantime we still have long late night talks on the phone and romantic dinner/movie dates…but whenever the subject of togetherness is discussed, her resolution is a resounding “no”. Even the idea of a vacation to Thailand together has more possibility than the idea of us ever going back to that g/f&b/f thang. She has even suggested that I move in with her but under a platonic caveat…I flatly rejected this as impossible and told her so…am I missing the boat here? Was the caveat part of a “good girl” face-saving measure?

That she wants to explore other romantic opportunities I can accept…I have had a modest number of lovers in my life, each of whom have added to this great gift that is Toe Save, so why shouldn’t she experience what others have to offer…I am confident enough, not only in my, shall we say, expertise in the matters of “amour” but in that 90% of you bozos out there (u know who I am talking about) are such testosterone driven, little head thinkin, possessive, prevaricatin’ pricks that you would only send her running back to me all the sooner if you ever had the great fortune to meet my love.

I want to know why she rejects any notion of togetherness…she can’t give me a reason…can you, dear Forumosan ladies or the 10% of Forumosan males I didn’t insult last paragraph, shed any light vis-a-vis cultural signals I am missing? What I can’t understand, given the “three no” principle and the cultural differences and all the what-not and hooey over “The Rules” et al…what’s a poor-love sick puppy like me to do…cut bait and move on…or wait…at least for her to start a relationship with someone else…I can do that…but do you, fellow Forumosans, think I’d be wasting precious time (504 months old right?)? I know there are many other intelligent, kind, sexy women out there, but, in my mind right now, she is worth waiting for.


Toe-tied in Love

Toe Save’s story brings to mind a discussion I’ve had with myself and others for some time–in relationships, is there one person who is destined to be at the mercy of the other person, who is quite clearly in charge of things? Does it always have to be that way? I’ve seen great relationships, where control doesn’t seem to be an issue, but behind the scenes, there must be some sort of division of power, for convenience in decision-making, if for no other reason.

A very wise friend of mine told me once that there is always a dominant party in a relationship. The healthier the relationship, the closer the division of power is to 50/50. He thinks that 51/49 is possible, but not 50/50. What do you guys think?

I’m getting a bit worried that with the degree to which my local girlfriends put most decisions into my hands, I’m losing perspective, and quite possibly becoming a spoiled asshole. Is 50/50 really possible, or is the issue not related to power at all? It would be great to have some female input here.

Ah, Tomas. Screw destiny. Life’s what you make it.

Toe Save, maybe you should be over at the ‘the one’ discussion. I’m in a similar situation myself, although not as far down the timeline as you. My best guess, based on what I’m going through, is that she’s thinking of where this is leading.

A fling, yes, without thought of what comes next. But now she’s trying to envision spending the rest of her life with you.

What will the family think? Say? Do?

Will you stay in Taiwan? Do you want to take her away? Does she want to go away? How does she feel about the reality of how often she will see her mother?

Kids. Nationality? Language? Education? What are her views and what are yours?

Oh, and how will you guys be living in ten or twenty years? Has she met any of those balding foreign drunkards in their 50s that can’t hold down a job any more? What are your retirement provisions and how will she feel about having you loafing incontinently about the house when she’s as old as you are now, Mr Parkinson?

Either she’s serious and getting cold feet because this is a really big step - or you’re crap in bed and she wants someone more virile.

I know what I would tell myself if I was you.

Toe Save, maybe you should be over at the ‘the one’ discussion. I’m in a similar situation myself, although not as far down the timeline as you. My best guess, based on what I’m going through, is that she’s thinking of where this is leading.[/quote]

Try to answer you and be a fancy poster as well…

My thoughts exactly…she woke up and thought “OMB…what am I doing?” A fling was never really in my mind but maybe it was in hers…if so…great…move on…I’m better for it and she’s better for it and that’s all we can ask out of experience…i think.

She’s fairly independant for a Taiwanese woman…(the heart of the matter between us actually)…she has a strong sense of family, but she is the leader of her family…Mom is not in the pic so much now, Dad’s a strange bird but a cool Daoist who’s into calligraphy…she keeps him at arms length…not far enough…but she sees what he is…Grandma’s gettin up in years and has her suspicions, but they are Taiwanese so, denial ain’t just a river in Egypt…she loves her dee-dee and mei-mei with all her heart…and they’ve all met me but only the kids know the real relationship.


To all four antipodes and every point between…but I see no reason to not call Taiwan home.

If she does and wants me to join her…I’m there…if she wants to move back to Chiayi, I’m there…I do love her…remember… :smiley:

Moot, really…but she is free to see her Mom whenever she wants…hell…I’ll drive her…

I am not a breeder, per se, but I am capable of it and would be a groovy Dad.

Uhhhhmmmm??? Taiwanese Canadian? Taiwadian? Canwanese? I assume you are speaking of offspring? Now, appeareance…that’s a subject worthy of keyboard time…I am 98% celtic, 2% mystery meat, she is pure Taiwanese, but she doesn’t look it at all…she could be filipino, turkish or north american aboriginal…I could be anything from italian to greek, from sultan to semite…our kids…WOW…the mind boggles…to me there are no more attractive people than Eurasians…the yin and yang made flesh…of course there’s Tiger Woods too…and if I was a woman or a little lighter in my loafers, I’d sure find him dreamy…maybe he could be the next Bond…

As many as possible. I speak English and French, she speaks Mandarin, Taiwanese, Turkish, English and we both speak a wee bit of Spanish and Japanese…

Since you brought it up…for her, I would support her while she studied anything and everything she wants to study…for as long as she wants to study…we would travel and she could become the next President of Taiwan if I had my druthers…but she is her own person and can do what she wants…if she wants kids…I am content to depart this mortal coil youngin’ free…but if she wants kids…she couldn’t find better gene pool material or paternal instinct that what she could have in me. Ditto education thing for da kids…wanna know their English names? Arden and Illyria…

Quite well, thank you for asking…I have a good job now and am working myself into what could be a very profitable niche market…and as President of Taiwan, I’d imagine she’d be pulling in her share… :wink:

She is a pretty good judge of character and often, far too forgiving…there are some folks that really are not worthy of her attention, but she is never unkind…

I am heading for an island in Thailand where I will build my castle on Rock, overlooking the sea…I will semi-retire into the life of scuba and golf while keeping alive business ventures here in Taiwan and hopefully elsewhere. If there are kids, I will be doing the lion’s share of the educating and domesticating…she has a busy schedule, what with leading Taiwan into the new Asian Economic SuperPower…(remember that by this time, China will have crumbled her regime and pleaded for governmental leadership, with my Angel riding the stallion of democracy across the strait.

Not sure if this is a genetic thing, but my Grand-dad suffered from that bastard and it’s not pretty…I saw enough to know that I am not going out that way…if that’s my fate or some other such ilk, then I’d probably drop as many tanks of air I could of a boat and go for the longest dive ever…try and pick a fight with a shark or if that didn’t work, pick a fight with my lungs…

Yes Yes Yes…this is the hope I cling too…my greatest fear is that she doesn’t care…cold feet I can work with…time warms cold feet…I am in no hurry for anything…

2 words…Tan Tra

I think you would be telling yourself to move on…but you have been so mysterious in this last quote that I’d better make sure? Would you?

Ah, Tomas. Screw destiny. Life’s what you make it.


tmwc, “destined” has a number of definitions. I personally don’t believe in fate. What I meant was “inevitably ends up being”…one way or another. I’m talking about organic matter here, not absract ideas. God, but you are daft at times :slight_smile: :slight_smile: .

Toe Save, if I were you, I’d maintain a friendship but stop needing her so much. People don’t like to be needed. Desired, yes, but not needed. Fine line there.

TMWC wrote[quote], all the other girls in the room were only 12, so I didn’t really have an alternative[/quote]

So what you are saying is that you went for the female with the biggest boobs. Sexist animal!!

Toe Save,
Are you dating Vice President Lu?

Toe Save, if I were you, I’d maintain a friendship but stop needing her so much. People don’t like to be needed. Desired, yes, but not needed. Fine line there.[/quote]

Tomas…I hadn’t gotten around to replying to your last post, so two birds here…

Needy? Moi? C’mon man! I am not needy…I am independant, successful and happy…I have a great life, a sharp wit and a shining perspective…I am really looking forward to that clifftop nook in Thailand all by my lonesome…I have something to offer, something to share, if I so desire to share it…and with her I do…if she so desires to share of it. If not, I’m all cool with that too…in fact, that’s pretty much how it is…it’s over and I am putting it to bed, so to speak, and turning towards my little community here at Forumosa to see if I am missing anything…is there a cultural thing at work or is it human nature? I not only suspect the latter, but confess it to be verily true…I seek only to exhaust another door on the way to being fully closured. Along the way, I hope that our experience can be shared and somewhat insightful to others that read here…like a good community member…

Now Tomas, you seem like an intelligent guy with many experiences to count your own. You have been through a divorce that in retrospect, you are kicking up your heels at now, but at some point you must have had your back firmly planted on the ground by it. But if you see relationships as power struggles, then I think you might have a ways to go about understanding the nature of love. If I love you, I give my power to you…I hope you can maximize my power for your success…

But hey, I’m only a guy…you did request some yinnish imput and on that I’ll agree…c’mon sisters…weigh in…Power in relationships is our topic tonight…what have you got to say…What is the true nature of love?

[quote=“almas john”]Toe Save,
Are you dating Vice President Lu?

Okay…how do I get milk tea off the screen and out of my keyboard?

No…I don’t think The Middle Kingdom of Communists is gonna crumble that soon…