The US has been reluctant to sell Taiwan the AEGIS because:
The Taiwan navy is incapible of maintaining them.
Security concerns. The US is afraid some of the systems might end up in China.
In WWII, Chiang Kai-Shek wanted the KMT army to have American heavy tanks. Why? Because the British were getting them and China had to be equal to the UK. Big problems, there were virtually no bridges in China capable of supporting the tanks nor were there enough trained mechanics to maintain them. As it was, the Chinese couldn’t even maintain the trucks used on the Stillwell Road. And things have not changed much.
As it is, Taiwan’s military can’t even maintain it’s Humvees!
"Around 15 percent to 17 percent of the army’s US-made Humvees have developed serious starter-motor problems in recent years due to human errors, the military said in a recent publication.
Around half of these malfunctioning vehicles are still unusable, while the rest have been repaired and are back in operation, the army said.
The number of Humvees suffering from the problem may approach 1,000, but the army did not provide a figure in the September issue of its logistics journal, which is published every six months. The journal is posted on the Ministry of National Defense’s (MND) Web site for public viewing.
The army identifies in the publication the major cause of the problem as human error on the part of drivers and mechanics.
Those who use the vehicle are mainly conscripts who have driving or car-repair experience prior to serving in the military.
These conscripts, most of whom do not have a strong educational background, are not in the habit of consulting technical manuals for vehicle operations."
Sorry, I thought scaremongering was what this thread was all about. Here is a scary story for you.
I remember, a few years back, a firing exercise. It was a joint naval forces, American and Japanese. The unusual thing about it was that they were shooting a dilapidated super tanker that was going into the scrap yards. They had never used a target so big before. There was a small fleet of ships that fired everything they had at it. It just wouldn’t sink. Harpoons, ANRAAMs, ASROCS, 5 inch 54’S by the hundreds. Two days they went at it. They bombed it, shot it, torpedoed it and anything else they could throw at it. Finally, we were sent to board the vessel and open all it’s water tight doors. We then placed a little bit of assistance in the right places. The Japanese put a few torpedoes into it and it still took over six hours for it to become a reef.
My point is that amphibious forces are basically any forces you can put into, or on a boat or a ship. Amphibious vessels are those that carry amphibious forces. China threw over 1 million troops into Korea during the war, in one assault. They wrote them off before the shooting even started. How many would they send to reclaim Taiwan?
How many would they be willing to lose?
Here’s a funny story but should cause some concerns:
A friend of mine served in Jinmen during his military service. One time he was assigned to a post that was supposedly top-secret; only few were told about the place. Or so he thought. The next day at noon, vendors on pushing carts started showing up to sell him and his partner guard soft drinks and baoze. I guess Jinmen is not a big place to begin with. But the fact that even small pushing cart vendors know when, how many and where those supposedly “top-secret” locations are doesn’t really comfort me… I wonder how much the Red Chinese know…
Given that you could almost throw a stone from Xiamen across to Jinmen there probably isn’t much the Chinese don’t know. You could stand on the beach with a pair of binoculars and see an awful lot of things. At low tide fishermen can actually walk out about half the distance to Xiao Jinmen island.
I can’t see what possible motive the Chinese would have for starting a war in Jinmen. Xiamen is a very prosperous, modern city and depends greatly on Taiwanese investment. The people building new units on the shore line directly across from Xiamen obviously don’t seem too worried about the possibility of a few Taiwanese shells flying over.
[quote]the US has been reluctant to sell Taiwan the AEGIS because:
The Taiwan navy is incapible of maintaining them.
Security concerns. the US is afraid some of the systems might end up in China.
[/quote]
The theory that the weapons systems sold to Taiwan would one day end up in the hands of the Chinese (and be used against the US) is predicated on the fear that Taiwan and China will unify. Were this the case then under what scenario (other than Taiwan
China might also get the weapons because somebody in the Taiwan military crossed over to the other side. This sort of thing HAS happened recently, I believe.
Hmm…I don’t remember the exact numbers but I believe it was closer to 100,000. The big difference is that they can simply walk into korea by land. Also i’m sure the south koreans back then, even with the help of americans, are not as prepared as Taiwan is today.
One wonders how large a fifth column China already has in place in Taiwan. Perhaps in the tens of thousands, possibly even higher – all primed and ready for action whenever the order is given. Taiwan’s government knows that their number is huge, that they’ve blended in with the local population, and have infiltrated all areas of society, including government and the military. They probably constitute a bigger threat to Taiwan than any number of those missiles.
I think 4,000,000 may be the total number of troops involved, including the North’s. 1,000,000 was the number estimated by the American side when they found themselves surrounded close to the Chinese boarder. The 100,000 estimate probably came out of one of the local school’s history books.
My point with the Supertanker was that China could very easily confiscate hundreds of such vessels and many smaller ones to use. The sheer number of troops and vessels involved in an operation that size means that Taiwan would run out of ammo before the Chinese ran out of Targets.
[quote=“EOD”]I think 4,000,000 may be the total number of troops involved, including the North’s. 1,000,000 was the number estimated by the American side when they found themselves surrounded close to the Chinese boarder. The 100,000 estimate probably came out of one of the local school’s history books.
My point with the Supertanker was that China could very easily confiscate hundreds of such vessels and many smaller ones to use. The sheer number of troops and vessels involved in an operation that size means that Taiwan would run out of ammo before the Chinese ran out of Targets.[/quote]
True. The essay in question came from a PLA handbook. And as we all know (SARS, anyone?), the PRC plays real loose with their figures.
Throught the 1950’s the PLA invaded and occupied ROC islands up and down the China coast. When they launched their amphibious assault of Jinmen back in 1958, the primary invasion craft was the humble fishing boat. I doubt it would much different today.
[b]China has a large merchant fleet, with an enormous capacity for personnel and cargo. Its fifty naval amphibious ships and between two hundred and 350 landing craft, however, would be utterly unable to carry the entire combined-arms force. It would be logical to devote military amphibious vessels exclusively to heavy weapons like tanks and artillery rather than personnel; in any case, bow ramps are just about the only way to get this bulky hardware ashore in an assault. If the amphibious ships were devoted entirely to tanks and the landing craft to artillery, more than 250 tanks and almost seven hundred pieces could be put ashore in one wave. This is not impressive for a landing force that could number over a hundred divisions
Read Macarthur’s memoirs. He was there!
I would not take any source associated with the ROC to be any more reliable than one associated with the PRC. Genrals are usually meticlous when it comes to numbers. For a PRC genral to claim more troops under him than was fact. He would be taking face from another genral. A taboo in any army.
I was reading stuff about the Korean War, and came across multiple sources (from US) that says Truman was “skeptic” about confronting the Chinese and was fighting not to win but basically to lose or at most a stalemate. He basically gave north korea to the commies. McArther was harcore and wanted to kick some commie ass, but was screwed by Truman. Truman also moved the 7th fleet into the Taiwan Strait not to prevent mainland from attacking Taiwan like most people thought, but to actually prevent Chiang KS from 1) attacking china 2) sending troops to korea. This is pretty interesting, apparently this move allowed Red China to send all their troops in the south (for defending against a CKS attack) into North korea, resulting in the death of thousands of americans. If that is the case Truman is a pu$$y and an a$$-hole. He screwed Taiwan, he screwed korea, and he screwed American soldiers. With Mcarthur in charge things would’ve been very different. Does anyone know the details?
McArthur threatened to use neuclear weapons against red China. Wasn’t that the reason Truman made McArthur eat his own words and stand down on the treat? Interesting…
