If not Taidong, then where?

40 hours teaching probably would be more draining but I’ve never met anyone who’s worked that many. 30 is about the top, 25 is more normal, isn’t it?

Yes, most jobs seem to be around 20 - 25. I believe the legal limit is around 30 as you said, but working the average 20 - 25 doesn’t leave much money wise once you pay the rent, food and everything. Yes you can save money but you aren’t really building anything. I guess it really depends on what people want from Taiwan. Everyone is different, I’m told that is a good thing :wink:

creztor: Indeed, I don’t think there’s a long term future for me here outside of owning my own business. That’s probably the only way. Hence, by the end of this year, I will either be employing other people or leaving Taiwan. Simple as that. If I end up going somewhere else (such as Brunei or the Persian Gulf or many international schools), I’ll end up on a much better package, aside from better money, I’d be getting accommodation, a relocation allowance, airfares, better holidays, subsidised education for children at local international schools, and so on.

I live a fairly frugal lifestyle and get by on 30,000NT/month. That’s with a wife. Plenty of people would spend that by themselves, especially in Taipei. Throw in some kids and the average English teacher would not be saving and, would not have any kind of retirement option, which is the really important thing since I’m in my 30s.

When I first came to Taiwan, I did Hess’ kindy/buxiban contract, which was 30.5-32.5 teaching hours.

Compared to being a teacher in Australia, I found it much harder. Being a teacher in Australia, there was probably about the same paperwork, but as a real teacher, you’re salaried (and that pay does increase much better than here), get paid holidays and sick leave, there’s better room for advancement and you get superannuation. I found it equally as stressful in different ways. In Australia, the kids were often the cause of stress, but the other staff were generally highly supportive. There was a fair bit of meaningless in the experience, though I don’t think the underlying curriculum was the problem, which I think is the case with how English is taught here. At Hess, the management were the problem. Specifically, the foreign supervisors were the problem as they were used as the headkickers. Physically, it was also draining because it was so much more intense than teaching in Australia. Basically, with the Hess method, there’s absolutely no down time – you’re always talking, and you’re always standing and moving about. It’s much more physically demanding. I don’t know how overweight people or old people do it, to be honest. It wore me down rapidly, as did all the negativity and lack of support from above.

I was then working at a junior high school, which was initially a lot slacker than Hess, but became steadily less slack (though still fairly slack). Still, there was no room for advancement (and our contract completion bonuses were in part assessed by our co-teachers, many of whom were first year teachers!), few extra benefits (though holidays, typhoon days, national holidays, etc. were paid), the holidays were a fraction of those in Australia (which is an important point because when the year is punctuated by four lots of holidays, you do get time to recharge), the sick leave was still only three days per semester (and you’d lose your attendance bonus) and the annual pay increases were pathetic (something like 3,000NT/month after the first year, only 1,500NT/month after the second and subsequent years), and so on. It wasn’t a physically demanding job like Hess, but it was still a road to nowhere. We weren’t in any way regarded as professional teachers. Inflation was going to outstrip my salary, if nothing else!

By the way, I know two people in Taiwan who work, or have worked for a long time (though not currently) 40+ hours/week. In both cases, they’re absolute freaks for being able to handle it.

I know someone who taught 42 hrs/wk for three months.

[quote=“cfimages”][quote=“GuyInTaiwan”]

It’s just that it’s extremely easy for work to end up taking up a huge amount of one’s life and end up being a very, very draining experience.[/quote]

I think that applies to pretty much every field in every country, doesn’t it?

I’m not sure that 20-25 hours a week teaching really counts as being time consuming. I know that I work more hours (for less money) now than I ever did when I was teaching.[/quote]

Really? I only work 35 hours a week in an office. It’s a right lark. Having always taught English, I never knew life could be so simple and untaxing.

24 contact hours is the industry standard, which allows for prep of about 12 hours and 1 1/2 of meeting time. If you are doing it right, that’s a fairly substantial workload.

sandman, it may seem extreme to you, but as someone who has taught elsewhere and has many friends teaching internationally, Taiwan is a famously poor environment for teaching. GiT probably is burned out, but that’s not to say he isn’t correct. Low pay, no benefits, venal schools, hassle with legal stuff/immigration procedures, little chance for professional development, so that if you move on from Taiwan there’s a huge hole in your CV unless you’re lucky, ‘difficult’ students, poor standards of admin and just generally low awareness of how EFL works. It’s ONLY a place to come if you like Taiwan and are interested in travelling here for other reasons.

Teaching in Taiwan ruined teaching for me. I have less than zero interest in it, and I used to love it.

[quote=“Buttercup”][quote=“cfimages”][quote=“GuyInTaiwan”]

It’s just that it’s extremely easy for work to end up taking up a huge amount of one’s life and end up being a very, very draining experience.[/quote]

I think that applies to pretty much every field in every country, doesn’t it?

I’m not sure that 20-25 hours a week teaching really counts as being time consuming. I know that I work more hours (for less money) now than I ever did when I was teaching.[/quote]

Really? I only work 35 hours a week in an office. It’s a right lark. Having always taught English, I never knew life could be so simple and untaxing.

24 contact hours is the industry standard, which allows for prep of about 12 hours and 1 1/2 of meeting time. If you are doing it right, that’s a fairly substantial workload.

sandman, it may seem extreme to you, but as someone who has taught elsewhere and has many friends teaching internationally, Taiwan is a famously poor environment for teaching. GiT probably is burned out, but that’s not to say he isn’t correct. Low pay, no benefits, venal schools, hassle with legal stuff/immigration procedures, little chance for professional development, so that if you move on from Taiwan there’s a huge hole in your CV unless you’re lucky, ‘difficult’ students, poor standards of admin and just generally low awareness of how EFL works. It’s ONLY a place to come if you like Taiwan and are interested in travelling here for other reasons.

Teaching in Taiwan ruined teaching for me. I have less than zero interest in it, and I used to love it.[/quote]

What nonsense! Forumosa’s merry ranks are overflowing with single young ESL hotshots who are on career fast tracks. SLAP!! Sorry, a moment of weakness brought on by the unseasonal hot weather. The great majority of posting here is done by men aged 30-50 who are married to local lassies. It is quite a striking statistic, and speaks volumes for the work situation here.

Have you been drinking water again?

I also agree with GuyInTaiwan. I highly recommend anyone who is serious about teaching to stay away from cram schools.

I’ve been thinking about this recently…

I have succeeded in what I came here to do. What’s next? I’m thinking grad. school in Taipei. But, it seems I’m just temporarily dodging the inevitable – that is, choosing between accepting a dead-end job in Taiwan or going home and doing work that will take me somewhere (a career). I’m holding out that I’ll find a way to make a career in Taiwan.

I am right inline behind you :slight_smile: I am pretty much in the same boat.

Advice from grandma: boats suck balls. Just swim where you want to go. And don’t count on using the bridge - some wummin set fire to it.

If this is a pissing contest over who has ever taught the longest hours I’m gonna win. Not any more though and never again :discodance:

That actually makes a lot of sense.