To be fair, it’s mostly lighthearted ribbing. Like they can’t for the life of them understand why I go through so much hassle when I could save a lot of time just riding a scooter every day. This is in Kaohsiung, so it’s not quite as convenient to get around as in Taipei. But it’s convenient enough.
1 Like
What punishment is going to affect a guy with that much money? Even if he killed someone he’ll.pull out a few mill nt which is pocket change.
And the very off chance he gets caught by a cop the $600nt fine is the cost of doing business
I always notice the cops tend to snag scooters a lot more. I cant remember the last time I saw an illegal action driver of a rich car caught and punished
1 Like
There exactly it. They see the fines as pocket change. Taiwan doesnt have a penalty points system.
1 Like
losing the liscense would be a good start but yeah, the whole driving culture needs to change. taiwanese are considerate of others when serving you in 7 11 and when using the MRT why does driving need to be so different?
this kind of attitude surprised me too. i told a local that taiwan has a bad image because of the nasty scooters, pollution and ugly buildings. she was shocked as riding scooters are ‘so convenient’ outside of taipei i can give it a pass but in taipei theres no need for it.
1 Like
I think a lot has to do with the fact that you can’t see the other person directly. The driver is in a bubble where he can be exceptionally rude.and nobody can call them out on it
1 Like
for sure, especially when half the cars here have tinted windows.
Scooter riders behave badly by driving quickly from the scene. Same idea as the tinted windows. Ignore others, don’t face them.
A lot of locals are very passive though…Even when vehicles almost hit them or their kids.
1 Like
What punishment? Jail time! for murder.
1 Like
Maybe I can partially explain this. There’s a divide between my wife and myself when an idiot driver almost mows us down at a crosswalk. She’s passive, because she has it in her mind that every driver is a potential gangster who will jump out of the car and beat me up if we make a fuss. So she gets angry when I resort to my default, which is to give a dirty stare, shake my fist and yell something. I think she’s overreacting of course, and these dangerous fuckwits need someone to call them out. But she’s my wife, so I can’t argue too much.
1 Like
One time riding a bike down Guangfu rd I had a guy in a van overtake me and then immediately pull over. Not so close that I couldn’t stop in time, but I wasn’t impressed.
Two experiences that to me kind of sum up driving in Taiwan: one time taking a ride with a family in Hualien, and when I went to put my seatbelt on they more or less told me not to. I was thinking maybe it implied I was critical of the driver’s driving skill (and that I was… going through the hilly country roads he often managed to swerve into the other lanes)
Another time I took a taxi between cities with some friends and our taxi driver was the less skilled, Taiwanese cousin of Michael Schumacher; weaving through traffic at 120km/h whilst playing with his ipad, and at one point he even had a piece of paper on the dashboard that he was trying to write on.
I like how the OP has already established the “lingering thirldwordism” (ugh) as a fact and now only asks about the “worst part”. Cute. Let me try: “Is endless bitching about your country of residence the worst part of expat mentality?”.
See what I did there? 
About the traffic: I worked as a bike courier in London for about 10 years. I don’t have many areas of expertise on my CV, but “traffic” is undeniably one of them. I cycle everyday here too and during my first couple of months I was also terrified about the TW version, but with time realised it’s not at all worse than the European one - perhaps “as bad” in some aspects and actually better in others.
Some things to consider:
-the amount of scooters and their movement patterns makes it look like it’s much more chaotic compared to more car-dominated traffc elsewhere
-the TW TV’s obsession with using headcam/smartphone accident coverage as news makes it look like there’s nothing but carnage on the streets everyday. But these are mostly sideswipes and such anyway - if eg, UK’s TV was to follow suit you’d have an endless horror show of M5 pile ups, splattered bikers and lorry-crushed cyclists.
-assholes zooming through zebras with pedestrians on them are evil, but this is in no way exclusive to TW. I see it everywhere, it just depends on laws per country and what ppl think they can get away with. In UK cyclists do high speed mounts of pavements/zebras on red all the time, cars will left turn on cyclists all the time (and do all other kind of nasty $hit) and so on. In countries where it’s allowed for traffic to left/right turn through zebras (eg Poland) motorists will totally abuse it and will run you over no problem if you get in the way.
-lack of pavements was a big shock for me at the beginning but I did got over it and now just feel fine safety wise. That’s because of the next point which is:
-Taiwanese people live with this system, they create it and if you watch it closely they are fine with it. Also, there’s very little aggro involved here, especially compared the laxity of rules here and the stricter one in Europe. Life in traffic in London is a constant warfare and stream of road rage accidents between all tribes, here I see it only occasionally. During over one year here I could count the incidents when I had to flip somebody off on one hand, whereas in LDN it’d be almost daily. This is the plus-side of riding around here.
-I like to recall my Vietnamese friends here who employ a heavy eyeroll when somebody complains about traffic in TW. I guess Italians, Thai and few other nations withe real horror traffic would too.
-There’s an underlying method in what seems to you as chaos, if you study it and go with the flow of it, you’ll be fine - go against the grain and you’ll have a bad time. Don’t get mad - adapt.
-one really BAD thing is the scooter pollution. That’s more of a socio-economical problem though.
So, yeah, any claims on how traffic here is some sort of imaginary proof of this country’s underdevelopment are either an exercise in bias confirmation or stem from lack of experience comparing it to other places.
PS: same goes for the “dogs” issue. If you think abandoning them is exclusive to TW then you have another think coming, similarly with the breeding: I recommend reading more about stuff like Crufts, British Bulldogs and so on.
3 Likes
Perhaps OP could’ve worded the header better, but it sounds like you’re trying to be a “white knight” for Taiwan. I’ve yet to meet a single person here who is proud of the roads. My Taiwanese wife HATES the rude drivers who almost plow her over when she crosses the street with our daughter. My uni students rage in their essays against the epidemic of drunk drivers here who are held to little account. Taiwan has many things going for it, and I would never call it “third world.” But just because some countries like Vietnam have even worse roads and traffic systems, that doesn’t excuse Taiwan’s shortcomings. The only people who seem to like the roads here are contrarian expats. I don’t know any native Taiwanese who think the roads are okay. Totally ridiculous set of arguments you put out there.
8 Likes
absolutely, the roads do not need defending. yea there are good points. you can have a lot of freedom and drive around like an asshole and get away with it, but i would trade that in for my life not being on the line everytime i step outside.
2 Likes
Furthermore although the lack of antagonism is nice, most incidents are caused by a pure lack of skills or stupidity. And I imagine the rates of fatalities and injuries would be well above that of just about any advanced nation.
2 Likes
Have kids here and it becomes a REALLY big issue. My kids and my wife have almost been hit a couple of times by people speeding through lights.
A.few months ago some asshole almost took out my entire family, he just went straight though two lights at about 100k an hour.
How about my son crossing the main road to go to elementary school ?
It’s a big problem. This just doesn’t happen in Europe as a regular occurrence.
That’s before we talk about the right turns through pedestrians, driving on placements , parking on pavements, not using indicators…
Comparing Taiwan to Vietnam is a total joke…Vietnam is a 'third world ’ nightmare where there’s no way to safely cross a lot of roads…You literally have to walk in between lanes of traffic.
4 Likes
Actually the dogs issue is a really big problem in Taiwan because a lot of Taiwanese (especially in the countryside ) are unintentionally very cruel keeping them chained up their entire lives.
They have no empathy for the dogs seeing them as guard dogs and don’t even let them run around the yards. I have had countless arguments with my in laws about this , it’s a very sore point with me and I am not even involved with any stray dog associations or all that stuff. My family are from a farming background and we never kept dogs chained up like that. Also, supposedly they didn’t do this until the last couple of decades as roads got busier and neighbours poison the dogs if they go into vegetable patches.
3 Likes
it’s involuntary manslaughter, not murder. Though, Jail time! for the manslaughter.
In this case, if using NZ law (not sure the laws are same here in Taiwan), I hope he spends time in prison but skeptical this will happen with the car driver’s family being well off.
“If someone is injured or killed, the penalties are much heavier. You can be jailed for up to five years if someone is injured, or up to 10 years if someone is killed, or in either case you can be fined up to $20,000. You’ll also be automatically disqualified for at least one year.”
That’s the thing though- a former bike messenger riding daily in Taiwan is probably actually having a pretty fun time a lot of the time, because everybody here drives like a messenger- except the cyclists!
1 Like