I need help with my dog, Attacking other dogs

Alright, so I have a half American pit half Lab. She is mostly awesome, super cute, listens to me, usually plays well with other dogs, BUT. . .

I moved back in with my parents while I finish school, before my eventual trip over to Taiwan. They have two Border Collies (one male, one female). These two breeds don’t exactly mix well because they play differently. My dog likes to wrestle, they like to herd each other. But my Dog has seemed to sort of get their game, and they play a game where she has a ball in her mouth and they chase her.

Anyway, I got this dog when my scum bag ex-roommate skipped out on his rent and left his dog behind. When I got her she wasn’t potty trained, would bite, and was pretty much completely wild. She has made great strides since that time, and, with the exception of jumping on people she doesn’t know when they first walk in the door, she is pretty well behaved.

Now, another game the three dogs know how to play is fetch. However, one day my dog attacked the smaller of the two Border Collies, when that dog “got” the bal first, she made her bleed. I don’t remember how I broke it up but I did my best to let her know that this wasn’t acceptable without hitting her. Held her on the ground, yelled at her, put her in the cage, whatever. Then she did it again about two weeks later, did the same thing. But by this time my dad was talking about getting rid of my Dog, which would pretty much kill me. I’d sell all my possessions and drop out of school before I let that happen. Then one day, while we were all shoveling snow, she did it to the other Border Collie (the male). She wouldn’t let go of him, and, I am ashamed to say, I hit her. I know I shouldn’t have, but I did. I did it out of fear for her life. If she kept attacking my parents dog, and I was unable to get out of the house, she would have to go, and Virginia doesn’t adopt out Pit Bulls (even mixes) preferring instead to “put them down”. So I hit her, hard, a few times, and she let go of him. When I think of her face at this time it still hurts my heart. She was scared of me until the next day.

But the thing is, it worked, or at least it seemed to. She didn’t attack either dog for 18 months. But about a week ago, the female Border Collie was “guarding” a toy (something she does, which is annoying and causes conflict between the dogs) well my dog decided she had enough of it and attacked her. This time I just smacked her, fairly hard, to get her to stop. Again, I know I’m not supposed to do that, but telling her to stop didn’t make her stop, trying to pull her away didn’t make her stop. The only thing that did it was a semi-hard smack with an open hand. (still much better than really hitting her like I had to the last time)

She is strong enough to kill either dog, though I’m not sure if she would, it is still scary seeing her attack them. I know that hitting her only causes more long term problems and makes it more likely that she will do it again. But this isn’t a common enough behavior that small corrections will teach her to stop. And even if it were, she won’t listen to that.

So what do I do? I thought we were passed this, after all we went 18 months without an attack. But it only takes one time for her to kill or seriously maim one of them. I obviously can’t, and don’t now, leave them alone together, but is there anything I can do to ensure this won’t happen again? How should I react if it does?

Thanks in advance for your advice, I pride myself, normally, on my dog raising experience, so this has been quite a big blow to my ego having to ask for help, but this is unacceptable behavior and I don’t know what to do or who to ask for advice.

This is going to be a fairly worthless response, because I can’t tell you what to do, but I do want to commend you on your commitment to your dog. It’s pet owners like you who give me hope and make me want to continue animal rescue.
I agree it’s a hard thing to correct behaviors that don’t occur often- dogs learn through repetition, so if the behavior isn’t repetitive, it’s really hard to correct it. I’ll see if there’s anything in “Don’t Shoot the Dog” that could help you.
Other people here are awesome with pet advice though! Good luck!

I also know very little about the subject. However, it does seem to me that you’re worrying a little too much. Your dog seems to have a particular issue with these collies, but when you bring him over with you to Taiwan they won’t be a factor. He’ll be on his own at home, then, and you’ll only have to worry about his behaviour towards other dogs when you take him on walks - it will be a completely different situation. Until then it seems to be a case of keeping the dogs apart whenever possible (assuming it’s not too long before you come to Taiwan, which from your other posts sounds like the case).

Dunno how safe he’s going to be here, as in my experience, many dogs -not to say most- are badly socialized here and react with fury towards one another. Many of the big dogs in my hood are walked with a muzzle on. So a proper procedure should be in place for those ocassions, too, when aggressive dogs meet. It is workable, with patience, and perseverance, but a plan must be drawn, better call in an expert to work on this issue -must be easier in the US.

are you bringing this dog over to taiwan or keeping it at your parent’s house??
if it’s in taiwan, can’t help, only have cats here…
if it’s at your parents house then there are a number of options…
i have had a husky(with some wolf in it), 2 border collies and a chocolate lab. husky and the lab were great in terms of personalities, borders were okay, one smart and the other one, lets just say he had a learning disability and leave it at that. he wasn’t violent at all just was a big oaf that liked to throw his weight around.
your dog’s problem seems social, and being that it’s a pit bull doesn’t help. i know in NA there are a lot of disobedient schools out there that offer ‘reeducation’ programs for big dogs. heard of those programs and seen the results, some turnarounds that are pretty outstanding…the thing is, with pit bulls, once they have the taste of blood in their mouths they change. seek professional help maybe??
it sounds to me like the other two dogs are ganging up on it and playing head games with it, really, dogs in groups do that. i think the pit bull has no one to turn to at home so it just loses it occasionally… taking it out to socialize with other dogs(dog parks) does wonders for them, little by little of course. try to take all three of them out and see how they react in a different environment…with a pit bull, try to keep it around bigger dogs, so the size factor is ruled out for intimidation purposes.
lots of positive reinforcements, treats, and tlc is required to fix that dog’s problem.
make sure you watch/read “marley and me”.
dogs are like kids. the weird kids usually don’t get out much and are teased a lot. put them in the right situation and things will start to improve. i have always thought dogs and people don’t differ too much, only dogs can lick their own balls, wouldn’t that be great now wouldn’t it?
good luck, it’s all worth it in the end.

Try Stray Dog’s advice on this thread, and then on his blog:

Funny that I read this last night- my dogs killed a neighborhood kitten this morning. I’m still shaky hours later. I have to admit I lost it and hit them too (for the first time in a year) I just wanted to get it in their head that kitten=bad, but it probably didn’t work. My boy dog came back to the house and the other two are still out roaming the beach somewhere. I walk them leashless and never had a problem until today- they’ve cornered a cat before but just stared at it with goofy looks on their faces, and I have a cat in the house that they cuddle up to and have never had a problem.
Until I figure this out (there’s not a lot of helpful info on the net that I’ve found) they’re going out with muzzles. It terrifies me because if something happens to them (hit by a car or something) they’ll be unable to eat/drink, but I just can’t risk them getting in the habit of killing.
Let’s add “cat killing” to the list and see if our resident experts have any info.
In the meantime, can you put a muzzle on your pup when he plays with the others? The only bad thing I can think of is that he will feel powerless and possibly become more aggressive.

Thanks for the kind words and advice everyone. Sorry to hear about your Dog’s problems NonTocareLeTete.

I try my best to follow the kind of rules Stray Dog has. Calm, assertive, I’m the boss, not her, etc. Its hard though, ever since I moved back in with my parents. My mom spoils her rotten. When she is down stairs with me she is great, listens to sit, stay, come. Doesn’t bark, etc. I let her go up stairs and she starts barking for treats, and my mom gives them to her! We have fought over this issue many times. It is so frustrating, because she isn’t like that with her dogs. :fume:

My dog plays well with others, usually. I have brought her to dog parks before and to friends’ houses before and no problem. So, maybe doing that more will get some energy and pent up frustration from not being able to wrestle with these Dogs.

Anyway, the dogs live together, so I can’t really keep my dog muzzled 24/7.

The Dog that got attacked last has a problem with guarding. She’ll guard the food, toys, even a sock or piece of paper if she can’t guard either of those two things. She won’t even chew the toys, she just guards them so the other two dogs can’t have them. She was guarding the dogs’ favorite toy when the “fight” (or attack) happened. I think I have to try to minimize that as much as possible, but I still need to teach my dog not to attack her under any circumstances.

Should I stop wrestling with my Dog? It is one of our favorite things to do together, and she never hurts me, and she stops the instant I tell her to, but still, maybe I should stop that? It’ll suck because that is one of my favorite things about her.

Also, I had neglected to walk her for three days before the attack, when I normally walk her everyday.

But still, all that are just excuses, sure I should have walked her, should have stopped the dog from guarding the ball, but regardless she can’t be attacking dogs for any reason. There are going to be days when I’m too busy to walk her, times when I don’t see the guarding, etc.

I suppose I’m only here for about a year (or less actually) longer, so I guess I can just be careful and watch them the best I can. I’m just worried about what happens if there is an attack when I’m not around, she doesn’t respect my Mom enough to fear her, and my Mom isn’t exactly strong.

I found I made a big impact on my parent’s Border Collie’s naturally developing interest in sheep by speaking sternly to her just before she put her nose on the electric fence that enclosed them.

Happened twice in separate locations on Islay. The second time she had just been in the sea, so would have been especially conductive.

The Voice of Zeus.

No further sheep issues that holiday.

Animal behaviourists might disagree, but I think you’re agonising a bit overmuch on the hitting.

Serious issues require serious measures.

good luck

it sounds like you’re probably going to have to get your mom to quit with the treats. tell her flat out that it’s your dog and you don’t want her giving your dog any treats. treats are reinforcing the behavior of barking for the treats. a spoiled dog is going to push for more and more.

pit bulls are a tricky situation. even as a vet tech, i can’t tell you exactly how to deal with them because i never got a chance to work with them a whole lot. but tbh, it sounds like she’s jealous. the other dog that guards the toys has all the toys and the only way she knows to remedy that is to attack.

Some random thoughts

Not walking her isn’t an excuse… regular walks and interaction play a big part in behaviour.It could well have been a factor in her blowup.

I think that you may be expecting a bit much that she NEVER gets into a scrap with the dogs she lives with, if they’re really bugging her. Like kids with their brothers and sisters… we can teach them that it’s not the right thing to do, and they can understand that very well, but sometimes they might just be pushed too far. We can expect that kids might lash out at each other sometimes… but if they lash out with intent to mortally injure, then you’ve got a problem. The important thing as I see it is, that she responds to your intervention, and respects your word on it. She’s not fighting to kill, but more a very occasional sibling rivalry thing. I’m not saying this to give the impression that I think it’s okay for your dog to fight - we need to give a very clear message that it’s not, with the intention of it never happening. I’m just saying that it’s NORMAL that it may happen sometimes, and as dog parent, you need to figure out how to respond to it, so don’t freak out over it, think it’s the end of the world and overreact emotionally, just because she is part bull terrier.

I don’t think you’re bad because you hit her. In the moment, we do whatever we have to do to save the situation, and you used what was in your toolbox at the time, and it worked. I try to take these incidents that I think I didn’t handle so well as pointers to learning. They hilight the gaps in my knowledge or skill, and give me an idea on what I can work on next. :slight_smile: Maybe you want to take a look at some breed specific ideas for breaking up a fight. When I had Staffies and Bull terriers, who “locked on”, I learnt to straddle the dog, grasp it around the neck and push the nose down into the flesh of the other dog, When they loosen their hold to take a breath, you can pull them off.

Seems like she respects you a lot and has really taken to heart your previous interventions, if she went for 18 months without a problem. Maybe you need to look at reducing the risks for her now. Make sure she’s excercised EVERY day, figure out how you can avoid the trigger situations with the other dogs.Get the “spoiling” stopped…
Some dogs just don’t suit living with other dogs.

Also… “catch her when she’s good”… monitor her play with the other dogs closely, and give her lots of praise and reward when she plays appropriately, and responds appropriately to the other dog’s “bad” behaviour.

Good luck!