If don't speak Chinese but want to live in Taiwan

[RockOn]

@OrangeOrganics

Hmmmmmmm, difference of opinion then. Learning the local language makes one self-sufficient.[b][u] I don’t have much respect for people who are not self-sufficient

I a dont have much respect for the English teacher who drags his co-teacher with him to set up a new phone contract, after living in Taiwan for 6 years.
[/u][/b]

Well, I guess you don’t have any respect for 99.9999999999% of all the foreigners living and working in Taiwan. Just because you imagine yourself to be fluent in reading traditional Chinese characters and have a complete grasp of what you read (as implied by your assertion that poor helpless Westerners can’t even enter into a legal contract without the help of their co-teachers), it doesn’t mean you are.

In any Western country when entering into a legal contract everyday, common people (who have a fairly good understanding of the English language) choose to obtain the expertise of a lawyer to make sure they don’t get screwed by entering into that contract. In the same way, when I want a new phone contract I can go into a store and muddle my way through the whole process and walk out with a new phone contract, but at what price? Not being able to read traditional Chinese characters, in which the contract would normally be written, seems to pose the biggest problem. I would “drag” my co-teacher along so she can make sure (like a lawyer in the West) that I don’t get screwed. Fortunately for you, you have a perfect understanding of Chinese characters, but you would be one of only a few foreigners in the entire Taiwan who does.

And BTW, those co-teachers get paid to help foreigners at their schools or businesses because even locals know that learning Chinese characters takes a goddamn lifetime.

I guess you think you’re pretty special. But that doesn’t mean I have to respect you or your condescending attitude.

[OrangeOrganics]

[quote=“RockOn”][quote=“OrangeOrganics”]
Hmmmmmmm, difference of opinion then. Learning the local language makes one self-sufficient.[b][u] I don’t have much respect for people who are not self-sufficient

I a dont have much respect for the English teacher who drags his co-teacher with him to set up a new phone contract, after living in Taiwan for 6 years.
[/u][/b]
[/quote]

Well, I guess you don’t have any respect for 99.9999999999% of all the foreigners living and working in Taiwan. Just because you imagine yourself to be fluent in reading traditional Chinese characters and have a complete grasp of what you read (as implied by your assertion that poor helpless Westerners can’t even enter into a legal contract without the help of their co-teachers), it doesn’t mean you are.

In any Western country when entering into a legal contract everyday, common people (who have a fairly good understanding of the English language) choose to obtain the expertise of a lawyer to make sure they don’t get screwed by entering into that contract. In the same way, when I want a new phone contract I can go into a store and muddle my way through the whole process and walk out with a new phone contract, but at what price? Not being able to read traditional Chinese characters, in which the contract would normally be written, seems to pose the biggest problem. I would “drag” my co-teacher along so she can make sure (like a lawyer in the West) that I don’t get screwed. Fortunately for you, you have a perfect understanding of Chinese characters, but you would be one of only a few foreigners in the entire Taiwan who does.

And BTW, those co-teachers get paid to help foreigners at their schools or businesses because even locals know that learning Chinese characters takes a goddamn lifetime.

I guess you think you’re pretty special. But that doesn’t mean I have to respect you or your condescending attitude.[/quote]

If someone only plans to live in the country for a few years or has only been in Taiwan for a few years, I totally understand why they wouldnt be able to discuss a phone contract. It is probably not worth the effort of learning Chinese if you only plan to be in Taiwan for 1-3 years.

In my mind, someone who has lived in Taiwan for 6 years upwards, should be able to perform basic tasks.

If you find that condescending, I am sorry but I think most Taiwanese I know would basically agree.

Can’t believe I am being shot down for saying that if you plan to live in a country for a long time, you should make an effort to learn the language. :neutral:

Also loads of foreigners speak decent Chinese in Taiwan, or can at least do the basics.

[Ermintrude]

You’re not being shot down: there are just other reasons for this, not just laziness or disrespect. fwiw, I speak and read Chinese and have been learning for a long time, although not exactly intensively. My Chinese pronunciation is not that great, my vocab is small and my reading and writing slow. It could be better and I’d love to be as good as, say, Hokwongwei, but I also built a career, took care of my family, travelled and wrote a lot of stuff at the same time. I am absolutely self-sufficient in that I’ve moved to several different countries with no language skills and taken care of myself. I can outsource what I can’t personally deal with.

[OrangeOrganics]

@Ermintrude

You’re not being shot down: there are just other reasons for this, not just laziness or disrespect. fwiw, I speak and read Chinese and have been learning for a long time, although not exactly intensively. My Chinese pronunciation is not that great, my vocab is small and my reading and writing slow. It could be better and I’d love to be as good as, say, Hokwongwei, but I also built a career, took care of my family, travelled and wrote a lot of stuff at the same time. I am absolutely self-sufficient in that I’ve moved to several different countries with no language skills and taken care of myself. I can outsource what I can’t personally deal with.

Fair enough. I am far from perfect and hardly have time anymore to study. If my company sent me to say Japan, now for two years, I dont think I would spend the time learning the language. At the same time, I find it hard to believe that an English teacher living in Taiwan for 6 years couldnt have found the time to get to the level of proficiency needed to cover the basics.

More to the point, learning Chinese will enrich your life and career prospects in Taiwan in nearly every way

[Hokwongwei]

@RockOn

I would “drag” my co-teacher along so she can make sure (like a lawyer in the West) that I don’t get screwed. Fortunately for you, you have a perfect understanding of Chinese characters, but you would be one of only a few foreigners in the entire Taiwan who does.

Both of you need to expand your horizons. Plenty of foreigners read enough Chinese to sign a phone contract. If you don’t know them, it sounds like you have a limited group of friends.

Meanwhile, while I am also critical of people who choose not to learn Chinese, for some it is not really a choice. If you work like horse to make a living and move ahead and enjoy your lifestyle, then only being able to bark commands to a taximan is your prerogative. Sure you miss out on a lot of cultural things that you can only get by speaking the language, but for some people it’s not that important, and I respect that.

Judge people in the context of their specific circumstances. (or not at all!)

[OrangeOrganics]

@Hokwongwei

[quote=“RockOn”]I would “drag” my co-teacher along so she can make sure (like a lawyer in the West) that I don’t get screwed. Fortunately for you, you have a perfect understanding of Chinese characters, but you would be one of only a few foreigners in the entire Taiwan who does.

Both of you need to expand your horizons. Plenty of foreigners read enough Chinese to sign a phone contract. If you don’t know them, it sounds like you have a limited group of friends.

Meanwhile, while I am also critical of people who choose not to learn Chinese, for some it is not really a choice. If you work like horse to make a living and move ahead and enjoy your lifestyle, then only being able to bark commands to a taximan is your prerogative. Sure you miss out on a lot of cultural things that you can only get by speaking the language, but for some people it’s not that important, and I respect that.

Judge people in the context of their specific circumstances. (or not at all!)[/quote]

I agree, I know some engineers sent over who work 12 hours a day and it would be hard for them to find the time to learn the language. They dont really need to either.