I’m sorry if someone has brought this up, but it seems I have not seen anyone starting a thread like this yet. And I believe dealing with arguments could be the most important/difficult thing in a relationship. Anyone would like to share the exprerience, and anything learned?
I’d like to talk about my situation here since I have to say it’s my first relationship and sometimes I am insecure about what my partner thinks. I hope I can be sensible and more mature to discuss this question. I mean communication is quite important,but what if the other one tried to escape the problem and refuse to talk about it?Tring to be specific here, like I don’t like him being forgetful and breaking promises, which he takes lightly and I take seriously. I think this is a matter of different values and personalities, but it really bothers me. When I’m being grumpy, he starts to feel insecure then we did manage to have a talk yet in a way he seemed to have no patience to talk about the real problem. Now I feel really insecure as I doubt if I really understand this person , though we only know each other for three months. I challenged my faith to think I can get through to know this person I decided to love well, which sounds silly.
Has your partner been stubborn and suddenly your relationship goes nowhere and you only can sink into hopeless thoughts. Maybe this is because I care about him too much, just for this beginning.
Any advices or philosophical remedy will be appreciated. :help:
If your partner doesn’t respect you enough to keep promises then why are you in a relationship with him/her? Relationships are all about respect. If there’s no respect then you’re just a possession. If you’re a real person then you’re worthy of respect, which means that people have to keep their promises to you.
Some people say I’m very picky about who I get into relationships with. I have all these silly rules like don’t smoke, don’t break promises, don’t keep me hanging around, and as a result I sometimes spend longish periods single.
But then I meet someone who does things my way. And then we don’t argue. I haven’t had an argument to speak of with a girlfriend in maybe five years. We might disagree about things, negotiate which option we’re going to take, but we respect each other’s opinions and after reaching an agreement then we don’t try to go back on it or bitch about it.
I hear so many people talk about having ‘fights’ or big arguments with their SOs and just don’t understand. Why does this happen? Why are people in relationships with people they can’t get along with day by day?
I can understand that some big new issue may come along which tests your relationship, especially in the early days, but I don’t see how people can be ‘together’ but endlessly squabbling.
Sorry, that’s not much help to you in your situation is it? I can only say that if you accept someone not keeping their promises then you will spend the rest of your life being walked all over by selfish bastards. If your SO can’t, or won’t, see your point of view on this then you either get out or accept your second-class status.
Understanding why someone behaves takes a long time. After a lifetime, we’ve only just begun.
The short answer, maybe some conseling. By a psychologist or philosophical counselor.
candyfloss, your boyfriend feels uncomfortable talking about a lot of things. That’s natural. We’re all that way about something. You’re sympathetic and willing to figure out why. That’s a good step. He may feel the same but is too caught up in his insecurties to tell you. What’s going on in his mind right now. Who knows. He could be very willing and want to sort things out. He’s just very troubled when all of this is brought up.
It’s going to be some adventure digging into the depths of his mind, and yours. Good luck.
The Art of Loving by Fromm could be of help. Maybe not my favorite book. It’s been years since I’ve looked at it. And I was much more ignorant back then.
Nietzsche, Jung, and Weber are my current favorites. But they take a lot of work to understand. They’re quite the psychologists. Shakespeare too.
I’ll point you to other things when they come to mind.
Ah yes. And the Analects by Confucius can help a lot in understanding chinese society. What exactly is his influence has been talked about for sometime.
I don’t know much about Chiense society before the first dynasty. I know it was a time of strife. The time was ripe for Confucius like thinking; it was easy for people to fall in love with him and cling to something similar. And the Chinese have yet to rid themselves of it.
There is a line in the Analects about good sons taking taking abuse and not complaining.
Intense Chinese philology would help a lot. If you want to go into that much philosophy.
I sense a lot of conflict in chinese people. Thousands of years of family devotion. Such a love of “virtue.” The ability to talk openly about stuff is gonna take some work.
Western society too but it has a different history.
Sorry, I’ve been working too much and haven’t slept a lot. If you want to meet up sometime and talk about it, I’d be willing.
It may be hard, it’s hard for me. Being more open and expressing your insecurities will help. Maybe he’ll start doing the the same.
At first, thanks everyone for your post and thoughts. All of your ideas offer me some interesting sides of things to think about.
Loretta: Thanks for your sage advices. I do value a lot respect in any kind of relationship. What makes it more difficult in a romantic relationship maybe is a theory involved with unconditional love, but which I would just stop here, otherwise it might diverage from this thread. And I think it’s good to have a bottom line set up when dealing with a relationship. I might be still too young to experience this part myself. But I’m processing self discovery now.
Gary: Thanks for your kind offer and interesting insights about philosophical and psychological aspects. This is also the part I’m fond of on discovering a person, especially someone I’m in an intimate relationship with. The way me and my bf are attracted to each is we both found each other some rare qualities, so I guess that’s why I would like to stick around and found out more about the person. It takes time and patience to know a person really well. Like understanding why he behaves that , philosophy of life ,and the whole inner world might be too complicated.
But my point is if I can learn something from this relationship , the good part of itself will come out. I like to study people,so maybe this makes differences. Now we stop talking about the problem and entered a silent mind status. It sounds like the worst situation. However, I guess I only can write my thoughts to him talking through things. I believe things will work out eventually. I remember one time he said “What you search for is the answer already inside yourself.” Interesting eh?
Sorry if I hazed details of our relationship and story like that. It might be me as well being insecure to reveal this part myself. Maybe it’s because of the uniquess of our combination and unconventional experience. But if anything interesting, I’ll keep you all posted in case someone wonders. It’s worth a story.
Satellite TV: He forgot to say sorry! So that’s why I turned down his kiss apologies, am I silly?
Anyway, you guys are great. I’ll get back here.
Sorry is not always a word. You must take actions WAY above words. If a guy says he is sorry, and he means it. That is golden. but I also think that if he does not say sorry and does something that says sorry, that is golden too.
I am much like that. And it is bad, mmmkay. But what I do (and this may or may not work for you) is that I write out what is wrong. I write out WHY it hurts me, what I think his reasons may be for acting like this, append this with a question as to what he thinks his reasons may be, if I am causing this behaviour, if he understands why it upsets me, what we can do to work on it (questions and suggestions), and what I can work on in exchange for him working on this.
Some men reject this as gay and stupid, but those who don’t tend to work well with me. My last lover sucked. but the one before that and I went two years with only one “fight”. We would always discuss what was wrong in this style.
Is he actually forgetful?? Do you remind him? Sometimes you have to take extra effort. Example: my amazingly forgetful man and I had plans tonight. Instead of going to his place and getting angry that he wasn’t there, I called him and found out where he was… late as always, but he told me why and when he would be there.
What are his reasons for being like this? Is he very busy? Does he have a lot of stress? Or does he just blow you off for his friends?
If he is working on something that is very important to him, it is likely that everything else is going to sllip out. but if he is blowing you off to KTV with the boys, yo have more right to be angry.
Sometimes you must give a guy time. You cut off a little at a time. You talk about little things and then bigger things and then bigger ones. Guys aren’t like us. Talking takes practice. Patience is the most important thing you can use when trying to work something out with a man. (no offence guys) Men are stupid when it comes to “talking”. But they listen a WHOLE LOT MORE than most women think they do.
You will likely go a lifetime never understanding your man. But why do you need to understand him fully? A liittle mystery is good. You need to understand what he needs from you, what he can give you, what will make him happy, how he can make you happy, and why he is unhappy and when to leave him alone. Other than that, the rest is time. 3 months is NOT MUCH TIME. And yeah, all women (almost all) have had one guy we fell for too fast. So it is stupid, but it is natural. And it is okay to feel that way.
Sometimes you have to be careful to let your partner be stubborn. And sometimes you have to let it go nowhere for a bit. men get scared if it darts in one direction and keeps going. They need it to slow and backtrack at times. You must let this happen. You cannot force a relationship. Trying will only cause heartache. You need to learn to control y our hopeless thoughts in a productive manner. Because letting yourself give into them will only be self destructive.
Yeah. I am bored.
Another thing, though. Be careful when talking to your man about your problems with him to not tear him down. Men and women are so alike in some ways. Men are insecure. If you talk with him letting him know that you are happy with him but these things hurt you. And that because you enjoy being with him so much you want to try to work on them so things can be better, he is much more likely to want to talk than if you go at him in a “you do this and you make me feel…” manner. I think the healthiest relationships are ones where neither party insults the other. Ever. And often people insult each other because they think that it will make the other one stop doing sommething. I don’t think this works. I think being very careful to not insult someone and to treat them like you respect them and think they are the best thing ever will get people to act better towards you.
My man is getting wrinkly from all his sun worship. So I have started making him mask. I won’t tell him he is getting wrinlkly. When he says he is, I tell him he is on crack and that he is hotter than hell (which he is). but I tell him that I want him to mask so that he will be handsome when he is old.
I think this style can be used to get men to do many things you want them to do. Don’t tell the man you want to drive because his driving makes you grip the chair and pray for your life, tell him you want to drive because you know he works very hard and is very tired. Don’t tell him to slow down because he is driving like a fool. Tell him to slow down because your stomach is sensitive.
This can be used in relationship ways too. Don’t tell him that when he forgets you it makes you angry. Tell him that sometimes you feel insecure because you feel he is so wonderful and that you need him to act like you are important to him to make you feel better.
Bad example. But I suck at this stuff anyways.
First, how old are you and how old is he, same age group? It is perfectly normal for you to want to know him well, just be warned though, it is where it might hurts. No one ever feels comfortable about talking their things to strangers, even if you guys are lovers, to some degree, you’re still a stranger, you’re not with him since he was born, there are things he might not want you to know. Human like to protect themselves with a bubble shield, so no one comes too close. As time progress he should open up. What kind of guy is him, shy? Outgoing? In both case the guy might still want to hide something inside their minds. You can try to drag him out, that’s about it, be patient, show affection, and reminds him of the great time you guys have, bring out topic when it is appropriate, be smooth, and then giving enough time he should feel more comfortable to be open to you.
A lot of the times it also depends on what kind of guy he is, sometimes he just doesn’t want to talk about somethings, period, what can you do about it? Not much if you ask me, if you don’t possess something that makes him feel comfortable. I am not saying you should break up with him or anything, just observe carefully.
As to insecure, well that comes with time and experience I suppose, you and him will both learn eventually…
As to things about promises, that depends on what you’re talking about. It might appear to be something small and simple from the other person’s perspective, of course he has to respect you and understand you, but have you tried to make it clear what you wanted? Not trying to generalize, but that’s what I usually don’t see in people’s first relations, then people just gets all upset about things, communication is the key, but “clear” communication is more essential, do you really get the message through is the key if you ask me.
[quote=“SuchAFob”]Sorry is not always a word. You must take actions WAY above words. If a guy says he is sorry, and he means it. That is golden. but I also think that if he does not say sorry and does something that says sorry, that is golden too.
[/quote]
True. I wonder though if actions can always explain a person? Can you understand someone just from how they act or what they say? Can someone understand you or I from just those things? or Chinese culture?
[quote=“SuchAFob”]
My man is getting wrinkly from all his sun worship. So I have started making him mask. I won’t tell him he is getting wrinlkly. When he says he is, I tell him he is on crack and that he is hotter than hell (which he is). but I tell him that I want him to mask so that he will be handsome when he is old. [/quote]
I wonder how a mask helps? For sunscreens btw, SPF only protects against UVB. UVA is what wrinkles. Mexoryl is the best thing available against UVA. Available only through L’Oreal owned companies.
[quote=“gary”]
I wonder how a mask helps? SPF only protects against UVB. UVA is what wrinkles. Mexoryl is the best thing available against UVA. Available only through L’Oreal owned companies.[/quote]
I am referring to a skin treatment mask to heal and correct damage.
[quote=“X3M”]Yes darling, you are right.
Yes darling, I love you.[/quote]
too bad. I was thinking about just this the other day. Both sexes are changing, slowly but it’s happening. I understand sexism and the defenses against them are strong enough that anything like equality or some sort of infinite openness is really hard.
Love is possible only through the idea of the infinite. - Levinas
Love is of all sentiments the most egoistic, and, as a consequence, when it is wounded, the least generous. - Benjamin Constant
[quote=“SuchAFob”][quote=“gary”]
I wonder how a mask helps? SPF only protects against UVB. UVA is what wrinkles. Mexoryl is the best thing available against UVA. Available only through L’Oreal owned companies.[/quote]
I am referring to a skin treatment mask to heal and correct damage.[/quote]
Yeah. I wonder though if you can reverse damage after it’s done? I’ll have to look into it. I wear a La Roche Posay sunscreen with mexoryl everyday though not on my arms.
I’m not sure if I’d stay with a girl that didn’t wear sun protection but she could be execeptional in every other way. Though I may slowly con her into it, I wouldn’t force it. Who’s not accepting who?
I cannot control him and I will not try. If I did not like him for who he was, I would not be with him. Part of who he is a crazy surfer who doesn’t wear enough sun screen. Yes, I understand that you can only repair a little bit and prevention is much more effective. But Ialso understand that part of who he is is a man who does not think of those things.
If he look like an 80 year old man by next week, he will still have a soft heart and great personality and I won’t care. But I would prefer if he did not.
[quote=“gary”][quote=“SuchAFob”][quote=“gary”]
I wonder how a mask helps? SPF only protects against UVB. UVA is what wrinkles. Mexoryl is the best thing available against UVA. Available only through L’Oreal owned companies.[/quote]
I am referring to a skin treatment mask to heal and correct damage.[/quote]
Yeah. I wonder though if you can reverse damage after it’s done? I’ll have to look into it. I wear a La Roche Posay sunscreen with mexoryl everyday though not on my arms.
I’m not sure if I’d stay with a girl that didn’t wear sun protection but she could be execeptional in every other way. Though I may slowly con her into it, I wouldn’t force it. Who’s not accepting who? [/quote]
do most girls wear sunscreen everyday?
btw, where do you get this stuff, and does it make your skin all pasty-looking?
Suchafob:
You sound like a lovely woman! I’m benefited a lot from your experience and advices. I guess I just need all the experience to learn along the way with needed strategies step by step. It sounds like fun; maybe this is lubricant I will need after my relationship gets more smooth. But now I’m still trying to get over this stressed point.
I did meet him up and talk through things, and good thing is I guess we do understand each much better. Maybe I still have a little confusion and disappointment but I have learned not to push things too hard in a way I want. I guess what I need to learn is the courage to face a person I love and be unfraid to know what he really is then accpet the fact. Being a newbie is really sucks sometimes
And now there’s no secret solution in this situation. I think the best way is to talk to the person genuinely face to face and use a little intelligent judgment.
[quote=“clee19821013”]First, how old are you and how old is he, same age group? It is perfectly normal for you to want to know him well, just be warned though, it is where it might hurts. No one ever feels comfortable about talking their things to strangers, even if you guys are lovers, to some degree, you’re still a stranger, you’re not with him since he was born, there are things he might not want you to know. Human like to protect themselves with a bubble shield, so no one comes too close. As time progress he should open up. What kind of guy is him, shy? Outgoing? In both case the guy might still want to hide something inside their minds. You can try to drag him out, that’s about it, be patient, show affection, and reminds him of the great time you guys have, bring out topic when it is appropriate, be smooth, and then giving enough time he should feel more comfortable to be open to you.
…[/quote]
Hey clee19821013, this is really good analysis regarding my situation. How come you have such sensitivities. I’m amazed.
I think I just let myself be more open minded talking about this relationship, which might help you understand the situation better.
Ya besides culture difference , we also have age difference by 20. It sounds like lots of issues to deal with. And I find it difficult to talk about my problems with my friends from time to time as they never encounter by a situation like mine. It’s strange I’m a 20’s year old Taiwanese and he’s a 40’s year old American, but we did click very well at the beginning we met. We have a lot in common by nature, but I think my heart is just too young to judge all the new changes in my life right.
I need to take things more slowly and try to learn each other better as to avoid illusions.
As for the defining things for breaking promises, I guess there is not much like small/big thing issue in our situation. I just found out it’s a different attitude we treat things and life after I talked to him today. And I learned a lot. We do think quite differently. I forget I’m from a traditional Taiwanese family and he travels a lot in the world already.
