"I'm South African." "Sorry, we only hire native speakers."

IF only the TAiwanese would get serious bout learning english. Oops hold it right there, cuz we know they aint. :smiley:

I guess it was time for another I’m ABC/male/black/old/tattooed/saffer/british/fat/etc and I’m being discriminated against threads. It sucks but shouldn’t exactly be a newsflash that a majority of people running buxibans are complete morons. Keep at it. There is a better job out there.

I do think that the native speaker comment is hilarious and further reinforces my point.

I don’t know about that. Most of the people running buxibans could gave a rat’s ass who is in the classroom. Many of the parents paying the bills though…they can be a different matter entirely.

So you’re going to suggest that every “native speaker” should be able to show that they’ve done an international test such as IELTS? Surely if a native speaker turned up to one of those exams, the examiners would think they were taking the piss. I doubt it would make any difference anyway though. It’s not about whether you are a native speaker or not.

The simple fact of the matter is that the buxiban industry is full of morons, as others have pointed out. The whole thing is both inane and insane. What can you say though? Things are better in the public school system in terms of less discrimination, but there’s still plenty of inanity and insanity. It’s the nature of English education in Taiwan.

Indeed. I think that superking nailed it in the first reply to your post. You spoke to an idiot. It happens in all walks of life but, as GIT points out, waaaaay more often in the buxiban scene.

OTOH, at least in the area I live South Africans are very popular employees for the reasons you give OP. They have a good work ethic and are reliable (plus the ones over here are usually white and can be fobbed off to the punters as Americans :smiley: ).

If they were serious they would be hiring Indians and Philippines nationals as well to come and teach here. China has put on a big drive to hire Indians to teach English.

I don’t know about that. Most of the people running buxibans could gave a rat’s ass who is in the classroom. Many of the parents paying the bills though…they can be a different matter entirely.[/quote]

Those running buxibans definitely care about who is in the classroom. The important thing is that they fit the image of what parents want to see. Ability is optional.

I don’t know about that. Most of the people running buxibans could gave a rat’s ass who is in the classroom. Many of the parents paying the bills though…they can be a different matter entirely.[/quote]

Those running buxibans definitely care about who is in the classroom. The important thing is that they fit the image of what parents want to see. Ability is optional.[/quote]
That’s pretty much what I meant there. :thumbsup:

So you’re going to suggest that every “native speaker” should be able to show that they’ve done an international test such as IELTS? Surely if a native speaker turned up to one of those exams, the examiners would think they were taking the piss. I doubt it would make any difference anyway though. It’s not about whether you are a native speaker or not.

The simple fact of the matter is that the buxiban industry is full of morons, as others have pointed out. The whole thing is both inane and insane. What can you say though? Things are better in the public school system in terms of less discrimination, but there’s still plenty of inanity and insanity. It’s the nature of English education in Taiwan.[/quote]

I wouldn’t make it as extreme. But some kind of baseline assessment shout be administered to applicants. It would make sure that all passport holders of the approved countries are given an equal chance, and eliminates any doubt as to their English ability in term of teaching EFL or ESL.

But you’re right that the buxibahn industry isn’t well managed. I don’t doubt that at all. I hope to move on to establishments and learning institutions that requires more from their employees and actually plan long-term ahead, there is more of a structure, etc. Buxibahn’s ain’t it.

I only have about 13-15 hours a week now, and I live in Tianmu. To quote a US political party’s moniker - the rent’s too damn high! Any suggestions for this area? I’m fine with traveling, too. Like catching up with my reading/Chinese.

The trouble with that is that if you don’t go the whole hog and get an international test done, then who is going to assess it, and how will you guarantee any kind of standards? Frankly, I’d me more than a little uneasy about having a Taiwanese person assess my English in an interview for the simple reason that I’ve seen the tests they give to the students. I also deal with people on a daily basis who are real, certified English teachers and both their written and spoken English is appalling. The largest problem in the EFL industry in this country is that it’s the blind leading the blind, but no one will admit that they’re blind. Maybe they don’t think they have 20-20 vision (though plenty do), but they certainly think they just need to wear contact lenses, but they’re basically okay.

I can tell you that the government system ain’t it either. Any successes here are largely isolated and due to an accidental confluence of factors and people in very localised situations. Things are certainly better than in the buxiban system, but it’s all very slap dash too. I’ve spewed massive amounts of vitriol on this website (I’ve actually toned down from a few years ago) about how lazy, disorganised and incompetent so many people are in this system, from the top to the bottom. I, and others, are trying to change things, but it’s mindbogglingly frustrating at times. To be honest, I think when you say plan long-term ahead, you’d better be ready to fight a battle that is going to take probably at least a decade, if not two, before people wake up here, though I think there will be remnants from the present system present long after that. Otherwise, the only way forward or up is out.

One rarely meets a butt-hurt safrican here. It’s just one Safrican blaming his safricaness for not getting a job.

The op wrote [quote]They simply wanted to know what my nationality was. I asked them if what they really mean is that they don’t hire South Africans, the lady giggled nervously and I said it’s their loss and hung up.[/quote]

What’s wrong with an employer who is only allowed to hire people from approved countries asking what nationality you are?

edit: I see, the title of the thread contains the missing information. You spoke to an idiot. Who would want to work for ‘Uncle Jason’s English School’ anyway? Have some self respect man![/quote]

I assure you my butt is pain-free and my self-respect is fine, too.

I’ve been working in Taiwan for 4 years while studying. Right now, I want to clock in as many hours as possible, perhaps to the point of actual butthurt, for about a year, and then I plan on leaving Taiwan and its ineffectual educational system behind. If I come across sounding uppity or elevated or something - sorry, not my intention. Maybe I’ve been working too hard and not leaving Taiwan enough during the past few years and am just fed up with everything.

You make good points. Hard to argue with any of them.

I have little hope for the government system, as well. You have to admit the 2-month long vacations offer plenty of time to get over all of that mind-boggling frustration (should you be lucky enough to land a job like that in the public system).

Are you employed at a public school? You sound like you should be working for an international school.

DrKeith: I work at a government school. I’ve heard mixed things about international schools too though (such as rich parents leaning on the administration to make exceptions for their lazy kids), but even so, I live way out in the countryside in Taidong County. I really like where I live, and I don’t think I could go back to living in a big city. I accept that there aren’t great employment opportunities for me here, though I’m eventually going to get out of teaching. (No, seriously, I have a lot of money invested on the side and live frugally, so I’m always adding to it.)

When I first got here someone told me of a French Canadian friend applying for a French teacher post (I think in a public school) and being told “Sorry, you are Canadian. We can only accept native French speakers. But we have another vacancy for an English teacher”

According to my informant, thier friends English was very limited, but they worked through the text before each lesson and got through the classes OK.

“Friend of a friend” story, so I can’t vouch for it, but I’d say it could easily be true in Taiwan, and if it isn’t, it should be.

[quote=“GuyInTaiwan”]The largest problem in the EFL industry in this country is that it’s the blind leading the blind, but no one will admit that they’re blind. Maybe they don’t think they have 20-20 vision (though plenty do), but they certainly think they just need to wear contact lenses, but they’re basically okay.
[/quote]

It’s not just in EFL but in other industries as well. The OP should take his licks and apply elsewhere.

ABCs have it worse than the Saffers, believe it or not. This rejection ain’t nuthin’.

I am and have been applying elsewhere. This marks my first experience as being dismissed on something that I thought was a legitimate credential.

I’m sure ABCs and people who aren’t white, yet carry the approved passport, have it worse. But then again, this isn’t a competition of woe-is-me, is it?

Looks like it could be. :laughing: :laughing:

[quote=“DrKeith”]I am and have been applying elsewhere. This marks my first experience as being dismissed on something that I thought was a legitimate credential.

I’m sure ABCs and people who aren’t white, yet carry the approved passport, have it worse. But then again, this isn’t a competition of woe-is-me, is it?[/quote]

I can’t understand why you are hung up on this. Move on.

It’s safe to say that I am moving on. I’m more than willing to show Uncle Jason’s School the finger (if only in response to their finger) and move on. Was curious about the experience of others and the changing dynamics in the English teecha job market.

.

[quote=“Ducked”]When I first got here someone told me of a French Canadian friend applying for a French teacher post (I think in a public school) and being told “Sorry, you are Canadian. We can only accept native French speakers. But we have another vacancy for an English teacher”

According to my informant, their friends English was very limited, but they worked through the text before each lesson and got through the classes OK.

“Friend of a friend” story, so I can’t vouch for it, but I’d say it could easily be true in Taiwan, and if it isn’t, it should be.[/quote]
I worked with a French Canadian guy for a year in Tainan about five years ago. Before classes I had to explain things like Simple Present Tense and the meanings of words like “allow”. At the same school we had a bloke who taught all day kindy. Sure enough, he had a US Passport, but he only lived there a few years (with his family) and originally came from Morocco (where he was born, raised and educated). At the same school/company we have several Saffas of which I am one of only three English Saffas (well, was, as I’m not a Saffa anymore … technically), the rest all being Afrikaners. Of those Afrikaners only about two speak decent English and the rest make frequent grammar errors with the typical “I are Sef Efriken, I isn’t bleck.” accent. The real travesty, apart from the obvious infliction of Eengleesh unleashed on the kids, is that these guys get paid the usual NT$600/hour whereas the Taiwanese teachers, even the ones with awesome English, get around NT$350/hour. :idunno:

I’ve only had three experiences, personally, with being a Saffa in the “interesting” Taiwanese EFL/ESL [strike]circus[/strike] marketplace.

  1. Sorry, we only hire North Americans. (Schoolhouse)
  2. May I ask, are you black or white? (They weren’t interest in black people of any nationality.)
  3. After I told the owner I was a Saffa, just so he knew, “Yes! I saw on your resume. I only hire South Africans, because they work hard, don’t complain and do what they’re told.” :astonished: